24 replies to this topic

[Kanatta Jing]

Well, this new control has not helped many of my mechs.

Except for the Dragon 1C.

For the Dragon 1C can now switch between fast wide ranging arm shots with the dual medium lasers and the full barrage of all 4 medium lasers.

Before it was very difficult to utilize both banks of lasers effectively.

What mech chasis of yours is improved by the implementation of this control feature? And how?

[Child3k]

Hm ... I don't know. I haven't really played around with that one. With almost 1500 games since open beta I kinda never felt the need for such an option.

But - I can see how it could be handy on a mech like some trebs, where you got lasers in the arms and torso. But then again - I think with a little bit of training you can manage to get the two crosshairs aligned when you want to take the shot.

One thing to consider: New players my not realize that the arms can be moved independantly because the arm lock is activated from the beginning. Same with throttle decay (which in my opinion is totally useless ...).

Edited by Child3k, 28 March 2013 - 03:03 AM.

[Budor]

Its good to lead moving targets with torso mounted weapons at max torso-twist speed. Its good for alphas on anything with srms in the torso and arms. Its good for poptarting with the 3D loadout that has the gauss in the arm aso. Theres a lot off situations where i can see getting good use out of it.

BUT the keybind is not a toggle although it sais so and i simply dont have any keys left that i can hold while maintaining movement and accuracy

[JSparrowist]

Budor, on 28 March 2013 - 03:50 AM, said:

BUT the keybind is not a toggle although it sais so and i simply dont have any keys left that i can hold while maintaining movement and accuracy

I agree. This needs to be a toggle instead of momentary.

[SgtMagor]

if you have weapons in your arms, its going to limit there movement to stay converged with the torso weapons, if you pilot a JAG you can see how it limits the arm pitch.

[stjobe]

Very useful on my CN9-AL with 2xLL in RA and 2xML in CT.

Hold shift and fire both groups = all lasers hit the same spot.
Release shift and fire both groups = 2xLL on the Dragon and 2xML on the Jenner

[Roadbeer]

JSparrowist, on 28 March 2013 - 03:54 AM, said:

I agree. This needs to be a toggle instead of momentary.

THIS

[Barbaric Soul]

I find I prefer the arms locked in all situations, but then again, I'm a long time MW4 player. I've never been a fan of the floating reticle/fixed reticle of MW:O. Personally, I prefer a single fixed or floating reticle over two different types of reticles.

[MustrumRidcully]

I guess the basic rule is - if you want to fire your torso weapons with your arm weapons together, it's useful, since you ensure the crosshairs point at the same spot.

I could imagine it's particularly useful for mechs that mix heavy weapons like the Gauss Rifles or AC/20s in arm and torso. Which definitely applies to most Cataphracts.

I think it's bad that it's a default option, however - I doubt without a decent tutorial explaining this feature to them, new players will not find out about it.

Barbaric Soul, on 28 March 2013 - 04:06 AM, said:

I find I prefer the arms locked in all situations, but then again, I'm a long time MW4 player. I've never been a fan of the floating reticle/fixed reticle of MW:O. Personally, I prefer a single fixed or floating reticle over two different types of reticles.

The drawbacks is - in MW4 and in MW:O you limit your potential firing arc. What's - arms move faster than the torso. If you have to fight at close range (particularly against Light Mechs doing their circle of death) or trying to keep firing while your twist your torso away from incoming fire, you lose potential.

By activating this feature all the time, you have a drawback compared to someone that doesn't use arm lock. I can understand that it can be difficult to use, but it's a bit... dangerous to ignore the feature (or hide it from players.)


---

I suppose the real question is - why do we need Movement Decay?
But I figure that's for the Frst Person Shooter players - Normally you stop moving there the moment you stop pressing the A/S keys. Not sure they need it, but it might be enough that PGI believes they need it.
Movement Decay for FPS players, 3rd person perspective for ... Tomb Raider* fans?

(*Now I know why the Highlander has boobies.)

Edited by MustrumRidcully, 28 March 2013 - 04:18 AM.

[Piranha]

So far I like it on my TBT-7K where I only have weapons in the torso -> lock arms to avoid confusion in the heat of battle due to 2 different reticules.

However, I agree, that this should be either a toggle instead of this "hold down to change" mechanic or if it stays as it is, it should be at least a mech specific setting like weapon groups. I don't really see the point in a global setting.

[Barbaric Soul]

MustrumRidcully, on 28 March 2013 - 04:13 AM, said:

The drawbacks is - in MW4 and in MW:O you limit your potential firing arc. What's - arms move faster than the torso. If you have to fight at close range (particularly against Light Mechs doing their circle of death) or trying to keep firing while your twist your torso away from incoming fire, you lose potential.

By activating this feature all the time, you have a drawback compared to someone that doesn't use arm lock. I can understand that it can be difficult to use, but it's a bit... dangerous to ignore the feature (or hide it from players.)

It's only a drawback if you don't know how to deal with it. 10+ years of dealing with it in MW4 has made it second nature to me.

[Deamhan]

What I would like to see is the ability to control the arms and torso seperately. Sure the arms are connected to the pilots view so if you switch to free look and look around, you will move your arm reticle around too. Unfortunately, there is no way to seperate moving the torso from free look. You are either doing one, or the other but can't do both at the same time. I would love to be able to do both at the same time.

