37 replies to this topic

[Victor Morson]

I'm likely to get a lot of conflicting posts on this thread, but I figured with all the misinformation on this forum, that a nice list of hints for new players would be helpful. I'll likely be editing and adding on to this soon.

Make no bones, these hints are engineered with having you get to be very good at the game in it's current condition (hence the editing part), and I won't be steering anyone towards popular PUG strategies here. If you like to call good builds cheesy, this is not the thread for you.

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Settings

The first thing you do when getting into the game is go to your settings and Disable both Arm Lock and Throttle Decay. Both will handicap you overall, and were added to make the game "simpler" for newbies. It does not. What it does, is tie your hands behind your back (or I guess, to your chest in this case) - esp. Arm Lock. These features are virtual training wheels and will teach you bad habits in the end.

If you want to re-lock your arms in-game press and hold SHIFT, giving you the ability to converge weapons while leaving your arms free the majority of the time. You should put your infighting weapons on the arms if possible, to give you the greatest flexibility.

Trial 'Mechs

These things are death traps. Grind up to a regular 'mech as fast as possible, and in the mean time, stick with any © 'mechs. While still sub-optimal they are vastly superior to the non-community designs and are the only way you'll have a remote chance on the battlefield.

Modules

Make sure you get a Capture Accelerator. No matter what game type you play or what 'mech you're in, this is vital. Pick one up and move it between 'mechs before drops at the very least. It should be your very first GXP purchase.

Coolant 9 by 9 is very, very useful - esp. if with Cool Boost. Once you get the GXP to afford it, definitely buy the Coolant 9 by 9. This gives you Cbill coolant that is on par with the MC coolant, and can save you - or the team - at critical moments.

Mechs

Currently the only 'mechs you should consider are:

Raven 3L, Cataphract 3D, Highlander 732, Highlander Heavy Metal, Awesome 9M, Awesome Pretty Baby, Trebuchet 5J, Trebuchet 5M, Centurion 9-AL, Centurion 9D, Atlas AS7-D-DC, Atlas AS7-RS, Dragon Flame, Cicada X-5, Cicada 3M, Stalkers or Jaggermechs.

I do not drive enough Stalkers or Jaggers to offer a proper variant recommendation. All other 'mechs should be taken only to help improve the mastery level of the list above. I'd also recommend the Ilya for cash farming, even if it's inferior in capability to the 3D - it's still potent enough to be excellent for PUG'ing.

Weapons

Right now, stick to: PPC, ER PPC, Gauss, Large Laser, Medium Laser, Small Laser, Ultra/5 and Streaks. Missiles are presently nerf'ed badly, so I would advise steering entirely clear of LRMs; SRMs are still viable but sub-optimal. Use them only if you have the slot and tonnage.

EDIT: I would also recommend the AC/20, but there are a lack of delivery platforms for it. The AC/20 Jagger, while deadly and popular, could end up entirely useless on the wrong map as it's a Glass Cannon (it pops in seconds if caught in the open). If a heavier dual AC/20 platform shows up or we get information on the map ahead of time, I would find these easier to recommend.

Internals

Of the 'mech upgrades you can get:

EndoSteel: You should always attempt to buy this for your 'mechs.

Double Heat Sinks: This as well. While the double heat sinks only offer 40% bonus and take tripple the space, the big issue is that the engine heatsinks are also doubled, both core and added, so it's unquestionably worthwhile.

Ferro Fiberous: This does NOT offer more protection. It simply makes armor slightly lighter. It takes tons of crits and is far worse than Endo, but there are a handful of designs that can benefit from it, like the Flame or some scouts.

Artemis IV: This is a very good LOS only weapon system that's made useless by the current state of missiles. If you are taking regular SRMs it may be worthwhile but try to avoid SRMs entirely anyway (it does not impact Streaks.)

Equipment

AMS: Not worthwhile because of the state of missiles.

BAP: Same as above.

