71 replies to this topic

[Hellboy561]

How about heat penalties at certain levels, 20%, 40%, 60%, 80% then shutdown at 100%...but heres the fun part. YOU as the mechwarrior get to choose what happens to your mech at those levels.

So your a light mech, you don't wanna loose your speed when your running hot, so you would choose that penalty to be as high as you can and not run past 80% so as not to loose your speed.

But I'm an assault pilot, i don't really care too much about the speed (If i'm hot i'm shooting!) i want my targeting systems to work all the way up the heatscale, so i choose that at 80% and have the speed decrease at 20%

Also shutting down after Alpha striking like 3 times in a row should just blow up parts of your mech, So a HexaPPC Stalker Alphas, Shuts down then powers up to find 2 of his PPCs have given up on life and Melted. Whoops!

Edited by Hellboy561, 21 April 2013 - 05:35 AM.

[frag85]

Hellboy561, on 21 April 2013 - 05:33 AM, said:

How about heat penalties at certain levels, 20%, 40%, 60%, 80% then shutdown at 100%...but heres the fun part. YOU as the mechwarrior get to choose what happens to your mech at those levels.

So your a light mech, you don't wanna loose your speed when your running hot, so you would choose that penalty to be as high as you can and not run past 80% so as not to loose your speed.

But I'm an assault pilot, i don't really care too much about the speed (If i'm hot i'm shooting!) i want my targeting systems to work all the way up the heatscale, so i choose that at 80% and have the speed decrease at 20%

Also shutting down after Alpha striking like 3 times in a row should just blow up parts of your mech, So a HexaPPC Stalker Alphas, Shuts down then powers up to find 2 of his PPCs have given up on life and Melted. Whoops!

That is making things over complicated. Do builds have to be min/maxed that much more?

It needs to be a simple system. LIke over x% you damage internals/equipment. Over a certain point the mech should just blow up.

[Hotthedd]

Death Storm, on 21 April 2013 - 04:49 AM, said:

No you are wrong about my input, the point is Hotthed you are doing it for wrong reason Now im not saying its an excellent idea for someone to mount 6 x PPC on a battle Mech however everyone has a right to experiment and explore what weapon load-out which suits them, and anyone who does manage to get good weapon balance that works in combat and gives them an advantage in battle should not be punished that using some degree of tactics.

And the reason your voting for this plan is because someone has thought of a way to use the weapons to there advantage it may not be the best way but its still away and they don't go unpunished i.e constantly shutting down which makes them vulnerable to attack. Again your voting for because that person annoys you and you haven't found away to counter that yet, so you need to change the game to stop these guys using that type of load-out and that's wrong and is not balancing the game that's chancing the game to your advantage.

And I am sorry I can not vote for that anyone who is smart enough to manage weapons in the mech lap to there advantages should not be punished that whole point of the game using thing that will give you the edge. Please note that does not mean i agree with the idea of mounting 6 PPC on a battle Mech. Other reasons is because i feel the heat plan you are suggesting in this thread will have an impact on everyone. even the guys who balance the weapons properly.

You make too many assumptions. I have no problem countering the mechs I face. Every build has a disadvantage. All I am advocating is that every build have MORE to manage than just their maximum heat. Make heat an issue at almost every level. Alpha striking should be a conscious CHOICE, with consequences that must be accounted for, instead of the obvious thing to do. Lights rely on speed, so they must balance their decisions on when and how often to fire, Assaults rely on raw damage output, but requiring them to carefully consider their next alpha instead of "Fire all guns/shutdown/repeat" would enhance the game overall. Additionally, it would allow DHS to become TRUE doubles again, as far as dissipation is concerned, getting rid of the 2.0/1.4 broken mechanic we currently 'enjoy'.

[FireSlade]

I think we need to work something out in terms of heat, alphas, and boats. No one should ever think that it is alright to do an alpha strike at 90% heat with a hot running build. It would be nice to see more visual indications that you are running hot once you hit 75 - 80% (The HUD starting to glitch with static). At 98% (these numbers should be adjusted for balance) chance that other systems malfunction like loss of target lock, the cockpit displays show errors, and anything else that would make sense for overheating computer systems. These would not be unreasonable considering the heat levels that would occur in the cockpit; there was a reason why most mechwarriors wore little more than boots, shorts, and a cooling vest that was used to keep the pilot alive. I do not believe that these things alone will affect brawling anymore than the current system of the safety shutdown. After a certain percentage over (shutdown or not) negative effects would really be seen in damage occurring to the mech, loss of movement speed, and possible ammo explosion. If the pilot were to push the heat to 150% the reactor becomes damaged and the emergency shielding slams down and permanently shuts the reactor down to prevent catastrophic failure. This is just using some of the info that Sarna has available and not breaking canon, but it punishes people who alpha, shutdown, and alpha again as soon as they come back online. PGI really needs to look into something to fix this because when the Clans become playable this will become an even greater issue with omnipods and stock mechs like the Supernova (6 ER Large Lasers).


After the ATD36 Answers I feel let down by the Devs and that no matter what we say, do, complain, etc. will matter unless we have a mass exodus which will never happen in the next year or two. So as Bryan has said:

Bryan Ekman, on 19 April 2013 - 02:59 PM, said:

Prosperity Park: Will the Heat mechanism be changed in the future such that Overheating to greater than, lets say 150%, would result in inescapable, guaranteed Heat Damage regardless if your Mech is Powered Down?
A: We’re happy with the existing system, so I don’t see this being added anytime soon.

