42 replies to this topic

[zztophat]

I haven't played mine since the latest patch (the engine is in another mech) but I have killed a score of them.

Before, it felt like landing shots from my cannons and PPCs was more luck than skill but that was mostly fine because when the shots didn't ghost through the mechs they tended to hurt them.

But now I am tracking a passing spider with my quad AC2s or UAC5s or PPCs and every shot is connecting. I had a Commando run past my field of view earlier and he came out the other side dead. I'm not trumpeting my uber leet targeting skills (they are neither, in fact I suck at most fast-paced FPS games, tribes? hahaha, no.), it's just that they move far slower than most torsos can twist already (so there is no mechanically limiting factor) and on top of that the hit boxes feel... wonky. The way shots travel now almost makes it feel like they are connecting when they would otherwise miss.

I tried to get some footage of this but in the last few games I tried to record... there were no light mechs that I ran in to. (aside from a durp raven doing the derps and trying to perform solomancy against my entire team)


EDIT: and I should say, even though I failed to catch it on video, I could swear I saw one of my shots miss, literally passing the target ...and then hit.

Edited by zztophat, 17 April 2013 - 07:31 PM.

[Megalosauroid]

Devs say game is already too fast and that the engine cap is here to stay. Cant be bothered to trawl through the disorganized forums to cite this info.

[Davers]

Megalosauroid, on 17 April 2013 - 07:32 PM, said:

Devs say game is already too fast and that the engine cap is here to stay. Cant be bothered to trawl through the disorganized forums to cite this info.

This is true. Cryengine just can't handle anything much faster right now.

[zztophat]

[IceCase88]

Amen on the topic! Why even design the Flea if the speeds are capped? The Flea will be less than useless.

[Alekzander Smirnoff]

Two thirds of the maps are really too small for something that fast. You wouldn't run something at 200kph realistically in a city now would you? Or through trees for that matter... not that collisions with anything other than solid buildings and terrain are here.

[Davers]

IceCase88, on 17 April 2013 - 07:36 PM, said:

Amen on the topic! Why even design the Flea if the speeds are capped? The Flea will be less than useless.

As has been proposed many times. At least they can load up on small lasers and hunt down machine gun Spiders and Cicadas.

[Hammertrial]

At this rate the only people who will benefit from MASC are the swarms of heavies/assaults who will use it to run down lights like centurions.

Edited by Hammertrial, 17 April 2013 - 07:41 PM.

[One Medic Army]

Alekzander Smirnoff, on 17 April 2013 - 07:37 PM, said:

Two thirds of the maps are really too small for something that fast. You wouldn't run something at 200kph realistically in a city now would you? Or through trees for that matter... not that collisions with anything other than solid buildings and terrain are here.

200kph is less than 125mph.
The current speed cap is less than 95mph.

Fast for driving through residential streets in a car, yes. Fast when you scale it for 10m+ war machines running around in a 2km wide sandbox? Not so much.

[FupDup]

[Purplefluffybunny]

No.

[Taemien]

One Medic Army, on 17 April 2013 - 07:41 PM, said:

200kph is less than 125mph.
The current speed cap is less than 95mph.

Fast for driving through residential streets in a car, yes. Fast when you scale it for 10m+ war machines running around in a 2km wide sandbox? Not so much.

There's not very many mechs that move at those speeds. We'll have to keep the 'speed limit' algorithm in so that faster mechs can be added and retain their advantages. The Dasher for example will be MASCing at 216kph if they ever add it. At only 20 tons it would be useless if Jenners could move at those speeds.

Though one thing I would agree with is a slight bump to the Flea's engine restriction so it can at least match the Jenner. At 147.0kph with speed tweak it might not be quick enough to avoid fire unless its pretty small.

[Sephlock]

Edited by Sephlock, 17 April 2013 - 08:32 PM.

[BoPop]

yea the speed cap blows. makes the high end engines almost meaningless. i mean, yea ya get some better heat management but...

we just want to go fast! especially in the 5v (not that i take that thing out often....) but i might if it's speed could be fully realized.

it's fun to haul arse and leap great distances, off cliffs, whatever. and if we had 12vs12 speed wouldn't make it a "lights win" game, because it would be harder for fast movers to go unseen. it might be harder to hit them with 6ERPPC's tho if they could go the speed they should have. hell, they don't do much damage so speed is their weapon. and anyone who disagrees with me deserves to have their favorite mech nerfed in some way.

