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Why A Lack Of Consumable Complaints?


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#1 Victor Morson

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Posted 04 April 2013 - 11:34 PM

The new consumables - Airstrike and Artillery - are literally the two most underpowered and worthless things ever added to MW:O, well behind Flamers.

Currently both more or less have the same behavior, with Airstrikes standing a far better chance of actually hitting something (which still isn't much). But really, each has the same set of problems:

Damage: Even if you manage a direct hit, you see more from ram damage.

Accuracy: A very, very tiny impact area that gets hit after a very long delay insures any half awake player isn't likely to be hit.

Functionality: Both are basically redresses of the same concept. Why isn't artillery area denial, like a 30 second barrage to force 'mechs from a grid? Why is it a tiny two-mech sized radius?

Upgrades: The upgrades attempt to focus damage by tightening the already tiny impact radius, insuring that absolutely nothing will be hit by your improved damage, ever.

Visuals: They appear like tiny fire crackers coming down, like someone found a spark effect and it was their first try with the Crytek particle editor. Missiles from the airstrikes emerge from nowhere. Nothing about either one screams what it even is if we weren't told. The explosions are weak, the impacts are weaker. No screen shake even. It's hard to tell you've even been shelled!

Sound: No warning sounds, no alarms, no loud explosions. No sounds of shells dropping or aircraft swooping. No, it is almost silent as the bunch of glittering particles land on you.

Interface: They've already said they're adding map support, so there's that. Still, no impact markers on your minimap or any GUI notifications of any kind makes it seem like a serious non-event.

Value: NONE. I can't imagine people paying MC for that model, and I unfortunately sank 30,000 GXP into getting both Improved Airstrikes and Improved Artillery. This review was about them. The basic models are so pathetic I could not tell if they were even firing 50% of the time.

--

I know we were worried about these being OP and such, but seriously, these are the single most half-assed thing ever put into MW:O and I don't even think they have business being live. They need not only a huge buff, but they need almost a ground up reworking of how they function to be comparable to even several year old games that have similar capabilities in them.

I'm not asking for them to be super powerful - definitely not - but I am asking for them to do something. I believe artillery should be very damaging, but take much longer to come in, cover a wider area and last for a duration, for example, to act as area denial. Airstrikes should come from actual aerospace fighter or VTOL models, and I don't think that's asking for the moon on a Crytek engine game. And finally, they should actually have an impact area that makes them useful.

Anyway I'm shocked there's not more threads on these, just a few comment threads on the patch notes. I think most people tried the cheap versions and didn't bother with anything more, but if you're like me and did, my God you want these things fixed to some state of worthiness.

EDIT: While not the improved versions, this video belongs in this thread.


Not the Improved versions, but wow. A stationary Commando can't even get hit when you land a shot at it's feet and it's stock armor barely gets dented by an air strike.

Edited by Victor Morson, 05 April 2013 - 12:15 AM.


#2 RiceyFighter

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Posted 04 April 2013 - 11:35 PM

I think they made them that weak because the average pug player aren't really smart. Making them any stronger and they will be just used to kill off novices early in game. I mean really though, I see a lot of pugs just run up and die, not using cover, and can't even aim properly. I think they would probably just stand there and take the artillery/air strike hits.

Got to keep them new player retention rate.

Good because they are suppose to be support weapons not OP weapons.

Edited by RiceyFighter, 04 April 2013 - 11:40 PM.


#3 Victor Morson

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Posted 04 April 2013 - 11:37 PM

View PostRiceyFighter, on 04 April 2013 - 11:35 PM, said:

Good because they are suppose to be support weapons not OP weapons.


When will you people learn SUPPORT WEAPONS is not code for WORTHLESS?

This comes up on every thread that doesn't involve "big cannon" or "big laser." If you start your sentence with "But it shouldn't do any reasonable damage, it's a support w--" just do everyone a favor and stop.

#4 Zylo

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Posted 04 April 2013 - 11:37 PM

Maybe players aren't complaining because most don't want this to be a ******* consumable driven pay-to-win game?

