182 replies to this topic

[Arrogusss]

I have been researching Sarna, and some of the older 3050 technical readouts and such. As the "Rumor" has it that there are multiple Clan Concepts already sketched out, It made me wonder if these Mechs will make playing with any or all of our favorites we have mastered and tweaked Obsolete.

I do realize that the devs really do take little pieces of Lore info and incorporate them into the game as much as they can. Sarna states the Stalker has Heat issues, so guess what? 20 DHS in my stalker variant and it still has HEAT ISSUES. Sarna says the Jager is more of a support mech and is not fond of taking direct fire, guess what; I get stuck in the wrong place and wrong time in my Jager and within seconds D-E-A-T-H.

So my point is that in the Lore it states that the return Of the original Exodus forces as the Clan with the superior lost tech and their "Omnimechs" dominated the battlefield. Will MWO try to rebirth the game with the intro of the Clan Mechs and Tech during the official launch, releasing 8 or so variants all at once? Will they be superior?
Should these new variants be highly expensive or require an extensive grind to unlock if they do end up being superior in one way or another?
I am really hoping for 2 new Clan mech chassis in each weight class. I know the majority of you are thinking MADCAT MADCAT MADCAT!! Which I am sure is one of the sketches already done. But if I have a slim to ZERO chance of ever getting an Unseen Warhammer in game, Please let me have a
LOKI/Hellbringer.
http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Hellbringer_(Loki)
The Original Question Stands, Will the Clan Mechs/Tech make the Current models inferior or obsolete?

Edited by Arrogusss, 12 April 2013 - 08:14 AM.

[Syllogy]

No.

Why? Because Magic.

Real Reason: Clan mechs have their own restrictions that they must adhere to.

For example, All Clan Mechs have XL Engines. They cannot equip Standard Engines. Clan Mechs cannot even change their Armor, Engine, or Internal Structure.

Also, Clan Weapons are notoriously hot.

The following is an assumption, without knowing how PGI has designed Clan Mechs.

This means that Inner Sphere Mechs will enjoy the following:

• Ability to change Armor Type
  
• Ability to change Structure Type
  
• Ability to use Standard Engines
  
• Weapons are much cooler than Clan Tech

Meanwhile, Clan Mechs will enjoy the following:

• Harder Hitting and/or Lighter Weapons
  
• Less Crit Space taken up by some weapons and utility items like Double Heat Sinks
  
• Greater Customization Options when it comes to Weapon Hardpoints. (Omni Points)

Edited by Syllogy, 12 April 2013 - 08:16 AM.

[Inyc]

Even if they let players in Clan Mechs fight players in Inner Sphere mechs, player skill will still be the determining factor. Just like a Spider or a Centurion or a Jagermech can win a straight fight against an Atlas right now based on player skill.

Honestly I'd love to go up against Timberwolves in my CN9.

But apparently the two types of mech will get separate queues. Kinda boring.

[Juree Riggd]

After clan tech starts getting salvaged and we get access to the same weapons, the only difference between clan mechs and IS mechs is that there will be Omni hardpoints instead of specific weapon type hardpoints.

[alexivy]

Just aim for the shoulder. They all pack XLs.

[Stanton Langley]

There will need to be adjustments to construction rules for IS mechs to keep them pertinent. All else being equal, most clan mechs are faster in stock configuration. And then, there is still the fact that all else is not equal...

[Rakashan]

Absolutely, Clan tech will make everything in the game totally obsolete. How do I know (given that we know absolutely nothing about the Clans and very little about CW right now)? Simple. Who cares whether or not we know anything? Better to scream that the sky is falling and generate electrons than to use search for the weekly thread on this topic or the answer that clans didn't go 1vs1 against anyone but clans and so you kinda expect that something will be done to balance them even if it is unbalanced drops. (And heaven knows we have plenty of evidence that the matchmaker right now knows how to provide unbalanced drops!)

[3rdworld]

alexivy, on 12 April 2013 - 08:14 AM, said:

Just aim for the shoulder. They all pack XLs.

