91 replies to this topic

[Deathlike]

Guys... AGAIN. I hope this is the last cata torso nerf thread that I post to.

A MONTH ago, there was a patch that fixed some of the efficiencies that was inherently broken and/or not working as intended.

In the case of the Catapult (this is undocumented, unless you read through Smurfy's mechlab thread), Twist X was not applying its bonuses PREVIOUSLY to the patch that was issued last month. Now Twist X bonus is working, and catapults got a buff.

So, now today, we get a catapult nerf to the torso twist... across the board.

However, this is a response to having the "buff" that was added previously.

Overall, the catapult is not suffering from any major nerf. It's simply readjustments to bug fixes that have caused Catapults to have an insane torso twist (more than usual) prior to Tuesday's patch. It's that simple.

Edited by Deathlike, 20 March 2013 - 09:01 AM.

[Reptilizer]

Deathlike, on 20 March 2013 - 09:00 AM, said:

Guys... AGAIN. I hope this is the last cata torso nerf thread that I post to.

A MONTH ago, there was a patch that fixed some of the efficiencies that was inherently broken and/or not working as intended.

In the case of the Catapult (this is undocumented, unless you read through Smurfy's mechlab thread), Twist X was not applying its bonuses PREVIOUSLY to the patch that was issued last month. Now Twist X bonus is working, and catapults got a buff.

So, now today, we get a catapult nerf to the torso twist... across the board.

However, this is a response to having the "buff" that was added previously.

Overall, the catapult is not suffering from any major nerf. It's simply readjustments to bug fixes that have caused Catapults to have an insane torso twist (more than usual) prior to Tuesday's patch. It's that simple.

Which would be ok, if the just reduced the angle and kept the twist speed. What they did NOT do.
Twist speed from lock to lock was maintained, reducing actual twist speed in °/sec (tracking) significantly.
Making an already boating-heavy chassis even less able to carry a balanced loadaout as explained elswhere:
http://mwomercs.com/...rf/page__st__60

Edited by Reptilizer, 20 March 2013 - 09:06 AM.

[Joker Two]

The most recent changes were described aw quirks, not as a balance change. Quirks are supposed to differentiate between variants, not lump them together. If it had been straight up called a balance change, more people would be okay with it. Also, the twist angle also affecting the twist speed is very problematic.

[Theevenger]

I was very worried about the Catapult twist reduction, but after playing a few matches I actually don't think it was a very big deal. It doesn't break the Catapult.

[warp103]

Deathlike, on 20 March 2013 - 09:00 AM, said:

Guys... AGAIN. I hope this is the last cata torso nerf thread that I post to.

A MONTH ago, there was a patch that fixed some of the efficiencies that was inherently broken and/or not working as intended.

In the case of the Catapult (this is undocumented, unless you read through Smurfy's mechlab thread), Twist X was not applying its bonuses PREVIOUSLY to the patch that was issued last month. Now Twist X bonus is working, and catapults got a buff.

So, now today, we get a catapult nerf to the torso twist... across the board.

However, this is a response to having the "buff" that was added previously.

Overall, the catapult is not suffering from any major nerf. It's simply readjustments to bug fixes that have caused Catapults to have an insane torso twist (more than usual) prior to Tuesday's patch. It's that simple.

hmm 140 + 14 =154 120+12=134 so either was it less then before. and the lock to lock time is still set on the 140 time.So the RESPONSE is to nerf it worst that it started and for a added kick to the nutz, it is slower to the same 120 angle. k2 154 vs 121 and still 140 lock time. lol to what you define as a adjustment is a stomp to the nutz.

[Senger]

I want to know WHY? What was the reasoning behind this nerf and how long has it been planned? If the twist speed is a glitch then how did it get by when a simple test run would reveal the bug? And if this was about the splatcat, aren't there better ways to fix the splatcat problem?
If there is a dev reading this, please, please explain why the cat got a blanket nerf rather than interesting quirks. It would really put me at ease to know why this was done.

[CoreHunter]

it was done to get complaints on something other than ecm and lrms cuse they are tired of the same s^&t being told to them and them ignoring it. So they just went and f*(&^d up something else...

