10 replies to this topic

[Flak Kannon]

Ok, I have built over a 100 smurfy builds and have learned that you lose the same numer of criticals (14 ) when you use either Ferros Fiber Armor or Endo Steel.


One ( endo steel) gives you more weight savings than the other, at the same critical usage.

If I were needed to pick just one, is there any convincing reason to choose one over the other??


Seems as tho if I choose the armor, it should be that my MAX armor value would be higher but save less weight, but that is not the way it is... rights?

Is there any reason at all to EVER use Ferrous over Endo Steel if you going to just equip one weight saving addition??


Thanks!

[Jeff K Notagoon]

Flak Kannon, on 22 March 2013 - 04:38 PM, said:

Is there any reason at all to EVER use Ferrous over Endo Steel if you going to just equip one weight saving addition??


Thanks!

No. Always do endo first.

[Roland]

If you can only pick one, Endo will generally always be the better choice.

[Exoth3rmic]

Flak Kannon, on 22 March 2013 - 04:38 PM, said:

Is there any reason at all to EVER use Ferrous over Endo Steel if you going to just equip one weight saving addition??

In MWO implementation - no. Go endo first always. Some mechs come with ferro though at base (without endo) so always worth checking what's there.

Also ferro reduces your weight by giving you an armor that is simply lighter than the one you have currently but just as effective. You do not gain or lose any armor by using it.

Edited by Exoth3rmic, 22 March 2013 - 04:42 PM.

[Major Derps]

Since there is no re-arm and repair bills, and clan tech is still not here...Endo steel first, every time. Using both is only really benificial for lights and lighter mediums.

Edited by Mokey Mot, 22 March 2013 - 04:46 PM.

[Inconspicuous]

Endo first!!!

[Zyllos]

PGI plans on modifying Ferro-Fibrous to make it more useful by itself.

I think the current rumors is that it also allows the same weight savings (12%) in extra armor in each section. But so far that is speculation.

[Sephlock]

Zyllos, on 22 March 2013 - 04:54 PM, said:

PGI plans on modifying Ferro-Fibrous to make it more useful by itself.

I think the current rumors is that it also allows the same weight savings (12%) in extra armor in each section. But so far that is speculation.

Source on the PGI planning thing and the rumor thing . Or at least the PGI planning part...

[Deamhan]

Exoth3rmic, on 22 March 2013 - 04:41 PM, said:

In MWO implementation - no. Go endo first always. Some mechs come with ferro though at base (without endo) so always worth checking what's there.

Also ferro reduces your weight by giving you an armor that is simply lighter than the one you have currently but just as effective. You do not gain or lose any armor by using it.

I agree with what you are saying but...

With how they describe it, I had expected to see my max armor increase by 12%.

[Protection]

I liked the previously suggested idea that Ferro Fibrous could increase the maximum armour by 12% as well. That might balance it out against Endo Steel better.

As a possible design decision.

As it stands, Endo is far better.



Before outfitting a mech with Endo Steel, Ferro Fibrous, or Double Heatsinks - be sure that you actually want to do it. It costs money to make the switch, and it costs more money to go back - so tinkering is for the rich.


Endo Steel over Ferro Fibrous 100% of the time. Never ever, ever, ever take Ferro Fibrous unless you already have Endo Steel. Never ever.

Simple Explanation: (Ferro Fibrous will save you anywhere from 0.5 tons to maybe 2.5 tons, Endo Steel will save you between 1 and 5 tons, and Ferro Fibrous will never save you more tonnage thanEndo Steel.)

Detailed Explanation: (Endo Steel halves the weight of your internal structure. Since Internal Structure weights 10% of your mech's weight, you get half of that back. That is, you get 5% of your mechs tonnage more to spend on weapons and armour and other goodies. A 20 ton mech gets 1 extra ton with Endo Steel, a 50 ton mechs gets 2.5 tons, a 100 ton mech gets 5 tons. Remember, this extra tonnage is tonnage you can use to pay for more regular armour. Ferro Fibrous armour gives you 12% more armor points per ton. It does not increase your maximum armour, it just discounts the price of the tonnage you pay for armour. Now, pretending that you are running close to the maximum armour on each mech, you are spending maybe 20% of that mech's weight on armour. Which means the 12% extra comes out of that 20. Which means, while Endo Steel is a flat 5% savings, Ferro Fibrous is 12% of 20% or a paltry 2.4% savings (assuming you absolutely maximize armour - it's even worse if you strip armour anywhere). A 20 ton mech will save 0.5 tons, a 50 ton mech will save 1.5 tons, a 100 ton mech will save 2.5 tons.)

Seriously, every time you build a mech with Ferro Fibrous but no Endo Steel, a kitten is punched in the face.


Rule of Thumb:


Light Mechs - both Endo Steel and Ferro Fibrous - you have the extra critical slots, use them
Medium Mechs - Endo Steel always, maybe Ferro Fibrous if you can fit it in (likely not with ballistic weaponry)
Heavy Mechs - Almost always Endo Steel, probably not Ferro Fibrous - not enough Critical Space
Assault Mechs - Probably Endo Steel (maybe not for a few Stalker/Atlas configs), No to Ferro Fibrous - Critical Space is very hard to come by

[Nathan Foxbane]

Some times, just some times Endo is too much weight savings for what you want. It is rare, but it happens.