ECM: If your 'mech can mount ECM, you should be mounting ECM. A guide to ECM would be a whole other thread, but if you're running a 'mech that can use it and you don't, you're hurting your whole team.

Jump Jets: These are incredibly useful. Try to mount them on anything that has the ability. Aside from "pop tarting" (launching from behind cover, firing, and returning to cover) they're also exceptional for "gliding" where you can go slightly into the air and rapidly tap the jets, allowing you to move one direction while turning your body in another.

XL Engines: When you have an XL engine, your 'mech will be destroyed if it loses a side torso. With a standard engine the 'mech will continue on as normal. XLs should be used on fast 'mechs almost exclusively, and on heavier 'mechs should be kept to designs with smaller side torsos if possible.

Try to take note of target weapon systems and speed as well. If they are carrying a lot of guns and moving fast, you can assume they are XL and kill them from side torso hits opposed to trying for a CT/Leg/Head kill.

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Useful advice:

Learn the hit boxes. There's a number of guides out there, but try to figure out what part of each 'mech counts as which section of it's armor. The results might surprise you.

Once you are comfortable with heat management, rebind it to a key you can press and hold when you need it.

The SHIFT key as mentioned above will, when arms are unlocked, relock them only while it's being held. This is very useful if you have arm & torso weapons.

Don't knee-jerk reaction to builds that kill you - they all have weaknesses. The 6 PPC Stalker, for example, can do almost no damage inside of 70m. If isolated even a Commando could trash one unhindered. Instead of assuming something deadly is OP, look for it's hard counter.

Remember, the larger the engine you have, the more heatsinks it can store internally. Given doubles are 3 slots each, that's a lot of free saved internal slots! Check this for a guide: http://mwowiki.org/wiki/Engine

Learn to manage your heat. Those high-alpha damage builds you can make are sometimes great, but if they overheat rapidly, they will ruin your staying power. Try to make sure you've got enough heat capacity to keep the damage up, more than just deliver one good shot.

If you enjoy the game, as soon as possible join a unit. There's lots of units that are friendly to new people out there (several House and Mercenary recruitment sub-forums on this site, even!) and the game will literally be night & day for you depending if you're playing solo or with a group of like minded friends. MW:O is a game designed for team play.

When you lock a target, a unique "Call Letter" - A - H right now - will appear in the reticule. This is the same for everyone on your team. If you're playing with a friend or friends, priming targets (focusing your guns on a single 'mech) is a very big tactic to MW:O. By using these call letters, you don't have to look up player names and such - i.e. "Target Bravo" if the target show B.

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I'm sure I probably omitted some things I'll edit in later, but I hope this helps some new players looking to really get into the game and are looking to get really good. Again this is for the 4/29 meta, someone reading this a month from now is likely to have a different perspective.

Edited by Victor Morson, 01 May 2013 - 11:52 AM.

[Loc Nar]

I'd include suggestions to change mouse sensitivity to something like 800dpi for MWO in your settings section. If you use normal browser sensitivity settings on your mouse (16-2400), well lets just call it hard mode. One can change their .cfg files if their mouse sucks and doesn't allow adjustment, but a decent gaming mouse is kinda a requirement for MWO.

[Skydrive]

