122 replies to this topic

[K0M3D14N]

Ph30nix, on 22 March 2013 - 03:18 AM, said:

i voted underpowered but NOT because of damage.

over all MISSLES ARE NOW GARBAGE.

i said in another post i can live with damage but at current damage

Flight speed needs dramatic increase
ECM needs a massive nerf

basicly everything about missles they nerfed earlier they need to undo.

before you judge me look at missles AS A WHOLE.

I'm going to judge you and I'm going to laugh. I don't run ECM 'mechs, but at the same time I don't have any issue with them. If you're seriously having trouble with someone TAGging a Fatlas DDC on your team, then you're in trouble. It's almost impossible to scout effectively in any Light that doesn't have ECM as it is because you get spotted so ridiculously easily.

LRMs should not be the be-all end-all of weapons. They are fire SUPPORT weapons for softening up targets and providing area denial for your team. They fulfill that role wonderfully as it is.

[ryoma]

I found Raven-3Ls to be a threat, but no where near the old levels. They seem just about balanced with other lights.

Still think the Jenner needs larger side torsos, also I don't like how easily my Jenner is CT cored.... from behind.

[TheGreatNoNo]

LRMs need to be 1.0 at least. I should not be able to happily eat LRM20 volleys. I would like to see SRMs at 1.8, but not the streaks oh no, not them, 0.04 is good enough for them.

[CG Oglethorpe Kerensky]

The damage is spot on, I could see the LRM flight speed increased a bit...BUT...this does screw with AMS so maybe not.

[Voidcrafter]

Ph30nix, on 22 March 2013 - 03:18 AM, said:

i voted underpowered but NOT because of damage.

over all MISSLES ARE NOW GARBAGE.

i said in another post i can live with damage but at current damage

Flight speed needs dramatic increase
ECM needs a massive nerf

basicly everything about missles they nerfed earlier they need to undo.

before you judge me look at missles AS A WHOLE.

Oooh, EXCUSE ME for not seing sense in being able to two-shot everything on the battlefield with a SUPPORT weapon.
You don't get it, do you? They should be like a firing shotgun at long range, soften up targets, making them easier for the rest of your mates to kill.
You, fella, need to play a bit with the rest of the weapons with a style different from boating(meaning - putting two AC20s/Gausses in a mech) and then you shouldn't expect people to judge you for the funny things you're saying.
As the role LRMs are supose to do, I think they need a biiit more nerfing with the spread and damage and THEN they should be fine.

[Wolf Clearwater]

bump for awesome poll

[MonkeyCheese]

Wolf87535, on 22 March 2013 - 04:23 AM, said:

bump for awesome poll

Agreed needs moooooaaarrrr votes

[Naja]

Voidcrafter, on 22 March 2013 - 04:18 AM, said:

Oooh, EXCUSE ME for not seing sense in being able to two-shot everything on the battlefield with a SUPPORT weapon.
You don't get it, do you? They should be like a firing shotgun at long range, soften up targets, making them easier for the rest of your mates to kill.
You, fella, need to play a bit with the rest of the weapons with a style different from boating(meaning - putting two AC20s/Gausses in a mech) and then you shouldn't expect people to judge you for the funny things you're saying.
As the role LRMs are supose to do, I think they need a biiit more nerfing with the spread and damage and THEN they should be fine.

I'm sorry but I just don't understand this whole 'support weapons should do less damage' line of thinking. I have experience in armored warfare, and let me tell you that all the support weapons carried are the most devastating available. They are support weapons because they have significant disadvantages, largely mobility. I see no reason missiles should be less effective in terms of damage purely because they're indirect fire, when you have other ways of countering missile attacks that you cannot utilize against direct fire.

Support is support because it's not up close and personal, not because it can't put out the same damage as a brawler.

[Voidcrafter]

Naja, on 22 March 2013 - 04:37 AM, said:

I'm sorry but I just don't understand this whole 'support weapons should do less damage' line of thinking. I have experience in armored warfare, and let me tell you that all the support weapons carried are the most devastating available. They are support weapons because they have significant disadvantages, largely mobility. I see no reason missiles should be less effective in terms of damage purely because they're indirect fire, when you have other ways of countering missile attacks that you cannot utilize against direct fire.

Support is support because it's not up close and personal, not because it can't put out the same damage as a brawler.

Welll... there aren't any giant robot's in the real life, fighting eachother aren't there?
In real life comparisson LRMs are not effective enough.
In game ballance terms it does almost what it's supose to do, and we've seen how wrong that could go just few days ago didn't we?
Well another thing - if you should stay immobile for few secs while firing/reloading LRMs... that I could actually like

[Naja]

You've missed the point. The point is, there is no reason for 'support' weapons to be less effective. They're as much about getting the kill as any other weapon, and not just used for softening up targets. The disadvantages to support weapons should never include doing less damage than other weapon types.

[Thorqemada]

SRM + SSRM be ok so far but LRM are crap.

This is bcs the LRMs are balanced around LRM superboating and People that take LRM as auxiliary weapon (like 1x LRM10) get the **** end.

Cover, ECM, AMS, now the damage nurf - it promotes either more and harder superboating of LRM so they can still make an Impact on the game result or abandonement of this weapon system.

Imho the whole LRM system needs to go back to the drawing board!

Edited by Thorqemada, 22 March 2013 - 05:41 AM.

