2002 replies to this topic

[GantzO]

In real life you drive a car the 3d person? 3d person in the mech simulator it's a very stupid idea...
If you do game for the little children, then you do say it and dont **** mind.

[Darius Deadeye]

Edson Drake, on 07 June 2013 - 06:50 PM, said:

I said before, I don't mind 3rd person, but...

The player base they want to attract(COD, Crysis, Battlefield and WoT) isn't the kind of players that will stay. They're the ones that will play this for about a week and never come back.
As a niche game, only Mechwarrior fans stay. Sure some here and there will like the game and stay, but it isn't 3rd person that is going to change their minds.

I think this is the one point they keep on missing. The ones they target with changes like this aren't the ones that'll pay and stay.

[hoverstorm]

Here it is, I don't mind the dev's implementing 3pv. By all means, go ahead and do it. But please ensure that it does not affect 1PV players CW in any way.

If at any point of time, 3pv, would actually affect CW, most players who would like to stay in the game, would have no choice but to play in 3pv, to even the "unfair" advantage that 3pv would offer.

Separate the CW for 1pv and 3pv, if you really think that 3pv would prosper in such a complicated game. 3PV games are generally lazy games, and if you guys really want to attract that market of players, you would have no choice but to dumb down the mechlabs.

Balancing 3pv game would be totally different from balancing a 1pv game, and again, with the complexity of this game, it ain't gonna make it any easier for the devs.

Let me mention this again, if you want to go for 3pv, by all means, go ahead. But, you should and you must separate the 1pv gameplay from the 3pv gameplay, balance them separately, as you actually believed it would attract more players for 3pv.

3pv of game would work better, if you have 256 players on a single huge map, rather than a 12 vs 12 scenario. Everything that you have developed so far, is aimed to make MW:O a fps game, and by forcing a 3pv down its throat, does not mean it would make it a successful 3pv game.

[MavRCK]

3rd person - only for novice players, entry level and anything serious INCLUDING tournaments is 1st person only to encourage a transition of new players into a more serious 1st person simulation approach.

[Corbon Zackery]

The main issue with third person is the out of cockpit field of vision. Also there a issue with visual sight behind a 3rd person view. Your also going to know who shooting you from directional impact hits.

To solve the back issue most 3rd person went to a over the shoulder view. However over the shoulder gives you a nice 180 degree out of cockpit vision you can solve that by making a outward cone vision with grey shade obscuring the vision out side the cone but your still going to see motion through the grey cone area.

After that you have shadow and 2d 3d issues. Coding for arm movement, torso twist, leg movement your looking at back graphic shots.

A good game to look at for 3rd person is Skyrim. You get a basic understanding as to what a 3rd person looks like.

All third person does is give 3d effect to a 2d character. By turning a square into a 2d cube.

Your also going to have zoom issues since your zooming a 180 degree view. Then giving that 180 degree view a box advanced zoom.

Edited by Corbon Zackery, 09 June 2013 - 09:04 PM.

[GantzO]

3dpv is a cheat.

[SirLANsalot]

Said this many times.


3PV can, and will, be done correctly. Yes MW4 ruined it for so many noobs (old vets) out there who probably will never play a MW game again because of it.

PGI knows how 3P was done in MW4, and knows NOT to do it that way again. 3P is fine if the why you see incoming fire, and other mechs, as if you were still in your cockpit. This means you will NOT see that AC20 hit from your side, your hit indicators will tell you that you got it, but you will not SEE it. If your PILOT did not SEE it, then you will NOT see it, no matter how far back they put the camera. Optimal location for it would be so the lower half of your screen is your mech (where the weapon groups/map ect is), maybe a little farther back then that.



Personally I do not care if they put it in or not. I would still LIKE to see my mech taking hits and losing arms in the midst of battles, but if they do not put it in. Then instead at least give us replays of matches so we CAN see our awesomely painted mechs die in glorious battle. I know a lot of people that do not see the point in getting paints/patterns because they cannot see there own mech. I generally agree with them because I too want to see my mech in all its glory with its gold plated armor and silver lined features as it marches across the battlefield. I would like to see 3PV, but also I would like it to be balanced against 1PV as well, so nither side has any room to ***** or complain. One such way would be to hot swap them like in WoT, as 3P is good for moving and brawling, but 1P is better for lining up that perfect shot at long range.

[CyBerkut]

SirLANsalot, on 11 June 2013 - 02:45 PM, said:

Said this many times.


3PV can, and will, be done correctly. Yes MW4 ruined it for so many noobs (old vets) out there who probably will never play a MW game again because of it.

PGI knows how 3P was done in MW4, and knows NOT to do it that way again. 3P is fine if the why you see incoming fire, and other mechs, as if you were still in your cockpit. This means you will NOT see that AC20 hit from your side, your hit indicators will tell you that you got it, but you will not SEE it. If your PILOT did not SEE it, then you will NOT see it, no matter how far back they put the camera. Optimal location for it would be so the lower half of your screen is your mech (where the weapon groups/map ect is), maybe a little farther back then that.



Personally I do not care if they put it in or not. I would still LIKE to see my mech taking hits and losing arms in the midst of battles, but if they do not put it in. Then instead at least give us replays of matches so we CAN see our awesomely painted mechs die in glorious battle. I know a lot of people that do not see the point in getting paints/patterns because they cannot see there own mech. I generally agree with them because I too want to see my mech in all its glory with its gold plated armor and silver lined features as it marches across the battlefield. I would like to see 3PV, but also I would like it to be balanced against 1PV as well, so nither side has any room to ***** or complain. One such way would be to hot swap them like in WoT, as 3P is good for moving and brawling, but 1P is better for lining up that perfect shot at long range.