I have to disagree for what you advised for missles and BAP. LRMs, while not being as deadly as they used to be, are good now only for softening up a target, to finishing it off if its running away, and are only really lethal if you can boat alot, but do agree that new players shouldn't aim for using them alot, not without experience.
SRMs are still a viable weapon, saying that they were nerfed badly is a bit harsh. They are still a good weapon, the only problem was that they were doing too much for their weight and size. They are especially good if you have a mech with multiple missle hardpoints, thus able to do more then an AC 20 for less tonnage and taking less space, of course they can be harder to aim due to flight time, and chances of them all not hitting, and damage would be spread out abit, but not by too much. Ofcourse, again an issue would be the amount of tubes a mech has for launching missles.
For BAP, its like you think it is only useful for mechs running LRMs. It's ability to allow you to target mechs that are powered down (or overheated) allows you to continue firing your streaks. Whats more this can also be a great boon to gaining CBills. I remember atleast one time in my Dragon 5N, that had no lock on weapons (1.5 free tons, already had AMS, before the missle nerf) got 12 spotting assists in caustic, just because the enemy mechs would be overheating.
Another point I have to disagree on is what module to get first. In all honesty, thats the only module I do not have, I prefer those that help me in combat, but I suppose it is useful for those who are new. However there is an even higher priority module then that, the advanced sensor module. With it you can get a 1000m sensor range (or 1200m if you already have BAP) once at tier 2, and it is one of the 4 ways of countering ECM (TAG, (ER)PPC, Advanced Sensor module, or destroying the ECM).

Also, here is what I run on my JM6-DD. Its somewhat cheaper due to it not using an XL engine, and with the 2 ER PPC's, the 6MG's are actually able to hit internals fast. Whats more, due to the amount of MG's it can actually damage armour, thus quickening the stripping of a mech... though not by much.

Another thing, if you see an enemy mech that has a gauss rifle, and you know its in a side torso, aim for that section if the CT isn't already stripped, but if the side torso is also stripped, then only if the CT isn't also critical. For instance, an atlas has a gauss rifle and full armour, you aim for his right torso (or right rear torso if you can get there). If you destroy the gauss rifle before the side torso is destroyed, the gauss rifle will explode and cause damage to the mech. If it had an XL engine and the side torso is destroyed as a result, he is dead.

[Mycrus]

Cap module for newbie?!

Best all arounder is the sensor module - especially since pugs general don't give positional data.

Next would be target info - especially for direct fire mechs so you can quickly concentrate damage on armorless sections..

[Victor Morson]

Skydrive, on 29 April 2013 - 03:14 PM, said:

I have to disagree for what you advised for missles and BAP. LRMs, while not being as deadly as they used to be, are good now only for softening up a target, to finishing it off if its running away, and are only really lethal if you can boat alot

A particularly vital tip for newbies: Anyone who says this, and believes it, is the worst possible source of advice.

It's not that new players should not aim for using them, nobody should until they're repaired. They weren't viable in serious matches before the nerf, and now they are a bad punchline to a weak joke. Avoid at all costs.

Mycrus, on 29 April 2013 - 04:36 PM, said:

Cap module for newbie?!

Best all arounder is the sensor module - especially since pugs general don't give positional data.

Next would be target info - especially for direct fire mechs so you can quickly concentrate damage on armorless sections..

It depends. if they're playing Conquest, at all, the cap module is vital. There are absolutely no sensor modules of serious importance, and Target Info is more or less a luxury item.

In fact, yes, I stand by get a Capture module first. The others are fringe bonuses, the cap module can make or break a game. If you're a newbie running around in Conquest or reaching the enemy base in Assault, that cap module can change the fate of the game.

Target info cannot.

EDIT:
The only argument of order I could give is getting the Coolant 9 by 9 first, which is also helpful.

Edited by Victor Morson, 29 April 2013 - 05:33 PM.

[Victor Morson]

Skydrive, on 29 April 2013 - 03:14 PM, said:

Also, here is what I run on my JM6-DD. Its somewhat cheaper due to it not using an XL engine, and with the 2 ER PPC's, the 6MG's are actually able to hit internals fast. Whats more, due to the amount of MG's it can actually damage armour, thus quickening the stripping of a mech... though not by much.

6 MGs?

You might not be new but you might want to take some of what I've said here to heart yourself, man. That is a very, very weak PUG joke build. Recommending that to people is cruel and unusual punishment.

Seriously. Try a good build sometime, and you will understand what I mean.

EDIT: I hate to say it, but if you're new, please do yourself a favor and don't take any of Skydrive's advice. It's really bad.

Edited by Victor Morson, 29 April 2013 - 05:38 PM.