#5 Victor Morson

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Posted 04 April 2013 - 11:38 PM

View PostZylo, on 04 April 2013 - 11:37 PM, said:

Maybe players aren't complaining because most don't want this to be a ******* consumable driven pay-to-win game?


Why do people still think that? I paid 30,000 GXP, which I obtained for free, to upgrade my consumables to the exact level of the MC ones. That's right, I paid $0 for the ability to use the exact quality Airstrike* of someone who just bought 50,000 MCs worth.

That is not pay 2 win. What will it take for people to get that? If anything the MC ones are the most worthless of all.

* Which is no quality because they are entirely worthless. In particular the VERY free version.

Edited by Victor Morson, 04 April 2013 - 11:40 PM.


#6 Smokem Jags

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Posted 04 April 2013 - 11:39 PM

Same reason you don't see constant NARC threads or people using NARC. It's so worthless, it's under the radar entirely.

#7 MonkeyCheese

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Posted 04 April 2013 - 11:40 PM

I used them a few times, but they are meh, barely put a scratch on a commando in the testing grounds. forgotten about them already.

#8 Victor Morson

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Posted 04 April 2013 - 11:41 PM

View PostSmokem Jags, on 04 April 2013 - 11:39 PM, said:

Same reason you don't see constant NARC threads or people using NARC. It's so worthless, it's under the radar entirely.


I'd argue the NARC is more worthwhile than these, and the NARC is horrendous.

For what it's worth, though, I've started many NARC threads suggesting they up the range and give it lock as that made it a FAR superior weapon in Living Legends. The NARC deserves a buff thread too.

#9 Zylo

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Posted 04 April 2013 - 11:45 PM

View PostVictor Morson, on 04 April 2013 - 11:38 PM, said:


Why do people still think that? I paid 30,000 GXP, which I obtained for free, to upgrade my consumables to the exact level of the MC ones. That's right, I paid $0 for the ability to use the exact quality Airstrike* of someone who just bought 50,000 MCs worth.

That is not pay 2 win. What will it take for people to get that? If anything the MC ones are the most worthless of all.

* Which is no quality because they are entirely worthless. In particular the VERY free version.

Well it should be obvious but I'll explain the plan that PGI is probably using for consumables:

All consumables come with a MC purchased version.
All consumables also have C-bill versions.
C-bill versions can be upgraded with large amounts of GXP.

This works great for 1, 2 or even 3 consumable options but PGI will almost certainly start introducing new consumables faster than most players can gain GXP to unlock them.

If the consumables become TOO GOOD it will essentially force the use of the MC versions because few players will have enough GXP to unlock everything. That's how it becomes pay-to-win.

All of this could have been avoided if players wouldn't have whined so much about repair/rearm costs (lets face it, mechs should have never been allowed to drop with less than 100% repair or 100% ammo).

Edited by Zylo, 04 April 2013 - 11:45 PM.


#10 Texas Merc

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Posted 04 April 2013 - 11:46 PM

Im more pissed I wasted some gxp to see if it made it any better

#11 80sGlamRockSensation David Bowie

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Posted 04 April 2013 - 11:46 PM

The reason being, they pretty much suck (cool shot 9 by 9 is ok, I guess) and are currently a non-issues in the game until they see further changes. Right now, people have bigger concerns like constant UI bugs, graphic flickering and Crash-to-Desktop™.

If artillery and airstrike actually did anything useful, then there would be plenty of complaints. Until then enjoy their virtual non-presence while you can.

#12 MonkeyCheese

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Posted 04 April 2013 - 11:49 PM

View PostTexas Merc, on 04 April 2013 - 11:46 PM, said:

Im more pissed I wasted some gxp to see if it made it any better


dont worry I am too, and im sure lots of other people would be in the same boat.

#13 Victor Morson

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Posted 04 April 2013 - 11:50 PM

View PostZylo, on 04 April 2013 - 11:45 PM, said:

C-bill versions can be upgraded with large amounts of GXP.

This works great for 1, 2 or even 3 consumable options but PGI will almost certainly start introducing new consumables faster than most players can gain GXP to unlock them.


