58 replies to this topic

[Braggart]

We all want a balanced game.

How about tonnage limits(again). for eight people, lets say 450-500 tons. thats a 50-60 ton mech for everyone. Or someone takes a raven, and frees up room for a nice big deadly stalker, or highlander. Or a couple of people for reasonably deadly Jager/pults/phracts.

Not only will this help to bring balance back to the game, in terms of weapons and damage. Because the teams are not filled with 4-5 mechs that drop 30-60 point alphas all the time.

IT will allow Lights and mediums to have a place in the game. As the total amount of weapons and damage present in the match as any given time has been drastically lowered. Allowing lights and mediums to survive and do their role without getting 1 shot.

We dont need to nerf the ppcs, or gauss, or the mechs at all (outside of getting balance perfected). We just need limits to many are on the field at once.

This will be even more important when the game turns to 12vs12. Because if teams are filled with even more heavy and assault, light and mediums are even more screwed because of all the high alpha warfare, and then mechs will get destroyed in seconds for certain.

Just added this last part in an Edit.

So we have 4 mechs that can be readied at any time. What matchmaking does is look at all your mechs you have readied, and will look at those 4 and find one for you, It will try to go in order to select the one you want most, but could drop you down to your next choice, or further, depending on wait. If you dont have 4 readied, it could take a trial mech for you.

Edited by Braggart, 01 May 2013 - 09:52 AM.

[Yokaiko]

Can't work because it requires a team.

....and CoD kiddies don't like teams.

[Braggart]

Yokaiko, on 01 May 2013 - 09:44 AM, said:

Can't work because it requires a team.

....and CoD kiddies don't like teams.

match making can absolutely handle counting to 450 tons per team.

Perhaps people need to fill out their 4 slot mechs with different sizes to make it work. If they dont, then to make it work. they get tossed in with a trial mech.

[ElLocoMarko]

It is a great theory. Special events and mech releases cause a vast skew towards the new thing. I would think they could crunch a few numbers without ever even implementing it and figure out if the wait times would be unbearable.

Correction - you are saying we all ready four mechs and the MMaker picks for us. It is a nice theory. But what if I really want to run my brand new thing...

Edited by ElLocoMarko, 01 May 2013 - 09:51 AM.

[Yokaiko]

Braggart, on 01 May 2013 - 09:47 AM, said:

match making can absolutely handle counting to 450 tons per team.

Perhaps people need to fill out their 4 slot mechs with different sizes to make it work. If they dont, then to make it work. they get tossed in with a trial mech.

When three quarters of the players are in heavies and assaults it can't (watch you next drop)

[XSive Death]

Braggart, on 01 May 2013 - 09:43 AM, said:

Common sense

Welcome to 1998...mech commander. Worked perfectly fine. Great game.

Hopefully when the community warfare comes into play, we'll start to see tonnage limits on missions that allow people to decide what sort of composition they'll take.

[Yokaiko]

XSive Death, on 01 May 2013 - 09:51 AM, said:

Welcome to 1998...mech commander. Worked perfectly fine. Great game.

Hopefully when the community warfare comes into play, we'll start to see tonnage limits on missions that allow people to decide what sort of composition they'll take.

What missions, there are no missions, I can tell you where a fight is going to go down 95% of the times I drop and if it doesn't its because someone got creative and they get slaughtered for it.

[Braggart]

Yokaiko, on 01 May 2013 - 09:50 AM, said:

When three quarters of the players are in heavies and assaults it can't (watch you next drop)

I already posted how that can be fixed. in the main post.

[Yokaiko]

Now that would be hilarious.

So hilarious that if I guess wrong I get a TRIAL...**** that, I'd just not drop. I'm already damn near that point.

[Braggart]

Yokaiko, on 01 May 2013 - 09:55 AM, said:

Now that would be hilarious.

So hilarious that if I guess wrong I get a TRIAL...**** that, I'd just not drop. I'm already damn near that point.

pay attention, and you might learn something.

You have 4 mechs that can be ready at any time. Ever seen them on the left side of the screen before you launch. You choose an assortment of mechs. the 1 you really want, the one you would settle for, the 1 you would grudginly take, and the last resort. All mechs you own and outfit yourself. If you dont ready 4 of them, you could get a trial as a last resort. If you readied 4, and it couldnt get a match, it would time out.

Problem solved.

[SuomiWarder]

Although weight balancing has been promised to be phased into ELO in the next few weeks (if my memory serves), the general idea of a maximum team value is valid.

The matchmatker would gather players with prioeity to lights and mediums, then form groups. Perhaps in an 8v8 it would go to 6 v 8 if there are not enough lights (the 6 side having fewer mechs but the same total drop weight). In a 12 v 12 maybe 9 v 12 maximum adjustment.

People will start taking mediums and lights to get into games easier and to avoid being stuck on a team of heavies/assaults that is a few mechs down.

[Braggart]

SuomiWarder, on 01 May 2013 - 09:59 AM, said:

Although weight balancing has been promised to be phased into ELO in the next few weeks (if my memory serves), the general idea of a maximum team value is valid.

The matchmatker would gather players with prioeity to lights and mediums, then form groups. Perhaps in an 8v8 it would go to 6 v 8 if there are not enough lights (the 6 side having fewer mechs but the same total drop weight). In a 12 v 12 maybe 9 v 12 maximum adjustment.

People will start taking mediums and lights to get into games easier and to avoid being stuck on a team of heavies/assaults that is a few mechs down.

balancing, but not limits.