[Skydrive]

Victor Morson, on 29 April 2013 - 05:34 PM, said:

6 MGs?

You might not be new but you might want to take some of what I've said here to heart yourself, man. That is a very, very weak PUG joke build. Recommending that to people is cruel and unusual punishment.

Seriously. Try a good build sometime, and you will understand what I mean.

EDIT: I hate to say it, but if you're new, please do yourself a favor and don't take any of Skydrive's advice. It's really bad.

Tell that to the people I out damaged with that mech then Also, its like you've never seen anyone get killed by LRM's.

[Victor Morson]

Skydrive, on 29 April 2013 - 06:37 PM, said:

Tell that to the people I out damaged with that mech then Also, its like you've never seen anyone get killed by LRM's.

I really don't want to derail this thread with "LRMs are ok, really!" talk because they aren't. Out damaging people in PUGs mean nothing. 6 MGs are a joke and anyone worth their tonnage will tell you that.

It's fine if you want to goof around with something like that for kicks but recommending it to new people is really bad.

[Hobietime]

For Stalker variants I would recommend the 3F, 3H (for whenever they do get LRM splash damage back up), and the 5M (the extra missile hardpoint and CT energy hardpoint is nice). I guess you could go for the 5S instead if you really want the dual AMS.

I'm pretty sure the 4N is just a 3F with one less missile hardpoint and less torso twist.

Edited by Hobietime, 29 April 2013 - 09:22 PM.

[Mycrus]

Victor Morson, on 29 April 2013 - 05:31 PM, said:

if they're playing Conquest, at all, the cap module is vital. There are absolutely no sensor modules of serious importance, and Target Info is more or less a luxury item. In fact, yes, I stand by get a Capture module first. The others are fringe bonuses, the cap module can make or break a game. If you're a newbie running around in Conquest or reaching the enemy base in Assault, that cap module can change the fate of the game. Target info cannot. EDIT: The only argument of order I could give is getting the Coolant 9 by 9 first, which is also helpful.

so you are the reason why all dem newbs tend to player capwarrior now...

[zraven7]

Ok, I have never used cap accelerator, ever. It is not vital, and I do cap bases as a tactic. As far as the rest of your "guide", this sounds more like "this is how I play, and everyone else is wrong".

[Victor Morson]

zraven7, on 30 April 2013 - 05:03 AM, said:

Ok, I have never used cap accelerator, ever. It is not vital, and I do cap bases as a tactic. As far as the rest of your "guide", this sounds more like "this is how I play, and everyone else is wrong".

Pssst... you're doing it wrong too.

And yes, you can capture bases without capture accelerator, but if you are planning on PUG'ing in a light, that extra speed in solo cap points is huge and can decide the fate of the game.

It makes the difference between "Victory" and "Oh, their lights got back in time." If your experience is based on the fact that no lights are coming to stop you, that just means you're playing some real low ELO battles, because every single time you start a cap - Conquest or Assault - you start a ticking time bomb of "when help comes back." The shorter the fuse, the better, so to speak.

Result: Yeah you can cap points without a cap accelerator, but it's also really dumb. I'd maybe prioritize Coolant 9 by 9 if you're more interested in assaults, though, since they don't really get to make nearly the impact to caps overall.. unless you're driving a 9M or something.

EDIT: I'm also not saying you NEED one to bother capping. For sure, cap as much as you can until you can get one! But it should be a priority purchase as it is one of the only modules that can be described as a game changer.

Edited by Victor Morson, 30 April 2013 - 11:20 AM.

[Koniving]

Skydrive, on 29 April 2013 - 03:14 PM, said:

Also, here is what I run on my JM6-DD. Its somewhat cheaper due to it not using an XL engine, and with the 2 ER PPC's, the 6MG's are actually able to hit internals fast. Whats more, due to the amount of MG's it can actually damage armour, thus quickening the stripping of a mech... though not by much.