Given you can only take three modules on a 'mech, this isn't a problem. The modules are being turned into what we were promised the Pilot Tree would be: Ways to add quirky specialties to our 'mechs, consumable or perm (like the targeting modules or capping modules.) Adding more variety is not P2W, and budgeting how you spend your GXP is your decision as a player.

View PostZylo, on 04 April 2013 - 11:45 PM, said:

If the consumables become TOO GOOD it will essentially force the use of the MC versions because few players will have enough GXP to unlock everything. That's how it becomes pay-to-win.


1: Never asked for too good. Asked for cool and worthwhile.

2: Also, this means the SUPER free versions should ALSO be cool and worthwhile, otherwise what's the point of having them, even if they are less powerful?

3: Remember, every module taken for these things takes a slot so unlocking everything at once will do you no good, and never will.

View PostZylo, on 04 April 2013 - 11:45 PM, said:

All of this could have been avoided if players wouldn't have whined so much about repair/rearm costs (lets face it, mechs should have never been allowed to drop with less than 100% repair or 100% ammo).


And what does that have to do with the fact that airstrikes and artillery are horribly implemented, amateur looking non-damaging weapons that can't hit anything?

I don't think ANYONE can debate them being useful right now. They aren't. In any way, shape or form.

#14 Texas Merc

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Posted 04 April 2013 - 11:50 PM

View PostMonkeyCheese, on 04 April 2013 - 11:49 PM, said:


dont worry I am too, and im sure lots of other people would be in the same boat.


Oh yeah I only wasted a small amount I know some suckers that went in full 40k gxp

#15 Victor Morson

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Posted 04 April 2013 - 11:52 PM

View PostTexas Merc, on 04 April 2013 - 11:50 PM, said:


Oh yeah I only wasted a small amount I know some suckers that went in full 40k gxp


Even worse than me are the guys who didn't just go 30k in to get the improved modules, but the extra 10k for the "Accuracy." That actually makes the weapons far worse and I've heard there's no way to turn it off.

#16 Texas Merc

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Posted 04 April 2013 - 11:52 PM

Hey Vic I notice that if you just put out the red smoke it gets people off their spot and that works well enough for me.

#17 The Cheese

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Posted 04 April 2013 - 11:52 PM

Tried the advanced arty out and was pretty underwhelmed. The damage didn't seem to phase the enemy, even though it came down right on top of two of them, and the graphical effects were pretty tame.

I was expecting Hollywood style explosions. You know, like the napalm strikes you see in Vietnam war movies.

#18 Victor Morson

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Posted 04 April 2013 - 11:54 PM

View PostTexas Merc, on 04 April 2013 - 11:52 PM, said:

Hey Vic I notice that if you just put out the red smoke it gets people off their spot and that works well enough for me.


I was seeing that earlier, and also tricking people into it (granted, not very good pilots, but still) by putting it behind them then firing to make them back up.

The problem is when they DID get hit, almost nothing happened. People are catching on (not many people are using the stuff) and now people won't even try to dodge it, because they realize it's probably not going to hit them anyway and even if it does, it won't do much.

It did work for a bit, though.

#19 Demos

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Posted 04 April 2013 - 11:54 PM

Yeah, I saw today an Arty strike for the first strike. It was so pathetic. Had to stop my mech and laugh...

I'd prefer some when Arty would be aimed by the map and saturate an area (box with 100m sides or a circle with 50m radius) with some powerful shells with splash damage. If you are really unlucky you will be hit directly or nearby shell with nearly full damage (like 20-30 points --> Long Tom) or some splash damage with a distance of 15m (~10 points) or 30m (~5 points) respectively.

Same for Airstrikes: These should be definitely targeted by map with a choosen flight path.

And for the cats sake: Some real graphical and sound effects, please.

#20 RiceyFighter

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Posted 04 April 2013 - 11:55 PM

View PostBuddahcjcc, on 04 April 2013 - 11:52 PM, said:

hence, 3rd person view
but no tutorials rofl


PGI and their infinite wisdom at work LOL!





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