40 replies to this topic

[Buck Rogers]

In Battletech canon assault mechs are a rarity while 20 ton mechs are the norm. A planetary assault almost universally involves several lances of Wasps, Stingers, and Locusts.

Reseen, Unseen, Original Designs Only, whatever is viable, but I want 20 ton mechs in the game .

---Buck.

[saber15]

As much as I love cramming Commandos (25 tons but whatever) and Locusts down the throats of players in the boardgame, they tend to be laughable jokes in the video games.

[xesle]

The Devs said there's going to be a focus on information warfare rather than simply racing to see who can grab assault mechs first, so maybe 20 ton mechs will prove useful as scouts.

Edited by xesle, 31 October 2011 - 01:48 PM.

[Mitchpate]

The only time 20 ton mechs are useless is in open matches. In competitive gameplay, a 20 ton scout is more valuable than a lance of assaults.

[CoffiNail]

wants my firemoth please!

[SquareSphere]

20 Tonners might have a place but i'm having a hard time thinking they can do anything better than a 35 Tonner that's spec'd out for Recon/eWarfare

[Buck Rogers]

In Battetech, it's all about the money.

1 35 ton Jenner costs 3,296,925 C-Bills.
1 20 ton Stinger costs 1,725,120 C-Bills.
1 100 ton Atlas costs 22,474,000 C-Bills.

If you play as a merc in MW:O, it would be very non-canon to not have 20 ton mechs, because they're by far the cheapest, and most produced. Don't some canon mercenary teams rely solely on 20 ton mechs for raiding and the like? If scouting is a big part of the game, then 20 ton mechs really come into their own.

---Buck.

[Youngblood]

Does anyone get the feeling that we might have to progress through to heavier tonnages in order to fill the Scout/Attacker/Defender/etc. roles described in MWO?

[Buck Rogers]

Grayson Death Carlyle started off with a 20 ton Locust, then got a 45 ton Shadowhawk, then got a... You get the idea. If we're to play in-universe-realistic mercs in MW:O, then we should definitely have to progress through heavier tonnages.

I keep saying, I imagine the advancement in game will be very similar to World Of Tanks. Which is not a bad thing at all. World Of Mechs here we come!

---Buck.

[Youngblood]

I'm a World of Tanks player too. Bring on the galaxy!

[Threat Doc]

buck rogers, on 31 October 2011 - 01:38 PM, said:

In Battletech canon assault mechs are a rarity while 20 ton mechs are the norm. A planetary assault almost universally involves several lances of Wasps, Stingers, and Locusts.

Reseen, Unseen, Original Designs Only, whatever is viable, but I want 20 ton mechs in the game .

---Buck.

Ummm, no... 20-ton 'Mechs are only slightly less-rare than Assaults. Most often, you have the mid-range 'Mechs, 35 - 75 ton, you'll see those far more often than the extremes of the ton scale.

I don't necessarily agree with moving up the ranks of tonnage types because you're advancing through the game. I think the various types of game-play they're suggesting will determine the types of machines available at whatever rank.

[Marauder3D]

kay wolf, on 31 October 2011 - 03:32 PM, said:

Ummm, no... 20-ton 'Mechs are only slightly less-rare than Assaults. Most often, you have the mid-range 'Mechs, 35 - 75 ton, you'll see those far more often than the extremes of the ton scale.

Umm, double no. As far as BT canon goes, 20 tonners are exceedingly common. Assaults make up like 5% of all machines. Mediums are slightly less common than lights, going from 40-55. Buck Rogers had the right of it.

[Andrew Harvey]

kay wolf, on 31 October 2011 - 03:32 PM, said:

Ummm, no... 20-ton 'Mechs are only slightly less-rare than Assaults. Most often, you have the mid-range 'Mechs, 35 - 75 ton, you'll see those far more often than the extremes of the ton scale.

Stinger: "Estimates place the number of operational Stingers currently used by the Successor States at 5,000 or more."
Wasp: "-records show that thousands were constructed in the 4 centuries preceding the Succession Wars. Though many of these have been worn out or destroyed, estimates show that more than half this total is still in operation."
Locust: "-one of the most produced and common Battlemechs of the fallen Star League."

Straight from the TROs. There may be many more types of Assault Battlemechs, but there's no doubt that Stingers, Wasps, and Locusts outnumber them by a fair amount.

[Nebfer]

marauder3d, on 31 October 2011 - 04:02 PM, said:

Umm, double no. As far as BT canon goes, 20 tonners are exceedingly common. Assaults make up like 5% of all machines. Mediums are slightly less common than lights, going from 40-55. Buck Rogers had the right of it.

