47 replies to this topic

[Zyllos]

And that is why mixed tech will not be happening.

At least I hope it will not be happening or all this work on balancing will be for not.

[Karl Streiger]

Zyllos, on 25 April 2013 - 05:36 AM, said:

And that is why mixed tech will not be happening.

At least I hope it will not be happening or all this work on balancing will be for not.

Oh... what can mix tech doe worser as pure clan tech could allready do.
While i don't believe that we will see the Mad Dog....Altconfig A alone and even without Omni Pods... is the worst nightmare.
6 missile slots plus ballistic plus energy slot.
And this mech is even faster as the Catapult.

Not to mention other Mechs...like the Mad Kitten all are crying for.....5 Energy Weapons...on the A, even 6 on the prime plus Gauss Rifle sized machine guns and missiles.....

Clan weapon on clan Mechs even without Omni Capabilitys will be .... i think we need more UrbanMechs and more Dice

[El Bandito]

Clan SSRM6 x 6 on my A1.

Oh, the tears that will flow afterwards.

Edited by El Bandito, 25 April 2013 - 09:49 AM.

[Varnas]

Nothing. I won't touch filthy clan tech with a ten meter pole held by someone else.

[Kraven Kor]

hammerreborn, on 24 April 2013 - 04:48 PM, said:

All of them?

Why would you use anything else?

I hates the clans, but I like to win. They allow me to put clan tech on my IS mechs, and I will, because I'd be stupid not to.

I kind of hope they do not allow that, at least not at first. We shall see.

[Joseph Mallan]

Gauss and LRMs for the win.

ERPPCs for the face rub!

[Philadelphia Collins]

UAC20... and of course the SSRM6... and of course wait a second aren't pretty much all clan weapons superior to inner sphere even weapons that they share such as the gauss rifle? Sorry I like the innersphere over the clans just a personal preference but I cannot deny the overwhelming advantages to using their equipment. If i could I would strip every IS weapon off my IS mech and replace with clan tech... but why stop there. Ideally I would take my IS pilot and throw him directly into a clan mech of course that means capturing a clan mech which is not so easy to do.

[TruePoindexter]

I'm going to be curious to see how Clans are implemented in a way that doesn't invalidate everything from before. Why FASA back in the day thought it was a good idea to introduce a faction with almost ubiquitously superior equipment is beyond me. It kinda reminds me of how some CCG companies introduced new decks that were completely superior to the original decks just to force buyers to get the new stuff.

If I can mount Clan XL engines I will - no more LT/RT deaths. Clan LRMs are dramatically superior to the IS versions. Clan ER PPC's are going to be terrifying. There are so few downsides to Clan tech I'm not really sure how it's all going to work out.

[Royalewithcheese]

Clan lurms are gonna be pretty amazing as stuff to splat people point-blank with. But really, between UAC/20, lightweight Gauss, 15-damage PPC, 1-ton Large Laser equivalents and SSRM6, you really can't go wrong with clan stuff.

[Deathlike]

TruePoindexter, on 25 April 2013 - 11:23 AM, said:

If I can mount Clan XL engines I will - no more LT/RT deaths. Clan LRMs are dramatically superior to the IS versions. Clan ER PPC's are going to be terrifying. There are so few downsides to Clan tech I'm not really sure how it's all going to work out.

Well, the only "true way" of doing that is to increase the heat on equivalent weapons, like the Clan ER Med and Clan ER Large vs their IS counterparts, but then you have Clan DHS that is leg-compatible and it also assumes Clan DHS uses the same values as IS DHS.. which I think they would actually "nerf" (for Clan DHS to be @ 1.2 to 1.33 dissipation instead of 1.4)...

There will be lots of balancing issues that will have to happen anyways.

[TruePoindexter]

Deathlike, on 25 April 2013 - 11:46 AM, said:

Well, the only "true way" of doing that is to increase the heat on equivalent weapons, like the Clan ER Med and Clan ER Large vs their IS counterparts, but then you have Clan DHS that is leg-compatible and it also assumes Clan DHS uses the same values as IS DHS.. which I think they would actually "nerf" (for Clan DHS to be @ 1.2 to 1.33 dissipation instead of 1.4)...

There will be lots of balancing issues that will have to happen anyways.

*nods* It's going to be interesting.

[Taemien]

The idea that Right or Left Torso destruction doesn't result in death might be flawed. We think of the 2 critical slots being the defining factor since in TT it takes three critical hits to shutdown an engine. This isn't how it works in MWO. What normally happens with torso destruction is the engine takes damage enough to destroy it. With Clan XLs in the R/L Torso, it may still take enough damage to destroy it.

A critical hit from a Gauss Rifle or AC20 to a Side Torso on a clan mech may still destroy the 15hp engine. This is by MWO design.

[TruePoindexter]

Taemien, on 25 April 2013 - 12:02 PM, said:

The idea that Right or Left Torso destruction doesn't result in death might be flawed. We think of the 2 critical slots being the defining factor since in TT it takes three critical hits to shutdown an engine. This isn't how it works in MWO. What normally happens with torso destruction is the engine takes damage enough to destroy it. With Clan XLs in the R/L Torso, it may still take enough damage to destroy it.