We are SOL, also they may be happy but I and, I bet, others are not happy with the existing systems (heat, ECM and just about any one where players posted massive amounts of forum posts) which is sad considering the last few MW titles.


Edit: Here is where I got the heat information other than what we saw in past titles http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Heat_Sink

Edited by FireSlade, 21 April 2013 - 07:42 AM.

[Grey Death Storm]

Hotthedd, on 21 April 2013 - 06:55 AM, said:

You make too many assumptions. I have no problem countering the mechs I face. Every build has a disadvantage. All I am advocating is that every build have MORE to manage than just their maximum heat. Make heat an issue at almost every level. Alpha striking should be a conscious CHOICE, with consequences that must be accounted for, instead of the obvious thing to do. Lights rely on speed, so they must balance their decisions on when and how often to fire, Assaults rely on raw damage output, but requiring them to carefully consider their next alpha instead of "Fire all guns/shutdown/repeat" would enhance the game overall. Additionally, it would allow DHS to become TRUE doubles again, as far as dissipation is concerned, getting rid of the 2.0/1.4 broken mechanic we currently 'enjoy'.

IT sound good from your prospect View however I feel it will be a blight, think about what you are saying when you are surrounded by 2 - 3 mech every shot you take you get even closer to that critical heat point and you know that if you exceed that heat point something is going to happen (lost accuracy, lose of speed, engine blowing up and ammo blowing up) does that sound like fun to you and i am talking about wise mechwarriors who maintain a balance in weapon fire and heat management

don't get me wrong sounds a cool thing to add to in game experience but that like of this new heat plan will turn to a hate

Ideal heat plan warning signaling critical heat level hub display stat to flicker you lose target info and radar positioning mech shuts down that all you need adding anymore than that is going cause problems.

[Hotthedd]

Death Storm, on 21 April 2013 - 09:47 AM, said:

IT sound good from your prospect View however I feel it will be a blight, think about what you are saying when you are surrounded by 2 - 3 mech every shot you take you get even closer to that critical heat point and you know that if you exceed that heat point something is going to happen (lost accuracy, lose of speed, engine blowing up and ammo blowing up) does that sound like fun to you and i am talking about wise mechwarriors who maintain a balance in weapon fire and heat management

don't get me wrong sounds a cool thing to add to in game experience but that like of this new heat plan will turn to a hate

Ideal heat plan warning signaling critical heat level hub display stat to flicker you lose target info and radar positioning mech shuts down that all you need adding anymore than that is going cause problems.

Remember, it affects enemy mechs as well as you. If you are trying to evade 2 or 3 mechs, they must also calculate when to fire, or risk their OWN heat problems. Nobody is suggesting any heat penalties while running at 50% heat, and personally, I do not think any heat effects should start until around 75% - 80%. It is taking that extra alpha while at 50% that should be a deliberation, not firing a single pulse laser or missile salvo. And YES, that DOES sound fun to me. At least more fun than going from "no heat issues" to "shutdown" with nothing in between.

[Autologus]

Since heat affects electronics, make it disable your zoom at a certain level of heat and make your mini map and IFF shut off. Those things should be able to be implemented pretty easily. That would certainly make the high alpha builds be discouraged.

[Elizander]

Heat should have minor (not crippling) penalties once you go beyond 50%-70%. Nothing too bad, but a small percentage reduction in movement (or just a flat out engine rating penalty to affect twisting too) should be okay. I do not think that high heat should give severe penalties that will outright make it just as bad as shutting down.

The way I play some mechs right now is that I will spike my heat up to near maximum and skirt it for as long as I can, because getting a lot of damage up front is generally better than staying at low heat all the time.

[Teralitha]

In case I havent already said this...


Remove double heat sinks problem solved.

[Diablobo]

The entire premise of the OP is flawed. How can anything be more of an annoyance than tripled firing rates with only single rate heat dissipation? The OP is laboring under the flawed assumption that the heat system is in any way balanced or well designed at all.

Teralitha, on 26 April 2013 - 07:33 PM, said:

In case I havent already said this...


Remove double heat sinks problem solved.

It is just as ridiculous now as when you might have said it before. We don't need true doubles or no doubles, we need to triple the dissipation of the singles.

[cyberFluke]

Teralitha, on 26 April 2013 - 07:33 PM, said:

In case I havent already said this...


Remove double heat sinks problem solved.

Since there are so many things that make this the stupidest idea I've *ever* heard (and I've heard some corkers, believe me), I'm not even going to warrant it an explanation as to why this, as an idea, should be taken out back and put down while no-one is looking.

I will say, however, that that whole heat system as it stands is pretty much tripe, and is direly in need of a rework. Heat is utterly pointless at the minute, little more than an upside down "mana bar". I am losing faith in PGI at a rapid rate now, being shown regularly that the design direction of the game (and future of the franchise) is in the hands of an inexperienced, overexcited toddler with all the foresight of a meth addict in need of a fix.

I will honestly be extremely surprised if MWO still exists in any capacity other than a warning to others in 18 months.

[Echo6]

I like everything but the equipment damage. Too model the accuracy reduction I would just have the HUD get weaker and weaker with more heat. Or maybe not have a cone of fire unless and until you have substantial heat build up.

Edited by Echo6, 27 April 2013 - 04:34 AM.