Shouldering a clan mech won't kill it. only 2 crits to the engine per side torso.

[Syllogy]

alexivy, on 12 April 2013 - 08:14 AM, said:

Just aim for the shoulder. They all pack XLs.

Except for the part where just destroying one shoulder will not destroy a Clan XL Engine. You need to destroy 3 crit slots to destroy an engine.

In other words, in order to destroy the engine of a Clan Mech, you must destroy both Side Torsos or the Center Torso.

Edited by Syllogy, 12 April 2013 - 08:19 AM.

[alexivy]

Syllogy, on 12 April 2013 - 08:18 AM, said:

Except for the part where just destroying one shoulder will not destroy a Clan XL Engine. You need to destroy 3 crit slots to destroy an engine.

In other words, in order to destroy the engine of a Clan Mech, you must destroy both Side Torsos or the Center Torso.

ermagerd we're all gonna die!!

[3rdworld]

Syllogy, on 12 April 2013 - 08:11 AM, said:

No.

Why? Because Magic.

Real Reason: Clan mechs have their own restrictions that they must adhere to.

For example, All Clan Mechs have XL Engines. They cannot equip Standard Engines. Clan Mechs cannot even change their Armor, Engine, or Internal Structure.

Also, Clan Weapons are notoriously hot.

The following is an assumption, without knowing how PGI has designed Clan Mechs.

This means that Inner Sphere Mechs will enjoy the following:

• Ability to change Armor Type
  
• Ability to change Structure Type
  
• Ability to use Standard Engines
  
• Weapons are much cooler than Clan Tech

Meanwhile, Clan Mechs will enjoy the following:

• Harder Hitting and/or Lighter Weapons
  
• Less Crit Space taken up by some weapons and utility items like Double Heat Sinks
  
• Greater Customization Options when it comes to Weapon Hardpoints. (Omni Points)

If they cannot increase their armor many of them will be trash.

The stock Thor will only have 306 armor. Woefully low for a 70 tonner. The Loki would only have 214. Could you imagine a Catapult running around with only 214 armor?

EDIT: Rofl the Mad Cat only has 396....

So basically all of their mechs except their assaults run next to no armor.

Edited by 3rdworld, 12 April 2013 - 08:24 AM.

[Adridos]

In reality, it is a 2-sided coin.

If they follow canon and Btech rules, then the IS mechs are screwed as the only thing barely saving our ***** is the BV.

If they don't follow those same rules, then the Calnner mechs are screwed, because they couldn't work in MW:O.

[WildeKarde]

They really only make IS mechs obsolete as currently an atlas is equivalent to the daishi for the matchmaker.

Personally I'd like to be you can only use the standard config's with clans for a starting point. No cheese builds allowed.

If we want a challenge then IS vs Clan is stock only for both sides with more mechs / weight / elo on the IS side

[General Taskeen]

Syllogy, on 12 April 2013 - 08:11 AM, said:

Also, Clan Weapons are notoriously hot.

Regarding this specifically, sometimes its a balance measure in games like MW:LL or older titles.

However, the Clan weapons that are "hotter" from Battle Tech are due to the fact that most Clan Mechs equip an "ER" version of a normal laser, which are hotter by default. An IS version of an ER Medium Laser, for instance, shoots for the same heat. ER PPC's and regular pulse lasers have the same heat as IS counterparts, but do more damage. Again, most games balanced that by making the Clan counterpart weapon fire closer to the base heat, and lower the IS heat.

UAC's, LB-X, SRMs, SSRMs, LRMs, etc. are the same heat as IS counterparts, their main difference is that Clan stuff weighs less, or has a little better range, but do the same damage/heat.

[Star Captain Obvious Kerensky]

As soon as clan mechs hit, I'm done with IS mechs. While people like to say you cannot alter a clan mech, by lore it is easier to alter a clan mech than an IS mech. And we are allowed to customize an IS mech any way we want.

Sure a skilled IS pilot can kill a bad Clan Pilot. But why should I handycap myself in an IS mech?

Dual UAC20 Loki that moves at 86 KPH and ECM? Good luck beating that with an IS mech.

