94 replies to this topic

[Nehkrosis]

get to cover, move from cover to cover.
give suppression to enemy poptarts.
get in to close range. Brawl their faces off.

[Flash Yoghurt]

Nehkrosis, on 21 April 2013 - 12:41 PM, said:

get to cover, move from cover to cover.
give suppression to enemy poptarts.
get in to close range. Brawl their faces off.

Supress them with what?
They only have to be lucky once or twice to ruin you and can still out DPS you at close range...
Also: Try closing from cover to cover on Alpine, Tourmaline or Colony (if the enemy is on the water...).

[KKRonkka]

When missiles were wild there were Jenners armed with LRMs... people are one imaginative fukkers.

[Davers]

Flash Yoghurt, on 21 April 2013 - 12:50 PM, said:

Supress them with what?
They only have to be lucky once or twice to ruin you and can still out DPS you at close range...
Also: Try closing from cover to cover on Alpine, Tourmaline or Colony (if the enemy is on the water...).

What mech are you using in your example? I can take about 12 alphas from a Gauss+3ERPPC sniper in my Atlas.

[Merky Merc]

Davers, on 21 April 2013 - 01:14 PM, said:

What mech are you using in your example? I can take about 12 alphas from a Gauss+3ERPPC sniper in my Atlas.

Probably any mech that isn't an Atlas.

And I doubt that claim very much considering I can rip an atlas apart like a surgeon with my dual gauss Ilya.

Edited by Merky Merc, 21 April 2013 - 01:16 PM.

[Nehkrosis]

I Suppress PopTarts with 2x UAC/5s, granted it is not the same damage as ERPPCs or Gauss, but you'd be silly to keep poking your head out into a stream of damage.

[Sephlock]

Nehkrosis, on 21 April 2013 - 01:17 PM, said:

I Suppress PopTarts with 2x UAC/5s, granted it is not the same damage as ERPPCs or Gauss, but you'd be silly to keep poking your head out into a stream of damage.

So why are you poking your head out to shoot them? You are aware that they'll be shooting back, right?

[Nehkrosis]

oh definitely.But i can take some damage before everything goes south, i've been having a lot of success in my HGN 733C.

A pretty continual stream of 10 or 15 damage every second (or even more, you've definitely seen UACs spit out 2-3 rounds at a time) will keep most people down while you/ your teammates get into closer range, or atleast better cover.

[Davers]

Merky Merc, on 21 April 2013 - 01:16 PM, said:

Probably any mech that isn't an Atlas.

And I doubt that claim very much considering I can rip an atlas apart like a surgeon with my dual gauss Ilya.

Well I can take 2 alpha strikes on each arm before I might lost my arm weapons. Probably take 3 to lose the arm. I can take 2 on each side torso as well. I may lose some SRM launchers but my AC/20 might survive, at least until the third hit. I can take 3 hits on my CT before I am into structure, but there isn't anything there I have to worry about losing. This is based on a 45 point alpha. Against a 30 point alpha, I hold up even better. Guess you fight a lot of guys who just show you their CT.

[stjobe]

Owlfeathers, on 21 April 2013 - 11:59 AM, said:

It's a much better use of the ERPPC Raven to flank and countersnipe enemy poptart lines from behind, mine kills heavies with three alphas to the back. Half the time they don't even know I'm there.

I've been doing the same with my ERPPC Commando. Flank and countersnipe. A surprising amount of pilots don't seem to notice the big PPC bolt coming in from their side, so most of the time I can even stand still for prolonged periods of time.

[Akulakhan]

Mystere, on 21 April 2013 - 12:21 PM, said:

Of course, it's always someone else's fault. It's almost like those parents who blame the government and school system for not raising their children properly.




No they are NOT. People either just stopped finding another way, or it's just another of those "Monkey see, monkey do" moments.

There's always ANOTHER way, but is there always another equally EFFECTIVE way? Right now, nah.

For example: I usually run Jenners lately, the leg armor on some of these highlanders is just silly low. This can be effective to nerf jumping and generally upset the jump sniper. However, if he's not by himself like a nub, a light will be in quite the precarious situation when half a dozen of his high alpha friends are taking shots at a brittle light. So, a cap would be in order. I have to use guerrilla tactics to be effective in a match filled with jump snipes/assaults, the problem with guerrilla tactics is they require your team to not be completely eviscerated; and for your team to not be ripped to shreds, they also have to be jump snipers.

In a perfect world, there would also be other lights to contend with and that's what a light's role is, eliminating other lights and when that's completed, the enemy base is open for capture and it's gg. There are usually no other lights on the enemy team.

Do you see the problem here? I'm not ready to launch into a doom and gloom rant, because I want to see what happens in the next week after the "tournament" ends. But even prior to the tournament, it was a little ridiculous. And a lot of people say it's because the Highlander is new and everyone wants to level it, which is true and valid; however it's also irrevocably altered the meta by creating a much more durable version of the CTF-3D, which was already one of the most efficient ways to produce high damage. Now, you have ajump sniping assault with tons more armor. This change requires balance.

