142 replies to this topic

[Nicholas Carlyle]

Zyllos, on 02 May 2013 - 10:53 AM, said:

There is no way they can fit 3 or 4 more balancing patches between now and release when it takes 30 days to decided on a new change, test it, then get it out to the community, who breaks it within 24 to 48 hours.

This is where I hope the public test server will come into play. Make a change quickly, have us break it quickly, then add a new change quickly. Hopefully this can happen within a weeks time unless it requires code/object changes.

If we can really get all these changes in on the 21st, I have more hope than I have had for a solid 2-3 months.

The BAP change especially shows a shift in philosophy.

I'm not saying they don't take too long sometimes, but lets not beat them up too much over something good.

[3rdworld]

zraven7, on 02 May 2013 - 10:53 AM, said:

Oh, I'm already working parts of my brain trying to figure out how to shoe-horn another 1.5 tons onto my Jennies, trust me.

Just use a streak pult, mounting BAP will not be hard. When LRMs are good again, you just have to mount a BAP and getting covered by an ecm is no longer an issue.

[TruePoindexter]

3rdworld, on 02 May 2013 - 10:47 AM, said:

BAP now completely counters ECM.

One of the most heavy handed "balance" changes I have seen in a while.

What is the point of disrupt mode again?

Hrm.... that is a strange decision for sure... I guess we'll be going back to Jenners? Seems too far in the other direction.

Most of the changes sound good. The AC5 range change is also... odd. They want the UAC5 to still be relevant and I guess they want the AC5 to be more of a sniper weapon? Odd.

[Keifomofutu]

Zyllos, on 02 May 2013 - 10:55 AM, said:

Hmm, that is a good question indeed.

I still think ECM should be hiding all other mechs within 180m but only increase the lockon time by 100% (or whatever it does now for locking on). The mech with ECM equipped should gain all the current benefits.

It seemed to indicate that ECM would be completely shut off while in range of BAP. Just like when ECM is hit by PPCs. The above did state that 150m range of BAP was a number "in progress" and could be changed.

Quote

Mech Y is now vulnerable to LRMs/S-SRMs as long as Mech X stays within 150m. Any friendly Mechs to Mech Y will no longer be shielded until Mech X leaves the 150m area around Mech Y.

Edited by Keifomofutu, 02 May 2013 - 10:58 AM.

[MaddMaxx]

Welly, well, well. Who would have thunk it after all the NOISE!

Their new 1.5t unit now negates the enemies 1.5t unit. Now everyone carries more gear and less guns.

Didn't you hear. No one ever used "D" anyways so it was set aside so to speak.

Edited by MaddMaxx, 02 May 2013 - 11:00 AM.

[3rdworld]

Keifomofutu, on 02 May 2013 - 10:55 AM, said:

As the best gunboat of the light class shouldn't that be their job anyway? This whole ravens act as both disruption of the entire enemy team AND the best light hunter was wildly imbalanced against the other lights.

So instead of bringing them in line, lets just make ravens obsolete because any jenner can negate their only advantage simply by being near enough to them to engage.

[Sephlock]

jeffsw6, on 02 May 2013 - 10:49 AM, said:

I am discouraged by the Machine Gun buff. I think a 100% damage increase and 1/3rd range increase is not nearly enough. Not adjusting their spread, maybe that's tougher to figure out; but ... I don't think they understand how gimp the MG is. They have gone from claiming that MGs were fine and stating that a 6MG Spider could "core the back of an Atlas in seconds" to buffing it 100% and yet, this will not be enough.

Still, at least they're addressing it.

[Zyllos]

3rdworld, on 02 May 2013 - 10:59 AM, said:

So instead of bringing them in line, lets just make ravens obsolete because any jenner can negate their only advantage simply by being near enough to them to engage.

Agreed.

This is also placing a larger emphasis on maximizing your engine size. If you run ECM or BAP, you better be the fastest thing out there or your going to be hunted and destroyed easily be ECM hunters.

