252 replies to this topic

[Sephlock]

EgoSlayer, on 09 April 2013 - 08:04 PM, said:

This^

The previous system created an unbreakable stun lock. That is by very definition an exploit. Stuns suck, unbreakable stun locks are an exploit.

Mech A knocks down Mech B
Mech B takes 4 seconds to stand up - pilot B is unable to do anything except watch the 3rd person view of standing up
Mech A hits Mech B again at the 3 second mark, knocking them down and resetting the fall down/stand up effect.
Repeat until bored, or until teammates/Mech A decide to shoot Mech B.

It was a lame, easily exploited, and abused system.

It was also HILARIOUS.

[Ricama]

Yokaiko, on 09 April 2013 - 03:07 PM, said:

Charge
Weight divided 10 times hexes moved during the turn, all fractions rounded up in 5 point clusters to the defender, the attacker takes tonnage divided by 10 again in 5 pointers, hit location determined by angle of attack

DFA is roughly the same thing, except that if the defender takes attacker's weight divided by ten x3, then has to make a pilot check or take his OWN weight divided by ten.

...obviously this would difficult to model.

For one we can't declare a charge, and even then, how exactly do you derive hexes when everyone just runs around full throttle all of the time.

For those of us who ran numbers it goes like this: full speed charge = engine rating/10, slower speeds is a percentage of that. It's a fairly easy calculation to make it's just the warping that's a huge problem.

[Jeff K Notagoon]

Megalosauroid, on 09 April 2013 - 09:15 AM, said:

3) Collisions were working fine in closed beta apart from the cosmetic issue of mechs teleporting around during the knockdown/get back up animation. Mechanics wise they were perfectly fine and the game is much worse off without them.

Disagree. Collisions were broken as heck. Barely tap a friendly mech and you both went tumbling down. Repeat several times per match and it was extremely annoying and being removed was just what the game needed.

[Sr Digby Chicken Caesar]

I stopped playing my Jenner right about when they removed collisions. In many ways it removed the necessity to have skill piloting them. Situation awareness in lights went down the drain pretty quickly after that.

[Caviel]

Megalosauroid, on 09 April 2013 - 09:15 AM, said:

3) Collisions were working fine in closed beta apart from the cosmetic issue of mechs teleporting around during the knockdown/get back up animation.

I read this as "Collisions are fine, except were they were not."

Quote

Mechanics wise they were perfectly fine and the game is much worse off without them.

I disagree entirely. Atlases could walk off a hill/ledge and land on a Jenner, causing damage to the Atlas legs, none to the Jenner, and the Atlas getting knocked over. I wouldn't call that perfectly fine.

Atlases could walk right through each other, no damage and no problem. Also not perfectly fine.

Landing on a Catapult cockpit would temporarily fling your mech in the air across the map before the server warped you back to where you were. Still doesn't sound perfectly fine to me.

Quote

TL;DR - don't let our discontent with the way collisions are being handled get buried/forgotten under the s***storm of other complaints.

It isn't buried or forgotten, just a lower priority over other things deemed more important. Host State Rewind is going to remove a lot of the "need" we had for collisions back then due to the high mech speeds and net code warping/issues making it nigh impossible to hit a 150 kph Jenner.

PGI didn't say no or never, just not right now. I agree with the priority of HSR first as an example since it will do much more than collisions/DFA to improve the overall state of the game.

[MacKoga]

Corbon Zackery, on 09 April 2013 - 09:25 AM, said:

Collisions were being exploited by closed beta testers.

A example being one light mech colliding with a second light in front of many heavy's for a quick kill. Colliding to break streak locks. Colliding to break LRM lock. FF collisions huge reason there gone.

If we were battlemech pilots in real life, one light tackling another to line up a shot for a heavy mech ally would be a totally legit tactic. So is tackling enemies who have carefully setup weapon locks.

In other words, these are things that reasonably should be in the game, and ultimately should be taken into consideration by PGI when balancing the game. Therefore, I would recommend collisions be figured out alongside netcode, and be in before launch.

[Corvus Antaka]

MacKoga, on 17 April 2013 - 12:03 AM, said:

If we were battlemech pilots in real life, one light tackling another to line up a shot for a heavy mech ally would be a totally legit tactic. So is tackling enemies who have carefully setup weapon locks.

In other words, these are things that reasonably should be in the game, and ultimately should be taken into consideration by PGI when balancing the game. Therefore, I would recommend collisions be figured out alongside netcode, and be in before launch.

no clans till 2014. hope is fading fast that anything is going to be done in any kind of timely manner anymore.

[Windsaw]

Corbon Zackery, on 09 April 2013 - 09:25 AM, said:

Collisions were being exploited by closed beta testers.

A example being one light mech colliding with a second light in front of many heavy's for a quick kill. Colliding to break streak locks. Colliding to break LRM lock. FF collisions huge reason there gone.

After reading through your examples for exploits this reads to me like "medium lasers were being exploited because people aimed with them before they fired them"

Really, your examples listed the whole point of having knockdowns in: So that good pilots could compete with other mechs through piloting.
If you mean piloting skills shouldn't give you a serious advantage, then I guess yes, knockdowns should stay out.

[Ryvucz]

Wait And See^TM

[RainbowToh]

During closed beta, watching a high speed commando knocking over an Atlas was fun.

[CMDR Sunset Shimmer]

"Some time after launch" Is probably the same time as Clans... which is 6 months after launch [which is probably september, but we have no "set" date]

You know i'm actually less upset about no colission damage/knockdowns than I am about the delays to community warfare and the clans. And I'm not even a clan fan.

[Screech]

Graygave, on 10 April 2013 - 02:20 PM, said:

Situation awareness in lights went down the drain pretty quickly after that.

Ummm, its not just lights, its all mechs now. If I had a nickle for every time a teammate tried to walk through me I would have $32.85 now.

[MrPenguin]

Is it "lets revive dead threads" day on the forum or something?