17 replies to this topic

[Jelco]

First time poster so go easy on me.

My idea is that LRM's should be changed so that the salvos have a 3sec delay.
So if u put a LRM20 in a slot with 10 tubes it would fire 10 wait 3 secs fire another 10 then start its cooldown.
This would make the number of tubes on the mech an important factor and make boating LRMs impractical.
This would stop boating but not effect balanced builds. So no nerf if you use a reasonable amount of LRMs but you can't boat them.
It would also make the variants more interesting as the number of tubes would make a real difference. i.e. Stalker H would actually have a use due to the 2 sets of 20 tubes.
This would then also open the door the lowering the effectiveness of ECM without becoming LRM online.

Just an idea what do people think.

[Sheraf]

That would promote more balance build, but still I don't like the idea of forcing people to do that. While I like balance mech, I don't think others have to do the same.

[LauLiao]

Since the number of tubes does affect how LRMS are fired (just try firing an LRM 20 from the single tube on the Trebuchet 7M I think it is), you could essentially create the same effect by just increasing LRM recycle time by 3 seconds (not that I'm advocating doing that).

I also think that people are overstating how deadly LRMs are. As an LRM boat, good pilots can dodge my missles all day, and in other mechs, I do the same to LRM boats. You really don't need much cover and you get lots of warning, just duck behind a hill or building real quick and let those missles slam harmlessly into your chosen protection.

[Terror Teddy]

Bad idea.

The way tubes are done right now we have a balance that makes dedicated missile hulls like the cat the few ones that can really put HURT in LRM's,

Quad LRM 20 on a Cat would still go in 4 waves as there arent enought tubes.

LRM 20 on my X5 Cicada would take...time...

[Sheraf]

LauLiao, on 11 March 2013 - 03:23 PM, said:

Since the number of tubes does affect how LRMS are fired (just try firing an LRM 20 from the single tube on the Trebuchet 7M I think it is), you could essentially create the same effect by just increasing LRM recycle time by 3 seconds (not that I'm advocating doing that).

I also think that people are overstating how deadly LRMs are. As an LRM boat, good pilots can dodge my missles all day, and in other mechs, I do the same to LRM boats. You really don't need much cover and you get lots of warning, just duck behind a hill or building real quick and let those missles slam harmlessly into your chosen protection.

You are right. In my stalker 3f, I only have 2 x LRM 10 Artemis, and I just move from cover to cover to deal with pure LRM boat. When I see them shooting at me, I return fire, and still have time to lead their missiles into the cover

[StainlessSR]

Jelco, on 11 March 2013 - 03:03 PM, said:

First time poster so go easy on me.

My idea is that LRM's should be changed so that the salvos have a 3sec delay.
So if u put a LRM20 in a slot with 10 tubes it would fire 10 wait 3 secs fire another 10 then start its cooldown.
This would make the number of tubes on the mech an important factor and make boating LRMs impractical.
This would stop boating but not effect balanced builds. So no nerf if you use a reasonable amount of LRMs but you can't boat them.
It would also make the variants more interesting as the number of tubes would make a real difference. i.e. Stalker H would actually have a use due to the 2 sets of 20 tubes.
This would then also open the door the lowering the effectiveness of ECM without becoming LRM online.

Just an idea what do people think.

That actually is a decent idea as it would make firing take longer so boats would have less of an overpowering effect. This would accually put LRM's back into the SUPPORT ROLE and not as a primary weapon.

LauLiao, on 11 March 2013 - 03:23 PM, said:

Since the number of tubes does affect how LRMS are fired (just try firing an LRM 20 from the single tube on the Trebuchet 7M I think it is), you could essentially create the same effect by just increasing LRM recycle time by 3 seconds (not that I'm advocating doing that).

I also think that people are overstating how deadly LRMs are. As an LRM boat, good pilots can dodge my missles all day, and in other mechs, I do the same to LRM boats. You really don't need much cover and you get lots of warning, just duck behind a hill or building real quick and let those missles slam harmlessly into your chosen protection.

It would not be the same as "just increasing LRM recycle time by 3 seconds" because it would only happen if you were launching more missiles than you had ports for. this would cause the stalker 5m 5xlrm15 mech to take much longer to fire (32 missiles, 3 second delay, 23 missiles (outer launchers start cooldown), 3 second delay, then the rest of the inner launchers missiles, then those inner launchers would start their cooldown (or something comparable to that as the second inner launcher is supposed to only launch 1 missile at a time but it doesn't it launches the same as the other hardpoint in the torso).

All hail LRMONLINE, it was before and it is again!!!!!!

Edited by StainlessSR, 11 March 2013 - 04:01 PM.

[Sheraf]

Pretty much everyone I launch LRM at take cover lately, can't hit them unless flanking them

[CCODEZ]

I like this idea as well. Cat with 2 LRM 20s fires all 40 together. Cat boating 4 15s/20s couldnt fire all at once and will possibly loose lock on out of sight target due to tag lost or light mech scout having to bail.

Still doesn't help with the s/srm boats, maybe add an accuracy debuff to boating any weapon. *shrugs*

At least it couldn't hurt for them to maybe do some internal testing to this effect to see how it would go, if it is feasible to do of course.

Assuming they haven't already...

[Anony Mouse]

This would strengthen an LRM boats ability to put heads down. an LRM60 Pult or Stalker, couldchain fire a consant stream of LRMs. Never endingm there would be no point where one could break from cover to rush etc etc. We would fight in the shade. LRms needa buff not a nerf. Increase missle speed, or make it increasable by way modules or something.