Edited by Akulakhan, 21 April 2013 - 01:51 PM.

[Lukoi Banacek]

You guys lamenting the demise of MWO due to poptarting seem to be conveniently forgetting that we're between "balanced points" as PGI envisions them. Yes, they're slow as hell getting Missiles back into the game as an effective weapon, but the fact remains, this isn't the meta they intend, it's just the rough, awkward period people are going to have to suck up and adapt to until they reintroduce effective missiles. I'm not saying they won't bork that up too, but seriously....acting like this was the intended tactical aspect for the game and crying about it is disingenuous and silly.

[Kyynele]

Yeah. I have adapted.

I made a poptart PPC 4X. Even if poptarting is pretty much a secondary feature since there's enough speed to get to the back of the enemies, it's still nice extra damage for the time you're waiting for the right time. Never pop up twice in the same spot and nobody's _hit me in the air so far (I don't count the time I was the last one alive, legless, unarmed, with 5 enemies around me and I pirouetted in the air just for the luls.)

I also found use for the CPLT-C1 that had been collecting dust in the mech bay: remove missiles and TAG, add 2x ERPPC and a LPL. Keep JJs so there's an advantage to K2s. KDR for the mech going back up and fast. Also much easier to play than ever!

I do hope missiles come back, as the current game is getting pretty generic shoot'em up.

Edit, added the _ to avoid censorship, lol

Edited by Kyynele, 21 April 2013 - 02:09 PM.

[jeffsw6]

MrPenguin, on 21 April 2013 - 10:30 AM, said:

Ac/20's have been removed?

I would assume the poster meant SRMs, which fit on many more mechs than AC/20s and don't use up 10 slots and so get destroyed a lot by criticals after your armor is worn down.

[Writer]

Lukoi, on 21 April 2013 - 02:02 PM, said:

You guys lamenting the demise of MWO due to poptarting seem to be conveniently forgetting that we're between "balanced points" as PGI envisions them. Yes, they're slow as hell getting Missiles back into the game as an effective weapon, but the fact remains, this isn't the meta they intend, it's just the rough, awkward period people are going to have to suck up and adapt to until they reintroduce effective missiles. I'm not saying they won't bork that up too, but seriously....acting like this was the intended tactical aspect for the game and crying about it is disingenuous and silly.

Why should we have to suck it up? All PGI has to do is open an .XL spreadsheet and raise LRM and SRM dmg values by .3 which would place damage at a solid in-between value between their previously overpowered state and their now brokenly nerfed state. They said these tweaks would be ongoing, but where are they? They're doing a horrible job communicating what's wrong with LRM's since the latest patch, and what they're looking into to fix it. Is it a netcode issue that will be fixed by HSR? Is it purely a splash damage issue? Is dmg not calculating correctly? While they work all this out why can't they push the values to a level that doesn't cripple the meta-game?

My hunchbacks gather dust, my only competitive Atlas is made of cheese, and I can't use my JM7-A for SRM Brawling or LRM fire support.

This meta-game can go to hell.

Edited by Rhenis, 21 April 2013 - 03:21 PM.

[BGrey]

All of the people defending the mechanic seem to assume that anyone complaining is just crap and getting killed by poptarts and go on to spew out crap about countering them. Its all well and good except that you cant counter the 5 dudes on your team hiding behind a rock all game.

[jeffsw6]

BGrey, on 21 April 2013 - 03:28 PM, said:

Its all well and good except that you cant counter the 5 dudes on your team hiding behind a rock all game.

Such is the state of PUG play. I kind of want to air strike my own team sometimes.

[Davers]

BGrey, on 21 April 2013 - 03:28 PM, said:

All of the people defending the mechanic seem to assume that anyone complaining is just crap and getting killed by poptarts and go on to spew out crap about countering them. Its all well and good except that you cant counter the 5 dudes on your team hiding behind a rock all game.

LOL Yeah, that would be pretty annoying.

jeffsw6, on 21 April 2013 - 03:32 PM, said:

Such is the state of PUG play. I kind of want to air strike my own team sometimes.

Commissar Mech airstrikes own team to improve morale.

[MrPenguin]

jeffsw6, on 21 April 2013 - 02:55 PM, said:

I would assume the poster meant SRMs

I don't care what he "meant". He should have used the proper wording.

[jay35]

Vassago Rain, on 21 April 2013 - 10:07 AM, said:

This is what happens when you remove the only brawling weapon in the game.

How do you figure? The AC/20 is still there. There are still Jager and K2 AC/20 boats and dual-Gauss boats out and about in matches. The SRM was hardly the only brawling weapon. And I still use them quite a bit. I would love to see them do more damage and make my builds even more effective, but they are still workable in the meantime.

If anything, what's changed is Lights aren't as viable due to HSR on ballistics now, and the temporary missile damage reduction until they finish sorting the spread or whatever it's called. So you can't really run up to larger mechs with impunity in a light or medium, so they are doing more stand-off builds, which only makes sense.

Edited by jay35, 21 April 2013 - 05:13 PM.