A critical hit from a Gauss Rifle or AC20 to a Side Torso on a clan mech may still destroy the 15hp engine. This is by MWO design.

Well it was modeled that way in MWO to match TT's classical IS XL + Side Torso Destruction = death. Part of this is because engines don't take crits in MWO though that may change.

[Victor Morson]

Answer: Not good, not good at all. We do not want Crossteching. Period.

If they try to balance the game with cross teching, you know that Atlas/Cent you're so excited to try the stuff on? You're going to throw it right in the trash.

Why? I'll tell you why. 2x slot DHS. Omni (however that works out) hardpoints and an XL engine that does not kill the 'mech if it blows up. That's just for starters.

If they allow the IS to purchase Clan tech (instead of running a different pilot profile) there will be absolutely no point to ANY 'mech we have. This isn't MW4 where those things were non-existent.

[MustrumRidcully]

TruePoindexter, on 25 April 2013 - 11:23 AM, said:

I'm going to be curious to see how Clans are implemented in a way that doesn't invalidate everything from before. Why FASA back in the day thought it was a good idea to introduce a faction with almost ubiquitously superior equipment is beyond me. It kinda reminds me of how some CCG companies introduced new decks that were completely superior to the original decks just to force buyers to get the new stuff.

If I can mount Clan XL engines I will - no more LT/RT deaths. Clan LRMs are dramatically superior to the IS versions. Clan ER PPC's are going to be terrifying. There are so few downsides to Clan tech I'm not really sure how it's all going to work out.

Forcing buyers to get the new stuff is the big motivation, I think. Game Companies at time were big on selling power in my experience. Many games featured a heavy level of power creep.

That might not be the only motivation, but it is a powerful one.
The other motivation might be that they found that in practice, the Level 1 Tech stuff made the game too slow. I can't really judge this, but I could see that it might have been an issue. ALl the tech upgrades do primarily add more firepower to the game, without adding much on the defensive side. (Ferro-Fibrous for example is just a measure to get more tonnage for weapons and ammo, it doesn't boost your survivability.)

[Herodes]

No Clan tech in my machines. Ever.
The Clans need to be exterminated. And forgotten.

[Kraven Kor]

Taemien, on 25 April 2013 - 12:02 PM, said:

The idea that Right or Left Torso destruction doesn't result in death might be flawed. We think of the 2 critical slots being the defining factor since in TT it takes three critical hits to shutdown an engine. This isn't how it works in MWO. What normally happens with torso destruction is the engine takes damage enough to destroy it. With Clan XLs in the R/L Torso, it may still take enough damage to destroy it.

A critical hit from a Gauss Rifle or AC20 to a Side Torso on a clan mech may still destroy the 15hp engine. This is by MWO design.

In TT, the Engine could take three hits before being destroyed. The weapon that hit it didn't matter, if you rolled an Engine Crit, it took 1 hit. Three little circles on the record sheet for "Engine Hits." Each Engine Hit caused you to generate 5 extra heat per turn, so with two engine crits, 10 heat per turn; three engine hits, mech disabled.

IS XL Engines take up three spaces in the left and right torso. If a side torso is destroyed, the engine takes three hits, and is destroyed.

Clan XL Engines take up only two spaces in the left and right torso, so only takes two engine hits from a side torso destruction - which will only destroy the engine if it already had another engine crit previously.

There be the actual rules, as I recall them.

[JudgeDeathCZ]

I want all Clan tech but if I have to choose one weapon it will be ER Medium Laser

[Demoned]

Clan tech to have?
Clan double heat sinks please,
to many mechs with 2 slots and not able to use them lol

but weapon wise I'll go for the Clan medium lasers.

Edited by Demoned, 25 April 2013 - 06:23 PM.

[Karl Streiger]

Hm Cross...weapon plattform: plus the chance of mounting Clan DHS?

My founder Atlas...will be equiped with 2 Gauss and 3 C ER-PPCs. Alpha of 75 and the heat sinks do deal with that....20 DHS - but slow.

No for cross weapon plattforms... but on the other hand...same loadout fits into the Dire Wolf Omni....but with 19DHS and faster.
If it is even possible to change engine and sturcture (Endosteel, and 325 Fusion) you can increase the DHS towards 21 for the dire wolf....
and that is when you use gaus rifles.

So the prime and only if hard point is fixed on the Dire Wolf Prime (you have 4 Energy hard points in each arm)
So mounting 6 Clan ER-PPCs is no problem...give you room for 29 DHS.
Heat Treshhold is 91
heat for an single alpha strike even with 15 heat per weapon is 90.
So yes that madness can fire a alpha strike and stay moveable. 90 heat for 90 damage...enough to kill any target till 60tons in a single shot.
(Although the variant with 2 Gauss and 3 ER-PPC is more dangerous because it can keep firing for a while)

Edited by Karl Streiger, 25 April 2013 - 11:26 PM.