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I Wrote This Before (But Here It Is Again)


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#1 SirLANsalot

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Posted 17 July 2013 - 01:17 AM

Very easy to use heat penalty system that actually WORKS.

First a few things about the current thinking of PGI and some corrections.

1. Alpha strike is NOT the issue here, and it never was.
2. Boating isn't an issue either, it only becomes an issue when its being used by a mech that is not intended to boat that weapon. We already have two examples of Boats as Intended and Boating as NOT Intended. The HBK-4P is boating as intended, it uses 9 Medium lasers, which also are a weapon intended to be boated. The infamous PPC Stalker, in both 4 and 6 forms, is Boating as NOT Intended. The Stalker is an LRM mech, with ML and Srms as defensive backup weapons. Also the PPC is a weapon that is not intended to be boated or used past 2 with exceptions on certain mechs where it is (Awesomes and Nova Cats for example).


So how dose one stop boating as Not Intended while still allowing Boating as Intended on mechs that do so? For one you need to identify what weapons are not intended to be boated, and what weapons are fine as they are with there own self balancing.

Ballistics:

In a nutshell, very heavy, very ammo hungry weapons that generate little to no heat due to there already massive wight. Even the AC2 (we ignore the MG for this as it stands alone) which is the smallest of the Ballistics, is quite heavy compared to other weapons around its damage value. However we are looking at comparing "big bore" guns to eachother, so that means the "big bore" guns of the Ballistics Family are the AC20, the Gauss Rifle, and the AC10. These 3 guns are all very heavy, very large in crit space weapons, which severely limits them to what mechs can take them. This limit is even beyond the already limited nature of Ballistic slots on most mechs, both now and in the future. Which means these weapons are non boat guns, they, at the VERY most, can be used in pairs but at a SEVERE cost in other areas of a mech attempting to do this.

Missiles:

Long Range Missiles to be specific here. These weapons are amongst the hardest to use properly on a mech, as not all mechs are made to use "big bore" LRM's. What is a "big bore" LRM, that is the LRM20 and LRM15, these are big launchers that fire many missiles in one salvo. Now not all mechs are made to use them. Yes you can cram one into a mech, but its effectiveness is greatly reduced when firing out of an improper launcher that cannot handle that many missiles. Also when shoe horned into this, these large LRMs are much more vulnerable to AMS fire, and generally are completely shot down, or rendered ineffective damage. The LRM "boat" as it is known, only carry's, at the very most, 4 of these weapons. Which is a far cry from energy, which is far more prevalent in mechs.

Finally we get to Energy:
"Big Bore" energy is the PPC, ERPPC, Large Laser, ER Large Laser, and the Large Pulse Laser. "Big Bore" energy, the drawbacks (the self balancing) that keeps Ballistics, or Missiles in check, doesn't apply here. Here in Energy, HEAT is what is supposed to keep you in check, not tonnage, not crit space, HEAT. Yet here in MWO, heat isn't the stopping mechanism it is supposed to be. Its more or less just something there to stop us from firing forever and isn't the balancing system it needs to be for Energy specifically. Its not the heat system that's the issue here, its the fact that the big bore energy doesn't generate the heat needed to stop the massive boating (boating that is NOT intended) that has been happening as of late.
A few fixes to this. One is just simply increase the base heat caused by these weapons, thus making them "hotter" and discourage boating.
Another fix, and one thats a little more complex, but far more air tight. Is the Limiter System, now I have talked about this system before, and how it dose greatly discourage boating of these big bore energy systems. While still allowing it to happen on chassis it is made to be boated on, thus making those chassis more attractive to people who want to boat that weapon. The system is as follows, and for the example I will use the ERPPC, but keep in mind this system would apply to all Big Bore Energy.

All mechs have a limit of 2 ERPPCs. This means you can place 2 ERPPC on a mech, and they will operate as normal. However if you place a 3rd ERPPC on a mech, you will start paying heavy heat penalty's. This Penalty would be scaling based on the guns in question. So for ERPPCs the penalty would be 2 heat. This is not for alpha striking, this is a heat penalty that is applied to ALL weapons of that type regardless of how they are fired. So 2 ERPPC is 22 Heat generated, then 3 ERPPC would be 39 Heat generated. That is 2 additional heat applied to ALL weapons of that grouping (in this case any PPC) so all ERPPCs (and PPCs) would be generating 2 extra heat. If a 4th is placed, then the penalty gets even steeper and doubles that of the first penalty, so all would be generating 6 extra heat (2 for base plus 4 for the double effect, then added together). So you can see if you stack pull it out that it gets very steep, very fast for going past the Limit. Yet you can "ride" the line of the limiter (by running 3) and still pay the penalty, but you would be running hotter then normal.



This same system is used by EvE online, in there stacking penalty for resistances of shields or armor. You can place as many as you can hold of say EM resistances, but you still will not reach a 100% resistance to it because of the ever increasing penalty past the first hardener being placed. This system keeps you from completely shutting out one type of damage and allows you to think around that system. You can "ride" the line of the penalty system by running 2 or even 3 of that type, but the penalty gets very steep for the 4th one and makes it almost UN-usable to the point where you would be better off using something else for that slot.
The same thing is being used here by the system I just wrote here, that by making an ever growing staking penalty, you make people think to use OTHER weapon systems, instead of trying to use all of just one type.

#2 JudgeDeathCZ

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Posted 17 July 2013 - 01:28 AM

1. Alpha strike is NOT the issue here, and it never was.

Oh rly?
I understand that if you play your Gauss+3PPC HGN then Alpha strike is not problem for ya but it is definitively problem for my light and medium mechs which you can OHKO or 2HKO...

#3 Lord Perversor

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Posted 17 July 2013 - 02:00 AM

View PostJudgeDeathCZ, on 17 July 2013 - 01:28 AM, said:

1. Alpha strike is NOT the issue here, and it never was.

Oh rly?
I understand that if you play your Gauss+3PPC HGN then Alpha strike is not problem for ya but it is definitively problem for my light and medium mechs which you can OHKO or 2HKO...


Someone doing 1x Alpha it's not the issue, that person firing Alpha's non stop in order to deal most dmg is.

As i see it this heat penalty punish only some boats overusing the *Alpha* feature and allows for a more fluent fight than just Alpha wait Alpha wait Alpha.

#4 PenitentTangent

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Posted 17 July 2013 - 05:16 AM

I don't see how this doesn't harm mechs that are already designed to boat.....





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