[Sheraf]

If only everyone will fight like in the 300, never back down, fighting under the swarm of LRM

[Mechwarrior Buddah]

Jelco, on 11 March 2013 - 03:03 PM, said:

First time poster so go easy on me.

My idea is that LRM's should be changed so that the salvos have a 3sec delay.
So if u put a LRM20 in a slot with 10 tubes it would fire 10 wait 3 secs fire another 10 then start its cooldown.
This would make the number of tubes on the mech an important factor and make boating LRMs impractical.
This would stop boating but not effect balanced builds. So no nerf if you use a reasonable amount of LRMs but you can't boat them.
It would also make the variants more interesting as the number of tubes would make a real difference. i.e. Stalker H would actually have a use due to the 2 sets of 20 tubes.
This would then also open the door the lowering the effectiveness of ECM without becoming LRM online.

Just an idea what do people think.

see all these non TT players thinking that boating is a bad thing
BOATING is a part of Battletech as much as the mechs themselves are.
The Catapult line of mechs is a boat line

[Levi Porphyrogenitus]

The LRM fix I'd love to see is to reduce the damage, radically increase spread, and increase missile speed a goodly bit (which would help with accuracy and would be a quality of life improvement for missileers).

This would require my ECM fix and other electronic warfare suggestions to be implemented though. ECM would not prevent locks, it'd make them take longer (double or more, one assumes). Artemis IV would reduce lock-on time (it and ECM would cancel each other out in that regard) and would tighten grouping up again (plus keep the sweet Artemis IV flight pattern). TAG would reduce lock-on time (less bonus than Artemis, and it and ECM would cancel each other out, and no stacking with Artemis IV bonus allowed) and tighten grouping (again, less than Artemis IV and no stacking with Artemis IV).

The goal is to make Artemis IV ideal for single-target damage, TAG a good way for a third-party spotter to help out against specific targets, and standard LRMs to be more of an AOE weapon than a single-target weapon. ECM would not negate LRMs, but LRMs would not need something to negate them in the first place. It'd instead make it harder to use them effectively, which is what is really needed from ECM.

[Mechwarrior Buddah]

Levi Porphyrogenitus, on 11 March 2013 - 05:10 PM, said:

The LRM fix I'd love to see is to reduce the damage,

saw this in another thread and didnt wanna retype it so ill quote it

der langsamere, on 11 March 2013 - 01:49 PM, said:

Its funny, when LRMs were 1.7 per missile, they were worthless because you could walk through a hail of them and ignore them completely.

NOW that theyre 1.8, theyre so OP they need ECM to counter them and AMS/tactics to avioid them are useless.

ONE TENTH OF A POINT OF DAMAGE DIFFERENCE

We're arguing over one tenth of a damage

funny thing about increasing the spread, it used to BE more spread out and the devs made it less themselves. Without our input.
Most people were screaming hoe OP LRMs are and they went and made them BETTER instead of less good

Edited by Mechwarrior Buddah, 11 March 2013 - 05:16 PM.

[semalferuzA]

It is already in the game. His proposal increases the time before the next wave of missiles launch. I think it's a decent idea, but perhaps 3 seconds is too long.

[Moromillas]

Jelco, on 11 March 2013 - 03:03 PM, said:

First time poster so go easy on me.

My idea is that LRM's should be changed so that the salvos have a 3sec delay.
So if u put a LRM20 in a slot with 10 tubes it would fire 10 wait 3 secs fire another 10 then start its cooldown.
This would make the number of tubes on the mech an important factor and make boating LRMs impractical.
This would stop boating but not effect balanced builds. So no nerf if you use a reasonable amount of LRMs but you can't boat them.
It would also make the variants more interesting as the number of tubes would make a real difference. i.e. Stalker H would actually have a use due to the 2 sets of 20 tubes.
This would then also open the door the lowering the effectiveness of ECM without becoming LRM online.

Just an idea what do people think.

There is already quite a large delay when it comes to LRMs it's called lock on time. I can't see why increasing the time it takes to get a lock would be beneficial, the current speed seems pretty good.

To make a phrase like "fix boating" you have to take a leap of faith (gullibility) and make the assumption that boating is bad. There just isn't anything concrete to suggest that boating is bad. Then you have players boating things like lasers, lots of players do that, and it's seen as perfectly fine. So you have two different opinions from players for what's essentially the same thing.

[Idolo]

Whether or not lrm's are OP ill leave open for debate, the thing to keep in mind is the gameplay. I dont think we want a game where teams are desperately camping behind a hill in fear or getting lrmed and the first team to move out of cover is a goner, neither is it desireable that everyone just waggles in the open like nothing can touch them.

With more large and open maps coming one should also consider it's not always so easy to get to cover when moving in a 50 km/h assault mech.

Edited by Idolo, 11 March 2013 - 05:45 PM.

[Vrekgar]

StainlessSR, on 11 March 2013 - 03:59 PM, said:

That actually is a decent idea as it would make firing take longer so boats would have less of an overpowering effect. This would accually put LRM's back into the SUPPORT ROLE and not as a primary weapon.

There are no "Support weapons". ALL WEAPONS ARE MAIN WEAPONS!

[DocBach]

Here's an LRM balance solution to deter from boating - increase the lock on time for larger launchers, and increase lock on time further per launcher grouped.