[FupDup]

Syllogy, on 12 April 2013 - 08:11 AM, said:

Clan Mechs cannot even change their Armor, Engine, or Internal Structure.

That's Omnimechs you're thinking of, not standard Battlemechs. Clans use standard BMs once in a while too...

Also, in the lore/TT, Omnis were in fact able to change out those things but in doing so they reverted into a standard Battlemech and thus lost their Omni-powers. While it might be a nice balancing mechanism to break away from the lore and permalock Omnis into staying Omnis, I just wanted to point that out.

In TT, being an Omnimech actually meant something whereas here in MWO pretty much everything is an Omnimech already but better in every way.

Syllogy, on 12 April 2013 - 08:11 AM, said:

Also, Clan Weapons are notoriously hot.

Their heat buildup is identical to their IS counterparts (comparing a standard IS laser to a Clan ER laser is invalid because they're not the same). The Clan UAC/10 actually has 1 less heat than its IS version. Also, Clan Gauss Rifles and Streaks everywhere.

Edited by FupDup, 12 April 2013 - 08:33 AM.

[Novakaine]

There are no Clans.
The Clans do no exist.
The Clans are a myth.
You have been warned.
FedCom MilSec

[NinetyProof]

It all depends upon how PGI implements clan tech.

First off, I don't think they will release a "slew" of anything all at one ... bad for their business model. I would be more like a Line per month, Hero first, then variants a couple weeks later.

Second off, I am not sure how they would "balance" omniTech into the current system. Once you can put *anything* *anywhere*, then variety in chassis is almost non-existent for all intent and purpose (min/maxing).

Got to wait and see what they intend to do ... maybe all my old stuff will fall by the wayside ... then again, if it does, that means PGI won't be able to see that stuff to newbies either. Somehow I don't see them implementing it in a way that means they can't sell the previous trash hero chassis to new players.

Edited by NinetyProof, 12 April 2013 - 08:53 AM.

[Novakaine]

There are no Clans.
The Clans do no exist.
The Clans are a myth.
You have been warned.
FedCom MilSec

[Arrogusss]

Eldragon, on 12 April 2013 - 08:26 AM, said:

As soon as clan mechs hit, I'm done with IS mechs. While people like to say you cannot alter a clan mech, by lore it is easier to alter a clan mech than an IS mech. And we are allowed to customize an IS mech any way we want.

Sure a skilled IS pilot can kill a bad Clan Pilot. But why should I handycap myself in an IS mech?

Dual UAC20 Loki that moves at 86 KPH and ECM? Good luck beating that with an IS mech.

"Dual UAC20 Loki that moves at 86 KPH and ECM? Good luck beating that with an IS mech."^

This is exactly the thinking pattern I had, hence why i asked the question.
As a poster stated somewhere above about the "sky is falling" "wasting electrons" and to use the Search feature which we all know is BROKEN atm!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
To think that MWO,PGI,DEVS will only have Clan Mechs fighting other Clan Mechs once they are released is pretty farrrrrrrrrfetched imo.
I guess I could go read and research the history of things a little bit more than I have, but wouldn't the "INVADING CLANS" be invading areas that were previously dominated by IS mechs? If not, why use the term Invade/Invasion ?

"General Aleksandr Kerensky and three-quarters of the Star League Defense Force departed human-occupied space more than two hundred and fifty years ago, only to return in 3050 as the Clans: a society dedicated to the highest warrior ideals and bent on conquering the Inner Sphere. With their superior technology and OmniMechs, they almost proved unstoppable, before their defeat at Tukayyid and its fifteen year truce. The year is 3070, and while the Truce of Tukayyid has expired, the Jihad rages. The Inner Sphere 'Mechs hastily upgraded with field modifications to counter the Clans are proving their worth, as notable pilots rise to become heroes and new, more time tested variants—sporting weapons right out of R&D labs—make their presence felt, while the Clan OmniMechs continue to prove they are still the cutting edge of military technology."

SOUNDS TO ME LIKE THEY FOUGHT AGAINST EACHOTHER GUY