[Voidcrafter]

Naja, on 22 March 2013 - 04:52 AM, said:

You've missed the point. The point is, there is no reason for 'support' weapons to be less effective. They're as much about getting the kill as any other weapon, and not just used for softening up targets. The disadvantages to support weapons should never include doing less damage than other weapon types.

I see your point actually, but I can't be persuaded to agree with it, just cause LRMs require really near to none effort to use properly.
Well you can say that for all the weapons in the game, but the difference is, that LRMs give you the chance to stay away from danger, while this is not for the price of your overall damage output.
Some teammate holds a target - you lock it(behind a small cliff), you fire 2xLRM20, the target takes overall punishment that could be compared almost as being hit from 2xAC20.
But AC20 weights more, it has less ammo weight/shots ratio, it requires you to have a direct line of sight on the target and to be in range, that opens you to danger.
It does not follow the target - it requires you to lead it depending on the position of the lower torso, speed, mech variant AND the part you want to hit.
And I don't even like AC20 - before I get flamed for being a AC20/Gauss lover - I am not.
That's the problem I got with the LRMs - they are teaching people bad habits(especially the ones that are starting the game now, and oh god - the ones that started the game this week...).
It requires near to none effort to operate, while putting you in near to zero danger, but you still retain too good damage pottential.
Nope. It doesn't seems right to me - and the presence of the Alpine Peaks and the other large map is pushing people even more toward using this weapon.

[Naja]

And all it takes is one ECM mech to render your main weapons useless, and force you to rely on backup weapons. Also if the distance gap is closed, your main weapons again become redundant dead weight. Ams (when actually utilized but for some reason never is) can also be an effective counter to missile fire. Not to mention that enemies are warned of incoming missile attacks, and if being shot at from greater than 600m away, really have no one else but themselves to blame for getting hit.

AC/20's suffer from none of these effects. PPC's suffer from even less.

That is how the weapons should be balanced. For the record I was for a LRM nerf pre hotfix, I just think they went a little too far (and yes I'm aware it's a place holder).

[Voidcrafter]

Naja, on 22 March 2013 - 05:12 AM, said:

And all it takes is one ECM mech to render your main weapons useless, and force you to rely on backup weapons. Also if the distance gap is closed, your main weapons again become redundant dead weight. Ams (when actually utilized but for some reason never is) can also be an effective counter to missile fire. Not to mention that enemies are warned of incoming missile attacks, and if being shot at from greater than 600m away, really have no one else but themselves to blame for getting hit.

AC/20's suffer from none of these effects. PPC's suffer from even less.

That is how the weapons should be balanced. For the record I was for a LRM nerf pre hotfix, I just think they went a little too far (and yes I'm aware it's a place holder).

And thank god that there's ECM and LRMs got a min range restrictions, cause try to imagine it otherwise
Still it's not enough punishment for LRM boating, cause boating, as general, is something that have to be punished VERY hard.

[Naja]

Voidcrafter, on 22 March 2013 - 05:17 AM, said:

And thank god that there's ECM and LRMs got a min range restrictions, cause try to imagine it otherwise
Still it's not enough punishment for LRM boating, cause boating, as general, is something that have to be punished VERY hard.

Well see there I agree with you. Boating is where the problem lies, but I feel as though people lose sight of the fact that not everyone who uses LRMs actually boats them. I myself run my c1 with 2xLRM15's with artemis, and when we start reducing weapons potential because of boats, it's not the boats who suffer from it

[DMHas]

Since the last patch are the LRM's overpowered. No chance to come in the near of a Catapult with 2x LRM20 - they are 2 of them is more worst. Now will every one take LRM's that don't makes fun to play. (Yesterday I played against 6 Mechs with LRM's 15 & 20 - isn't funny ......)

Edited by DMHas, 22 March 2013 - 05:31 AM.

[Mechkilla]

It's to early to vote because we have to see how all of them are behaving ingame. Especially after they reduced the splash damage radius (i find splash damage in generell wrong on armor piercing weapons).

Streaks should do either less damage, have less range or less missiles per ton because every missile need space for a guidance and flight control system. That leads to less space for the warhead, the rocket fuel or they have to be bigger (aka less room per ton).
Same goes for LRMs. They need more space for fuel and a guidance/flight control system. So they should make not more than half the damage a SRM is doing. That also mean less missiles per ton. Till yesterday LRMs could do more (raw) damage per ton than SRMs. Now they are only doing a little less. In my view it is still wrong.

But beside of that what I said ... it is a game in which the developers have to apply balancing issues that differs from real world physics. This is not a raw simulation ... it's an arcade simulator .

[The Mech behind you]

Streaks and SRM are ok. LRMs mostly hit the CT now which makes them ok for the damage they deal atm. After they get fixed and hit other parts of the mech again they will be underpowered.

Edited by Norman Kosh, 22 March 2013 - 05:37 AM.

[Voidcrafter]

Norman Kosh, on 22 March 2013 - 05:36 AM, said:

Streaks and SRM are ok. LRMs mostly hit the CT now which makes them ok for the damage they deal atm. After they get fixed and hit other parts of the mech again they will be underpowered.

Well, lets make them hit the mostly the cockpit, or overall the parts which have the least armor.
Oh wait... where did we saw that one come to live actually?
EDIT: And how well actually this ended?

Edited by Voidcrafter, 22 March 2013 - 05:40 AM.

[The Mech behind you]

they did hit the side torsos and arms before the 03-19 patch. Spread the damage but didn't insta-kill the cockpit