[Deathlike]

warp103, on 20 March 2013 - 12:01 PM, said:

hmm 140 + 14 =154 120+12=134 so either was it less then before. and the lock to lock time is still set on the 140 time.So the RESPONSE is to nerf it worst that it started and for a added kick to the nutz, it is slower to the same 120 angle. k2 154 vs 121 and still 140 lock time. lol to what you define as a adjustment is a stomp to the nutz.

Your math is off. Twist X can be doubled through getting all elite bonuses.

Before the unintended buff...cata was @ 140.

140 * 1.2 = 168 (before the nerf)

120 * 1.2 = 144 (after the patch) - this is 4 pts more than the original.

The K2 on the other hand is the overall most effective of the bunch... but you only lost 8 degrees of torso twisting. This is hardly significant a loss.

110 * 1.2 = 132

Edited by Deathlike, 20 March 2013 - 01:01 PM.

[warp103]

Hello DA Edwards,
I've checked with my QA, who have been testing this build for a few weeks, and the torso twist speed for all Catapults is just as fast as it was previously but if "Arm Lock" is enabled in the Options Menu then it can seem like the twist is slower because your pilot is also not turning his head, which can move faster than the arms or torso could ever twist and will give the impression of faster movement.
We cannot edit/adjust/remove/add any PilotLab Efficiencies or XP/GXP levels and if you are unhappy with a particular Mech then you have the option to sell it to make back some of the purchase expense.

OK this is what i got from support and this tell me WTF. it is a cat is has no side to side arm movement so who is the Head in Qand A that told him this bull. I did the test the first time with it on and the second off just for a valid test. So they make a chg and are clueless about there own mech stats. And were we not told that mech stat that were in game would not be chg after the Last wipe.{I am not talking weapons but base stats and hard piont. So soon I am wait for the chg to hmm you have to many ppc in stalker let chg that. Etc Etc PGI you are messing with fire and on of the most Iconic mechs.I guess the Timberwolf is never going to be right it will be a timber mouse.

by the way cost is not he issue i have 84 mil in cbills but i grinded like hell to master them each time there was a wipe, That over 360k in xp for 3 cats and not the cheezewiz A1

Edited by warp103, 20 March 2013 - 01:08 PM.

[Deathlike]

Support is not exactly the place to request for buffs/nerfs. They are there to help you if the game is not operating correctly (and the general definition of "not operating correctly" usually means crashing and/or bugs).

The Catapult for the most part is more or less the same since Open Beta... so I'm not sure what you want people to tell you. The only major nerf was applied to the K2, and I'm not really at a lost, having mastered the Catapults (minus the C4).

[Maliconus]

Brickyard, on 19 March 2013 - 07:17 PM, said:

Seems like a good nerf. The Catapult has always been a bit overpowered.

A little more diversity would be nice. There weren't any changes to speed that I noticed.

Make them the same as the other Heavy Mech's....(Diversity)

[Maliconus]

Deathlike, on 20 March 2013 - 01:00 PM, said:

Your math is off. Twist X can be doubled through getting all elite bonuses.

Before the unintended buff...cata was @ 140.

140 * 1.2 = 168 (before the nerf)

120 * 1.2 = 144 (after the patch) - this is 4 pts more than the original.

The K2 on the other hand is the overall most effective of the bunch... but you only lost 8 degrees of torso twisting. This is hardly significant a loss.

110 * 1.2 = 132

But they did not nurf all the other Mech's with Twist X

[Deathlike]

Maliconus, on 20 March 2013 - 02:24 PM, said:

But they did not nurf all the other Mech's with Twist X

Before yesterday's patch, the Catapult had a base 140 torso twist... which was 15 points greater than the next biggest torso twister (which oddly is the Cicada, which I didn't realize most of its variants got a torso twist buff).

They are slowly tweaking each and every mech, but to use a faulty response like that is pretty weak.

Edited by Deathlike, 20 March 2013 - 02:37 PM.

[DisasterTheory]

Deathlike, on 20 March 2013 - 01:00 PM, said:

Your math is off. Twist X can be doubled through getting all elite bonuses.