Actually in battle tech its something like 10% assaults, 20% heavy's, 40% mediums and 30% lights is the norm (medium mechs have always been the work horse for most factions). Though a few have different numbers, house Steiner has more heavy's and assaults (and reduced numbers of lights and mediums), house Marik has fewer assaults but more heavy's, and Kurita trades out mediums for lights and heavy's.

[Threat Doc]

Thanks guys, I was going to start sniping, but it's not really worth my time. Been doin' this is '85, so I think I have a bit of an idea. Of course, information in this universe changes ALL the time, so five of us could read, and quote from, five different sources, and come up with five different answers. It's all good for me. Frankly, I think the more Lights and Mediums the better.

[Marauder3D]

kay wolf, on 31 October 2011 - 06:31 PM, said:

Thanks guys, I was going to start sniping, but it's not really worth my time. Been doin' this is '85, so I think I have a bit of an idea. Of course, information in this universe changes ALL the time, so five of us could read, and quote from, five different sources, and come up with five different answers. It's all good for me. Frankly, I think the more Lights and Mediums the better.

Sorry, didn't mean to come off snippy. Yeah, there are a lot of different sources for the breakdown of assets. My old, ripped apart and bindered TRO 3025 I bought in the 80s was the source I was thinking of. And I totally agree, as long as there are a lot of medium and light assets to choose from, I'll be happy.

[Helmer]

SWARM!!! Loved seeing 7 20 ton Locusts take out a Single Battlemaster on MPBT solaris.

Agreed with the points above, many times it was the economics that commanders needed to be mindful of.

If a year after release Lights and Mediums are still very popular I will consider the Developers jobs done, and done well. It's my hope they do so.

[daniel l siata]

I do love my 20 Tonners, would be ridiculous to think that they wouldn't be around, especially with a focus on EW.

[StoneRhino]

buck rogers, on 31 October 2011 - 03:11 PM, said:

Grayson Death Carlyle started off with a 20 ton Locust, then got a 45 ton Shadowhawk, then got a... You get the idea. If we're to play in-universe-realistic mercs in MW:O, then we should definitely have to progress through heavier tonnages.

I keep saying, I imagine the advancement in game will be very similar to World Of Tanks. Which is not a bad thing at all. World Of Mechs here we come!

---Buck.

I don't think that is really going to happen. Was he going from a light mech because he was a scout, or because that is all they could afford at the time? Did he go from that to a heavier mech because he was trying to scout in that mech, or because they could afford it, and he was becoming more important then just another one of the many merc groups that start up with a big chance of failing? What role was he filling within his organization? I never read any of the books involving Grey Death, but I would think that he progressed to heavier mechs because he was never trying to serve as the scout, and that the commander was trying to keep himself as safe as he could within their means.

As for WOT goes, it is far to heavy tank.....heavy. As the OP mentioned, there should be more of the lighter units then the heaviest running around on the field. WOT does not factor in cost to a nation/organization, just what the player has unlocked. I have not read anything about the mechanics of this game, yet, so I am not sure if they are going to address cost to units being used and lost, or if we are just going to get our mechs repaired at the end of a match like WOT. Hopefully there is much more structure to it then WOT's MM.

[Raj]

stonerhino, on 31 October 2011 - 07:30 PM, said:

I don't think that is really going to happen. Was he going from a light mech because he was a scout, or because that is all they could afford at the time? Did he go from that to a heavier mech because he was trying to scout in that mech, or because they could afford it, and he was becoming more important then just another one of the many merc groups that start up with a big chance of failing? What role was he filling within his organization? I never read any of the books involving Grey Death, but I would think that he progressed to heavier mechs because he was never trying to serve as the scout, and that the commander was trying to keep himself as safe as he could within their means.

As for WOT goes, it is far to heavy tank.....heavy. As the OP mentioned, there should be more of the lighter units then the heaviest running around on the field. WOT does not factor in cost to a nation/organization, just what the player has unlocked. I have not read anything about the mechanics of this game, yet, so I am not sure if they are going to address cost to units being used and lost, or if we are just going to get our mechs repaired at the end of a match like WOT. Hopefully there is much more structure to it then WOT's MM.

It's been many many years since I read the books but as I recall he captured both the locust and shadowhawk (the locust completely undamaged since he fried it with flamers and made the pilot freak out). In the next book he had a crusader and griffen I believe? I don't remember how they got them....I think they brought in pilots that owned their own mech. And later picked up a Marader from the antagonist of one of the books.

As for WoT. The main issue I have with it is the lights serve only as spotters for SPGs (artillery) in later games. Their weapons cannot penetrate the larger tanks armor (realistic though that is it's not very fun).

Edited by raj, 31 October 2011 - 08:35 PM.