18 replies to this topic

[focuspark]

Seems to me that the JagerMech is obviously better (and therefore unbalanced) when compared to the Catapult.

They're both 65 tons. They both have the same range of engines available. They both have gimpy arms. The JagerMech has two more hard points in every configuration than the Catapult (8 v 6). The CPLT has no obvious advantages, to balance this out, over the Jager.

The JagerMech even has a better missile launcher profile than the Catapult: 2 Missile in each arm + 1 energy in each side torso (plus a pair of ballistics for fun). This allows the JagerMech to mount 4x SRM6 + 2x LL.

How is this balanced?

[Kale Cytair]

The Catapult is armored with something thicker than C-bills. And the C4 Catapult can match your 4 SRM/2LL build, minus the ballistic points.

[Multitallented]

*facepalm*

A1 is the best heavy in the game for brawling with 6 SRM6. You can't do that with a Jager. Most Catapults have jump jets whereas the Jager doesn't. The C4 arms can shoot 20 missiles at once whereas the Jager can only do 15.

[focuspark]

Kale Cytair, on 20 March 2013 - 09:19 AM, said:

The Catapult is armored with something thicker than C-bills. And the C4 Catapult can match your 4 SRM/2LL build, minus the ballistic points.

Nope. The C4 energy hard points are in the CT, so the best it can do is a pair of medium lasers or medium pulse lasers.

Multitallented, on 20 March 2013 - 09:23 AM, said:

*facepalm*

A1 is the best heavy in the game for brawling with 6 SRM6. You can't do that with a Jager. Most Catapults have jump jets whereas the Jager doesn't. The C4 arms can shoot 20 missiles at once whereas the Jager can only do 15.

Only because SRM are broken atm. A hotfix is coming very soon to fix this. The missile limitation is per launcher, so it has no impact on SRM AND 2x SRM6 = 12 which even if it was per location limitation both 20 and 15 are greater than 12. For LRM with lock on ability, limiting the number of missiles means very little.

[Ryebear]

Better torso twist, harder to hit side torsos which give better protection for dual gauss or AC 20 builds, JUMP JETS (which are an absolute game changer if you know how to use them), and an even easier to hit head.

For the most part the Jaeger has more hardpoints than it can use. Im not saying that the Jaeger isnt good, time will tell on that one though.

[focuspark]

Ryebear, on 20 March 2013 - 09:42 AM, said:

Better torso twist, harder to hit side torsos which give better protection for dual gauss or AC 20 builds, JUMP JETS (which are an absolute game changer if you know how to use them), and an even easier to hit head.

For the most part the Jaeger has more hardpoints than it can use. Im not saying that the Jaeger isnt good, time will tell on that one though.

True, the CPLT does have a slightly better torso twist - not sure about difficulty of hitting side torsos compared to the JM6. Jump Jets are a nice bonus but not sure they're worth the energy hard points being moved to the side torsos AND a pair of ballistic hard points in the arms.

[Deathlike]

The Catapult is a support mech, so it makes a bit more sense. It's not really a brawler (unless you go dual AC20 K2 or splatcat), but you figure the Jagermech is a better choice to brawl since you can do dual AC20 + XL engine...

[focuspark]

Deathlike, on 20 March 2013 - 10:01 AM, said:

The Catapult is a support mech, so it makes a bit more sense. It's not really a brawler (unless you go dual AC20 K2 or splatcat), but you figure the Jagermech is a better choice to brawl since you can do dual AC20 + XL engine...

I dunno... Jenny "Butterbee" would disagree with you (if she were real) and so would everyone else who mounts SRM6 on their CPLT.

[Aim64C]

focuspark, on 20 March 2013 - 08:37 AM, said:

How is this balanced?

It isn't. In the slightest.

Dusted so many Jaeger's in my C4 today that it was sad.

Those things have a profile that sees the LRM 20s and gives them a nice, big, hug.

In the mean time, I'm dancing through their LRM and autocannon fire like it's not even there.

I'll probably end up trying them out after I get through XP-ing up a hangar of jenners - but mostly for the dakka-dakka and pew-pew. The missile version of the Jaeger seems to be there mostly so that no one chassis is completely restricted from a given category of weaponry (same with a lot of other mech variants).

[focuspark]

Aim64C, on 20 March 2013 - 11:04 AM, said:

... so that no one chassis is completely restricted from a given category of weaponry (same with a lot of other mech variants).

There's an army of Stalker pilots ready to throw you under their mech's feet now

Edited by focuspark, 20 March 2013 - 11:08 AM.

[Aim64C]

focuspark, on 20 March 2013 - 11:08 AM, said:

There's an army of Stalker pilots ready to throw you under their mech's feet now

Oh yeah... Kind of forgot they exist.

I invite them to try. Doesn't usually work out too well for them, even though they have 20 tons on me.

That said - it is interesting that the Stalker had absolutely no canon variants to include ballistics. Considering that various manufacturers came up with all kinds of hideously contrived versions of different mechs with varrying degrees of effectiveness.

[focuspark]

Aim64C, on 20 March 2013 - 11:23 AM, said:

Oh yeah... Kind of forgot they exist.

I invite them to try. Doesn't usually work out too well for them, even though they have 20 tons on me.

That said - it is interesting that the Stalker had absolutely no canon variants to include ballistics. Considering that various manufacturers came up with all kinds of hideously contrived versions of different mechs with varrying degrees of effectiveness.

It's a boring, ugly mech that didn't capture the imagination of authors basically. Remember, most cannon was written by people unfamiliar with the topic: ie. paid writers.

Personally, Stalker and Catapult have been my favorite 'mechs since before I realized BattleTech existed and just wondered why I kept seeing the same robots all over (never liked the transformer planes from RoboTech).

[Kaeb Odellas]

At present, the Jagermech is balanced out by the fact that it will fall apart in a light rain, and that is only a slight exaggeration. With XL engines, Jagermechs are basically walking deathtraps with their enormous side torsos, and a standard engine is only a mild improvement in survivability with its enormous head box.

[M4rtyr]

?

There is a splatjager I missed?

[Khobai]

Catapult > Jagermech. Period.

Show me a Jagermech that does 90 damage, goes 80kph, and has jumpjets.

[Mattiator]

As most people have pointed out, the JagerMech does very few things better than the Catapult ATM. Really, all it has is more aiming flexibility and better ballistic capabilities, which, to be honest, is how it should be. The JagerMech is intended as a long-range sniper, not an in-your-face heavy ballistic face masher.

[SMDMadCow]

Deathlike, on 20 March 2013 - 10:01 AM, said:

The Catapult is a support mech, so it makes a bit more sense. It's not really a brawler (unless you go dual AC20 K2 or splatcat), but you figure the Jagermech is a better choice to brawl since you can do dual AC20 + XL engine...

You can literally do the same with a K2, in fact you just said that so whats your point?

[Khobai]

Quote

Jagermech is a better choice to brawl since you can do dual AC20 + XL engine...

Yeah except that its not a better choice because

1) Jagermech gets headshotted like crazy
2) XL engine in a brawling mech with huge side torsos. nuff said.
3) You actually have to put armor on the arms which negates the tonnage you save from using the XL engine.

[focuspark]

M4rtyr, on 20 March 2013 - 05:43 PM, said:

?

There is a splatjager I missed?

4x SRM6 + 2x LL... it is a beast.