[MustrumRidcully]

Barbaric Soul, on 28 March 2013 - 04:34 AM, said:

It's only a drawback if you don't know how to deal with it. 10+ years of dealing with it in MW4 has made it second nature to me.

The difference between MW4 and MW:O is - in MW:O you also have to deal with people that don't lock armour and utilize their increased firing arc. In MW4, you mastered it fighting only people that had the same restrictions as you.
Maybe you're good enough to not need to care, of course. I wouldn't bet on that, but I tend to assume I am worse than I think I am, which always locks me in a recursion.

[Windsaw]

When I first started in my Commando in training I went up to an Atlas to practice headshots on an overheated mech...
and I couldn't!
Really, I couldn't aim so far up that I could hit his eyes, and I wasn't even in hugging distance.

Then I tried a battle. Turned out that I was now so horribly outmatched against another light and even other mechs in circling matches and run-by shootings that I permanently deactivated this feature.

That doesn't mean it's all bad. I used to pilot a Centurion where I sometimes wished for such a feature.
But please, it should not be default!
If you throw newbies in light mechs (or mediums) against seasoned players they are even more at a disadvantage than they were before. And they won't even know it unless they read the forums! It could take days or weeks for them to find out how much they limit themselves.

[Dustein]

I no not personally use the arm lock. That being said:
I really like that it has been added.
I really like that you can option to turn it off.
I really like that you can toggle it on/off with shift.

IMO it adds more to the game and allows for differing pilot play styles with zero interference to game balance.

Well done.

I can see potential for new users only having to focus on Aiming.. and not having to focus on "Aiming + Aiming".
Also for builds where you want/need to alpha and are extreme twisting; then lock to centre limits confusion/mistakes in the heat of battle.

~EDIT:
I posting thinking about TWIST. I now realise that PITCH is also locked. My above comments still stand with an addendum: it should be clearer to new users what all the controls are.

and by new user I mean that the assumption should be made that otehr than craeting an acount and cliking download that teh MWO website and forums are not viewed at all. 2nd assumption: the new player has never played any BT or MW game.
/EDIT~

Edited by Dustein, 28 March 2013 - 05:17 AM.

[Yarvoo]

I really like this feature.

I use it off by default, and frequently use shift to activate it for accurate alpha strikes when needed.

Also, when sniping, it's very handy as a way to increase aim precision, like lowering sensitivity temporarily.

[Mr 144]

JSparrowist, on 28 March 2013 - 03:54 AM, said:

I agree. This needs to be a toggle instead of momentary.

I have 'shift' bound to my x52 throttle's thumb slider so it acts like the toggle it should be. It is VERY nice as a toggle. I use it sporadically throughout just about every match.

Mr 144

[Hauser]

Regarding the toggle button for the arm lock rather then a push-to-(un)lock; I started a suggestion thread.

Might be useful to vote.

http://mwomercs.com/...rm-lock-toggle/

[Koniving]

Kanatta Jing, on 28 March 2013 - 02:48 AM, said:

Well, this new control has not helped many of my mechs.

Except for the Dragon 1C.

For the Dragon 1C can now switch between fast wide ranging arm shots with the dual medium lasers and the full barrage of all 4 medium lasers.

Before it was very difficult to utilize both banks of lasers effectively.

What mech chasis of yours is improved by the implementation of this control feature? And how?

Most mechs. I run with it off by default. This allows me to freely use my arms for things such as dancing, mocking my enemies while waiting for my heat to cool down (because I'll run a circle and dance around them in my super fast cataphract), shooting light mechs that run past me, and shooting high and low. I use CTRL for extra control.

Then, when I need to concentrate all my fire power to deal damage to something larger than me like an assault, I press shift -- all my weapons concentrate on the same point, press X to halt for added effect, and BAM! 45 damage in one specific spot. Limb removed. Accelerate and laugh maniacally.

Wash rinse repeat. Dance on the wreckage before the player can spectate or disconnect. Have people call my new Cataphract a cheese build.

Win!

Also voted no. A toggle would screw up my ability to fight effectively. It takes time to hit it to toggle back and forth for those situations when lights or other fast mechs are speeding by. Time that could let me shoot instead of being shot at.

By being able to hold it to arm-lock only when I need it, which is perhaps a few seconds out of any match, I'm in control. A toggle is worthless, as it takes that extra partial second, over and over, where I could have been shooting something with my arms. Even more when I forget to toggle it off.

Edited by Koniving, 28 March 2013 - 07:50 AM.

[Fherot]

I just found out about arm lock last night after I got the last kill in a match and some guy called me a 'arm lock newb'.

(My centurion only had torso mounted weapons at that point though so....)

Asked my friend and sure enough there was that pesky little option clicked on. Now I know why something about my aim and the reticle has been off from when I first gave the game a try months ago.

Now that I'm officially hooked as of last Saturday I still have lots to learn but I think I'd prefer to hold down Shift to disengage lock and by default not run around with floppy arms.

I wish I had known about shift / arm lock last few nights there were so many annoying lights who I could have cored or people above me on a hill I could have AC'ed.

I think a toggle would just throw me off and in the middle of a battle I'd lose track of it, holding down shift makes it deliberate. Maybe atleast make it a further option for those who want it as a toggle.