Before the unintended buff...cata was @ 140.

140 * 1.2 = 168 (before the nerf)

120 * 1.2 = 144 (after the patch) - this is 4 pts more than the original.

The K2 on the other hand is the overall most effective of the bunch... but you only lost 8 degrees of torso twisting. This is hardly significant a loss.

110 * 1.2 = 132

Again you apparently aren't reading all of this thread. I could give a crap about 8 degrees..... its the fact that my K2 now has the torso twist SPEED of an atlas. Did you read that right? Do you need hooct awn foniks ? Im so sick of people who never even use the mech coming into our feedback thread making mute points that have nothing to do with the problem at hand. Hey while your at it throw in a few "its a beta" comments here and there too. The nerf was for ANGLE not SPEED. Yet we got both.... How did this pass the "final check" phase of the patch development? Too much Founders beer and pizza interfearing with proper development of this game. /rant x100000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000

[M4rtyr]

Whine whine whine. I don't even have elites for my cat and i had no problems with it last night.

[Deathlike]

BLOODREDSINGLE, on 20 March 2013 - 02:38 PM, said:

Again you apparently aren't reading all of this thread. I could give a crap about 8 degrees..... its the fact that my K2 now has the torso twist SPEED of an atlas. Did you read that right? Do you need hooct awn foniks ? Im so sick of people who never even use the mech coming into our feedback thread making mute points that have nothing to do with the problem at hand. Hey while your at it throw in a few "its a beta" comments here and there too. The nerf was for ANGLE not SPEED. Yet we got both.... How did this pass the "final check" phase of the patch development? Too much Founders beer and pizza interfearing with proper development of this game. /rant x100000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000

There is no error. The video recorded was of the Training Grounds. No mech bonuses are applied there as of yet (they are aware of this behavior/bug).

There has been no actual changes to the chassis torso twist speed, just the actual range.

[warp103]

M4rtyr, on 20 March 2013 - 02:54 PM, said:

Whine whine whine. I don't even have elites for my cat and i had no problems with it last night.

then you have no idea what the lock to lock we are talking about chead. 168deg vs 140{old for you} so since you have the lower one it is not going to feel much different. 56deg is liner time is a lot for us.

Deathlike, on 20 March 2013 - 03:34 PM, said:

There is no error. The video recorded was of the Training Grounds. No mech bonuses are applied there as of yet (they are aware of this behavior/bug).

There has been no actual changes to the chassis torso twist speed, just the actual range.

I did it in the training ground for a no bonus. the time is the issue. it worst in battle because the time would be based on 168 each way that a 56 deg of time it still using. check in live battle with cryeng command console it slower no matter how you slice it.

but any way frak it i will buy a a1 and boat and be a a hole Tired of excuses. math is math. command console shows in real time game so. I am now at the to not give a crap stage.I Have show error with LRM, AC20 transfer to the front , now this. Each time no that not happening till you get DEV thomas a few week late Admit opps yes that was right. So From now on I am going to cheat{in the rules} and be a a hole.Thanks DEv

Edited by warp103, 20 March 2013 - 03:53 PM.

[JDH4mm3r]

TESTING GROUNDS does not contain any mech bonuses, so please test in a real match where the bonuses work better in... then respond back here.

[warp103]

JDH4mm3r, on 20 March 2013 - 03:39 PM, said:

TESTING GROUNDS does not contain any mech bonuses, so please test in a real match where the bonuses work better in... then respond back here.

see above

[Asmosis]

Gaan Cathal, on 20 March 2013 - 01:07 AM, said:

You do realise that what has actually happened is that the Catapult no longer has an arbitrary and unnecessary advantage over every other mech with the same bodyform? The torso twist was out of whack with similar models like the Jenner, Raven, Cicada, Stalker, etc and it didn't need to be. This isn't a nerf, it's normalisation.

Fine, then get rid of the massive disadvantage given to them (to compensate torso range) at the same time, namely the fact their head location area is about 5x larger than most other mechs.

Since it lost its advantage, it should lose its disadvantage as well.