Another thing, if you see an enemy mech that has a gauss rifle, and you know its in a side torso, aim for that section if the CT isn't already stripped, but if the side torso is also stripped, then only if the CT isn't also critical. For instance, an atlas has a gauss rifle and full armour, you aim for his right torso (or right rear torso if you can get there). If you destroy the gauss rifle before the side torso is destroyed, the gauss rifle will explode and cause damage to the mech. If it had an XL engine and the side torso is destroyed as a result, he is dead.

Done that build myself and got three kills with the MGs alone. Got called a hacker even, and read comments like "********!"

[Koniving]

Victor Morson, on 29 April 2013 - 05:34 PM, said:

6 MGs?

You might not be new but you might want to take some of what I've said here to heart yourself, man. That is a very, very weak PUG joke build. Recommending that to people is cruel and unusual punishment.

Seriously. Try a good build sometime, and you will understand what I mean.

EDIT: I hate to say it, but if you're new, please do yourself a favor and don't take any of Skydrive's advice. It's really bad.

Current damage with MGs.

1 MG bullet = 0.04 damage.
1 MG fires 10 bullets per second.
6 MGs fire 60 bullets per second for a damage of 2.4.
MGs get a bonus crit chance with a minimum of one crit and a maximum of three crits per bullet.
Crit chances are equal to one to three bullets (so 0.04 minimum, with 0.12 maximum) per bullet on top of the original 0.04.

6 MGs minimum damage to armor is 2.4 per second.
6 MGs minimum damage to structure is 2.4 per second + 2.4 for the same second to critical slots.
6 MGs Maximum Damage potential counting only the bullets themselves with triple crits per bullet and not the explosions after the fact is 2.4 per second + 7.2 crit damage for each second.

That's .4 short of an AC/10. A 7th MG would allow me to essentially do the same damage as an AC/10 or PPC per second.

Edited by Koniving, 30 April 2013 - 02:11 PM.

[Marvyn Dodgers]

As always, good analysis and commentary Koniving, wouldn't have thought about that.

[Victor Morson]

Koniving, on 30 April 2013 - 02:09 PM, said:

Current damage with MGs.

1 MG bullet = 0.04 damage.
1 MG fires 10 bullets per second.
6 MGs fire 60 bullets per second for a damage of 2.4.
MGs get a bonus crit chance with a minimum of one crit and a maximum of three crits per bullet.
Crit chances are equal to one to three bullets (so 0.04 minimum, with 0.12 maximum) per bullet on top of the original 0.04.

6 MGs minimum damage to armor is 2.4 per second.
6 MGs minimum damage to structure is 2.4 per second + 2.4 for the same second to critical slots.
6 MGs Maximum Damage potential counting only the bullets themselves with triple crits per bullet and not the explosions after the fact is 2.4 per second + 7.2 crit damage for each second.

That's .4 short of an AC/10. A 7th MG would allow me to essentially do the same damage as an AC/10 or PPC per second.

Taking a 'mech with 6 Ballistics and then jamming them full of MGs to get nearly the damage potential of an AC/10 is still stupid, as is focusing on their tiny crit chance which is likely to knock out a heatsink at best.

Given other Jaggers can mount 3 Ultra/5s and 3 Medium Lasers.. well let's do the math:

Jaggermech "Pugtastic" 6 MG + 2 ER PPC = 2.4 dps for MGs, 6.66 for ER PPCs (not counting heat), leading to 9.06 DPS for the Jaggermech above.

Jaggermech "Actually good" could have 3 Ultra/5s + 3 Medium Lasers = 13.65 for the Ultras, 15 for the Medium Lasers. For a total of 28.65. Plus since Ultras hit so hard each time, they have great crit chance too.

Now, to really point out how bad this is.. let's look at a typical light running 4 Mediums, 2 Streaks = 6 DPS for the Medium Lasers, 1.72 for the Streaks. That totals up to be 7.72 DPS - just behind your Jagger config, except it can hit at acceptable ranges and is mounted on something thirty tons lighter.