[OneEyed Jack]

Some people seem to be referring to the artificial speed cap that supposedly exists at 150kph (I say it like that because I've never seen the posts stating it) while others seem to be referring to the engine restrictions that were supposedly set to control things like the CB Small Laser Hunchies.

Which was he OP about?

If it was the cap, I'd say it's pointless, already, because the engine restrictions can control that (the top current speeds barely break 150 with speed tweak). I'd say remove it.

If it's the engine restrictions, I'd say keep them, since it's once of the balancing mechanics between chassis and variants. They've already begun adjusting those restrictions with variant tweaks. Not all mechs are currently limited to the arbitrary formula they came up with.

I do think they need to allow faster speeds to keep some mechs which are already planned, or will obviously be included, from being pointless. At the same time, I think they need to re-visit the turn speeds for large chassis, at least at slow speeds. It's already difficult, while playing a slow mech (some have no options to be fast), to get a fast light in the hands of a good light player in front of your mech where you can even take a shot, regardless of ability to hit if they desire to stay on your back. Difficult, even with all the tricks, but it can be done. With even faster lights, it may well be impossible.

[Silentium]

I thought it had to do with netcode, and that they might lift the cap once that was tuned up.

Magic 8-ball says: ask again later.

[Brilig]

I would like to see lighter mechs going faster. The lighter the are the faster they should go.

[Merky Merc]

I personally wouldn't like to see them going any faster. How you make mechs that only had speed stay relevant? I don't have the answer to that, but we do have an MG toting Spider which doesn't really help my case as it's nearly worthless.

There has to be a speed in which even in lala BTland a fast *** mech has spindly little chicken legs that snap on contact with a rotting log. And well before that it would be much cheaper to have a hovercraft or VTOL to play the role of scout/harasser.

[Tennex]

they might in the next few patches. according to the NGNG podcast, devs are planning to add MASC with the flea. as well as lift speed restriction. ii dunno about engine restriction though

according to NGNG podcast. apparently collisions is coming back, but in the form of a module. so you gotta have the module to run ppl over? seems very stupid. it was a fine mechanic how it was

Edited by Tennex, 17 April 2013 - 08:52 PM.

[One Medic Army]

Taemien, on 17 April 2013 - 07:57 PM, said:

There's not very many mechs that move at those speeds. We'll have to keep the 'speed limit' algorithm in so that faster mechs can be added and retain their advantages. The Dasher for example will be MASCing at 216kph if they ever add it. At only 20 tons it would be useless if Jenners could move at those speeds.

Though one thing I would agree with is a slight bump to the Flea's engine restriction so it can at least match the Jenner. At 147.0kph with speed tweak it might not be quick enough to avoid fire unless its pretty small.

Well, the thing is that at certain speeds, the Flea will have more free tonnage than the Jenner.
Every tonnage of chassis has an efficient point, a speed at which it has more free tonnage than any other tonnage of chassis at the same speed.

See http://www.ci-n.com/...imalweight.html for the for the Tabletop version.

I made an excel spreadsheet for doing it in MWO, which yields these efficient speed/tonnage combinations:
48.6kph: 100tons (XL or standard)
64.8kph: 90tons (XL) or 85tons (Std)
81kph: 70tons (XL) or 60tons (Std)
97.2kph: 60tons (XL) or 50tons (Std)
113.4kph: 50tons (XL) or 40tons (Std)
129.6kph: 40tons (XL) or 35tons (Std)
145.8kph: 35tons (XL) or 30tons (Std)
162kph: 30tons (XL) or 20tons (Std)
178.2kph: 25tons (XL) or 20tons (Std)
194.4kph: 25tons (XL) or 20tons (Std)
210.6kph: 20tons (XL) not possible with a Std engine.

As you can see the 20ton chassis isn't worth running until over 200kph because a 25tonner (like the commando) will get more weapons/armor at the given speed, unless you're running a Std engine, at which point the speed to aim for is only 162kph.