Got an authoritative source for these claims about how 3PV will, and will not work?

Edited by CyBerkut, 11 June 2013 - 03:58 PM.

[SirLANsalot]

CyBerkut, on 11 June 2013 - 03:57 PM, said:

Got an authoritative source for these claims about how 3PV will, and will not work?

its called common sense, its like a superpower that certain people have who use there brains instead of there feelings.

[CyBerkut]

Ah... so it's basically a case of pulling it out of your butt. Otherwise known as ASSumptions.

It's fine to have theories about how you think it will end up working, but you you should label them as such, rather than stating them as if they were a fact.

[Vision]

It's obvious from the posted comments that 3rd person will be in the game. As they have a vested interest in making sure this game is going to work (hell it's popular enough already in first-person) i'm not about to judge until i've seen it in action.

As to ideas on how to implement it? That will be tricky to appease both sides of the fence.

How about something like this:

3rd person is equivalent to an external camera view launched by a camera-drone. Perhaps attached at a fixed position to the rear and above the mech and replaces the cockpit HUD with a camera view from the drone. You could even colorise it so that it looks more 'video-ish' (if thats a word).

It sort of makes sense to do this as pilots would not normally sit outside their mech, so you'll have to implement it 'technically' i think.

[Pawn Couch]

Vision, on 12 June 2013 - 07:27 PM, said:

How about something like this:

3rd person is equivalent to an external camera view launched by a camera-drone. Perhaps attached at a fixed position to the rear and above the mech and replaces the cockpit HUD with a camera view from the drone. You could even colorise it so that it looks more 'video-ish' (if thats a word).

It sort of makes sense to do this as pilots would not normally sit outside their mech, so you'll have to implement it 'technically' i think.

I like this but i think you should be able to destroy it forcing the player to use 1st person. Also it should follow the mech slugishly and tip side to side when the player changes the camera angle. Maybe if an energy weapon such as the PPC hit the players mech or came close to the drone the players camera feed would drop out or distort for half a second or more Making it a bit more realistic. Also this drone would deploy and land back on the mech durin battle and it cant land while the mech is moving.

Or maybe the drone could be always active and feeding one of the many not-used monitors in our mech and selecting 1st or 3rd would be changing our focus point between the veiwport and the monitor and the player could bind keys too change the camera perspective while in 1st person.

Edited by KING PINEAPYULA, 13 June 2013 - 09:08 PM.

[TheMightyWashburn]

Ive spent 120 dollars on this(not founder). I hadnt been around recently and didnt know this was official.

Im not spending another dime on this. Probably will uninstall all together.

Back to TF2 and arma 3.

[MoonfireSpam]

I don't see how 3rd person can be anything but an advantage. On top of that, you lose all the immerson, which is what made MW so damn different and awesome.

Anyways since Devs seem so hell bent on putting it in, I think it should act like a camera on the wing of a formula 1 car. So it would be somewhere on top and a bit behind the mech. It means you cant see what's behind you, and it is fixed to the torso orientation of the mech (i.e. absolutely not a free-cam).

As such it should also be subject to flash / screen shake effects and you lose all HUD markings bar a small reticule. Missing markings would include the range finder, friendly / hostile triangles, weapon group indicators around the crosshair, etc. I guess you would have to allow the damage display for the enemy mechs...

1st person should be the default view and by default 1st person should only face off against 1st person players.

Probably restrict it to practice mode / custom lobby.

I don't see how you can avoid fragmenting everyone or making CW a giant pain in the arse. Do consider how close you are to alienating the player base that shelled out money for founder packs and champ / hero mechs.

[Braggart]

Edson Drake, on 07 June 2013 - 06:50 PM, said:

I said before, I don't mind 3rd person, but...

The player base they want to attract(COD, Crysis, Battlefield and WoT) isn't the kind of players that will stay. They're the ones that will play this for about a week and never come back.
As a niche game, only Mechwarrior fans stay. Sure some here and there will like the game and stay, but it isn't 3rd person that is going to change their minds.

if they get someone in here and manage to get them to buy a hero mech, they made thier money, and dont need that player anymore.

[Henry Avery]

I have loved this game, but now seeing two queues being implemented with a community not large enough to manage one 8v8 queue, this will probably destroy this game.

I do believe Bryan & Co when they say you will not be able to shoot behind corners etc, they have implemented the current game well enough, but the advantage a 3PV camera gives can never be neglected. Bryan now calls me a sim head, and I have to say I take some offense to this. I see myself as a pilot of a 'Mech, not a commander or anything else, 3PV is fine for battletech and mech commander, for this game it is a given.

I will run the "hardcore" mode for as long as it will find a game, then I will go cry in a corner waiting for the next mechwarrior game. Meanwhile I will not invest a single cent, PGI you ****** up to be frank.

<edit>
Yay, a response on page 90, like this will be read ever.
If you do read post a like for fun
</edit>

Edited by Henry Avery, 16 June 2013 - 07:48 AM.

[Ursus_Spiritus]

No!

[BigMekkUrDakka]

freaking no to 3pv!

[Coolant]

8100d 5p4tt3r, on 16 June 2013 - 08:00 AM, said:

No!

BigMekkUrDakka, on 16 June 2013 - 08:03 AM, said:

freaking no to 3pv!

Yes! Freakin' Yes!

Edited by Coolant, 16 June 2013 - 08:40 AM.

[EyeOne]

Who cares what we say? They are going to do it anyway.