Without limits, it will still simply be large amount of assaults and heavies and even worse when 12vs12 lands. This is because those mechs are the deadliest. Without fail, and can destroy or cripple a medium or light in a single volley. Now picture the entire other team each having that chance to cripple your mech in an instant. That is why we hardly see lights and mediums anymore. You get maybe 1 or 2 on your team in a match. Because they are a hindrance, unless you get one of the large maps where that light can spend the match running and capping because its so much fun for them to play that way, instead of doing what all the other mechs get to do.

I'm not sure how I feel about lopsiding a team. mostly because certain game modes like conquest would favor the team with more players.

Edited by Braggart, 01 May 2013 - 10:04 AM.

[hammerreborn]

I sincerely doubt tonnage limits would do anything but be like the WoW dungeon finder queues. DPS (heavies/assaults) take 10 minutes to find a match while healers and tanks (lights/mediums) get insta grouped.

When over 2/3 of the playerbase is in 65 tons and up (mainly 70, 85, 90, and 100), tonnage limits aren't going to help anyone find groups.

And while you could go "well then assaults will play lights!" but then I respond, ya, and shadow priests queued as healers, and that was ******* terrible. The last thing I want in my wolf pack bretheren is some wanna-be poptard.

[Hobo Dan]

SuomiWarder, on 01 May 2013 - 09:59 AM, said:

People will start taking mediums and lights to get into games easier and to avoid being stuck on a team of heavies/assaults that is a few mechs down.

I think that is a key argument here. Does PGI want to tell people who only enjoy running Heavies and Assaults to wait longer and be shorthanded or run lighter mechs? I don't think they do.

[Braggart]

Hobo Dan, on 01 May 2013 - 10:04 AM, said:

I think that is a key argument here. Does PGI want to tell people who only enjoy running Heavies and Assaults to wait longer and be shorthanded or run lighter mechs? I don't think they do.

they are currently telling people who run lights or mediums that you are 1 shot away from death at all times. Enjoy being the weak link for your team.

[Rackminster]

So by this, if I'm in an Atlas mood, I'd have to have 4 of them readied. I'm currently 40% of the way towards buying my third.

I prefer to spend each night I play in a specific chassis/class so I can get into a groove. Last night it was Atlas mechs. Tonight it might be Mediums or Catapults.

Braggart, on 01 May 2013 - 10:08 AM, said:

they are currently telling people who run lights or mediums that you are 1 shot away from death at all times. Enjoy being the weak link for your team.

Man, what game do you play - or do you play so badly that you stare a 6xPPC Stalker in the face and let him line up a solid shot on your CT while you're in a Raven? There are no bad mechs, only bad pilots. Okay, some mechs aren't great and contribute very little - but they're all Commandos.

Lights are harassment units - they demoralize enemies by capping bases, fight opposing lights, distress snipers/LRM's, and bring down resource nodes better than anyone else.

Mediums make excellent flank and support Mechs, working to keep Lights off heavier Mechs and piling on damage to bring down targets. They're not worthless, not by a long shot.

Edited by Rackminster, 01 May 2013 - 10:29 AM.

[Braggart]

Rackminster, on 01 May 2013 - 10:08 AM, said:

So by this, if I'm in an Atlas mood, I'd have to have 4 of them readied. I'm currently 40% of the way towards buying my third.

I prefer to spend each night I play in a specific chassis/class so I can get into a groove. Last night it was Atlas mechs. Tonight it might be Mediums or Catapults.

If the game's population is small enough that we cant get a mixture of all classes and tonnages. The game is already on its way to dying.

I have pretty much had it with the game at this point, and many others are also. If people ask me about mechwarrior. My word of mouth for the game is not favorable.

Edited by Braggart, 01 May 2013 - 10:13 AM.

[Ngamok]

Yokaiko, on 01 May 2013 - 09:44 AM, said:

Can't work because it requires a team.

....and CoD kiddies don't like teams.

It's not that they don't like teams. It's that people don't play the game 24/7 and when they aren't on, it's solo. I haven't played in 2 weeks. Mostly due to Defiance and partly GW2.

[XSive Death]

Yokaiko, on 01 May 2013 - 09:54 AM, said:

What missions, there are no missions, I can tell you where a fight is going to go down 95% of the times I drop and if it doesn't its because someone got creative and they get slaughtered for it.

No missions YET.

People all too often forget about the meta-game that will arrive down the line.

Quick brainstorm...two factions have borders together, faction 1 offers up a mission to capture planet X from faction 2, being so close to the border of faction 1, the tonnage limit is set as high as possible. Faction 2 offers up a mission to attack deep in faction 1 territory (some special generating planet thing), unfortunately because of the distance needed to travel, the tonnage limit is much lower.

Unfortunately i'm not part of the design team, so not privy to how they intend to play out the bigger game....will just have to wait and see.

[Braggart]

XSive Death, on 01 May 2013 - 10:35 AM, said:

No missions YET.

People all too often forget about the meta-game that will arrive down the line.

Quick brainstorm...two factions have borders together, faction 1 offers up a mission to capture planet X from faction 2, being so close to the border of faction 1, the tonnage limit is set as high as possible. Faction 2 offers up a mission to attack deep in faction 1 territory (some special generating planet thing), unfortunately because of the distance needed to travel, the tonnage limit is much lower.

Unfortunately i'm not part of the design team, so not privy to how they intend to play out the bigger game....will just have to wait and see.

that doesnt fix things now. Right now PGI is asking for our money, and attempting to draw more customers in. What is coming or not coming in the future is not important at the moment. They could have an incredible game a year from now, but if they lose me and others now, we might not come back.

I also think you might be expecting to much from PGI when it comes to missions. The game is likely just gonna be Assault/Conquest over and over to win a planet. What you say sounds great, but we have no idea anything like that will ever come out. So I will not consider it at all.

Edited by Braggart, 01 May 2013 - 10:39 AM.