New people reading this and wondering "Who's right? The OP, or the guy arguing for 6 MG Jaggermechs?" I present you the cold heart truth. 9.06 point blank DPS, or 28.65 medium-long range DPS.

Make the smart call, folks.

EDIT: PS I find it hilarious that "almost as good as an AC/10" gets brought up, because the AC/10 is junk and you're dedicating a 'mech to carrying slightly less firepower than one. It's really bad.

EDIT 2: If MGs weren't tying up ballistic slots I'd feel different about them, but even then they're worthless right now. Even if they got buffed though, dedicating a 'mech to them is beyond silly.

Edited by Victor Morson, 30 April 2013 - 04:13 PM.

[Victor Morson]

Koniving, on 30 April 2013 - 02:05 PM, said:

Done that build myself and got three kills with the MGs alone. Got called a hacker even, and read comments like "********!"

You could bring a morning star onto a modern battlefield and maybe still brain someone with it, doesn't mean it doesn't suck compared to a rifle.

[Koniving]

Victor Morson, on 30 April 2013 - 04:02 PM, said:

EDIT: PS I find it hilarious that "almost as good as an AC/10" gets brought up, because the AC/10 is junk and you're dedicating a 'mech to carrying slightly less firepower than one. It's really bad.

EDIT 2: If MGs weren't tying up ballistic slots I'd feel different about them, but even then they're worthless right now. Even if they got buffed though, dedicating a 'mech to them is beyond silly.

One, you wouldn't use it as the primary weapon. Even MG Spiders carry a heavy laser.
Two, it's a heatless backup weapon and surprisingly effective.

Personally I think we should get at least two MGs per ballistic slot, and at least twice the current range. Also the MG is the only weapon that suffers from a "cone of accuracy." Which spatters them around the crosshair instead of at the "o" that all others aim for. We'll see what benefits we get.

But when engine crits are enabled, the minimum time you'll need to destroy an engine is 3 seconds, with a reasonable maximum time with leeway for waste and wrong crits being hit 8 seconds with 6 MGs only (after the armor is gone).

Made this just now. Thought it was comical.

Edited by Koniving, 30 April 2013 - 04:59 PM.

[Victor Morson]

Koniving, on 30 April 2013 - 04:59 PM, said:

Made this just now. Thought it was comical.

I do recommend anyone considering our POVs watch this video.

A similar Ultra/5 video would pretty much be about 6 seconds long and go "Rat-tat-tat boom."

EDIT: Seriously that poor Spider couldn't stop running into walls in his own sad MG boat and eventually gave up on life and let you just pour fire into his dinky CT armor for half a minute, heh... MGs are so sad.

EDIT 2: Open invite - do you want to settle this? I'll throw one of my Jaggermech pilots up against your MG build and we'll see which is worth recommending. That way anyone reading this thread and wondering who's right can get a pretty definitive answer. Just bring your team to help us sync drop it and everyone else can spectate.

We can do best of 5 or something, or play all 5, because I want enough footage to set the results to comical music, because there's no way this won't be kind of funny. Unless it's sad. It might be both.

Edited by Victor Morson, 30 April 2013 - 05:18 PM.

[Davoke]

"LRM's suck, because you know, i suck with them."
Really? That's why i see LRM's crippling or severely damaging a guy who gets moped up by brawles 2 minutes later.
Yeah right. LRM's are still viable, because they are.

As for AC/10's, i use them. Why?
Because they're great.
Ammo problems? Nope.
Range? Deals decent damage out to 900m.
Size/Weight? Definitely ain't an AC/20.
Damage? For PPC damage in a brawl, for it's lower heat, definitely worth it.

SRM's also suck?
Oh really?
I guess my Cataphract 2X is heresy, since it has SRM's AND an AC/10. Guess i should spend 3 million c-bills making a "practical" build that i'm going to do mediocre in.