[Keifomofutu]

3rdworld, on 02 May 2013 - 10:59 AM, said:

So instead of bringing them in line, lets just make ravens obsolete because any jenner can negate their only advantage simply by being near enough to them to engage.

The current light "balance" is for Raven to be the numero uno light in virtually every situation. That's not balance at all.

Raven will still be a good gunboat after the change. It just won't be the best one. Jenner can't disrupt the enemy team. You really sound like you want to have your cake and eat it too with the Raven 3L.

Edited by Keifomofutu, 02 May 2013 - 11:06 AM.

[Acid Phase]

Best sounding patch up to date. Although I believe there should be a slight drawback to using BAP & ECM. Both equipments should generate a bit of heat.

Edited by Acid Phase, 02 May 2013 - 11:07 AM.

[Mechteric]

Very nice changes, can't wait to see it live! Now while I don't think everyone will need to be running around with BAP it will certainly give us a tool that can help out when not running an ECM mech ourselves!

Acid Phase, on 02 May 2013 - 11:04 AM, said:

Best sounding patch up to date. Although I believe there should be a slight drawback to using BAP & ECM. Both equipments generates a bit of heat.

A Gauss rifle builds relatively no heat and pulls more energy, so that really makes no sense.

Edited by CapperDeluxe, 02 May 2013 - 11:07 AM.

[PropagandaWar]

3rdworld, on 02 May 2013 - 10:47 AM, said:

What is the point of disrupt mode again?

For those times you need to stop and smell your finger. Yep ECM counters that too.

[3rdworld]

Keifomofutu, on 02 May 2013 - 11:04 AM, said:

The current light "balance" is for Raven to be the numbero uno light in virtually every situation. That's not balance at all.

Raven will still be a good gunboat after the change. It just won't be the best one. Jenner can't disrupt the enemy team. You really sound like you want to have your cake and eat it too with the Raven 3L.

Doesn't matter to me either way, I don't play lights.

But trading 1 OP mech for a different OP mech specifically when the second mech has many more tools than the first, is not how you balance a game.

[Keifomofutu]

CapperDeluxe, on 02 May 2013 - 11:05 AM, said:

Very nice changes, can't wait to see it live! Now while I don't think everyone will need to be running around with BAP it will certainly give us a tool that can help out when not running an ECM mech ourselves!

I think a lot of light mechs are going to run it. After all raven always should have been afraid of the light gunboats rather than the other way around.

[PropagandaWar]

I'll be happy when my Serms HSR and to get a lil punch back. Don't want it uber just want to justify its use again.

[TruePoindexter]

Keifomofutu, on 02 May 2013 - 11:04 AM, said:

The current light "balance" is for Raven to be the numbero uno light in virtually every situation. That's not balance at all.

Raven will still be a good gunboat after the change. It just won't be the best one. Jenner can't disrupt the enemy team. You really sound like you want to have your cake and eat it too with the Raven 3L.

Well in the current common meta the jamming capabilities of the 3L are of questionable use. You're not hiding your team from the LRM rain of yore. Most of the time you're just protecting yourself from SSRMs which it seems will no longer be consistently possible.

I think the 3L will still be viable but the JR7-D will return to the throne. We're not fixing the light issue so much as trading one ruler for another.

Edited by TruePoindexter, 02 May 2013 - 11:08 AM.

[General Taskeen]

BAP joins the long list of Big Fish Balancing!

Equip this, equip that, counter with this, counter with that. So dumb. If I want to use a Record Sheet Challenge Mech, wihout BAP, without TAG, without ECM, without PPC, I guess I'm out of luck.

[Jasen]

/me thinks IGP finally stepped in and slapped the PGI balance overlords in the face...

A lot of 180s in this post... think about it.

That IGP pocket book has been hurting a bit lately I bet... good times.

[Shadowsword8]

With this, MG might now actually be worth taking. Yes, they still won't do damage comparable to other weapons, but keep in mind that it's almost "free" damage, very little weight and no heat involved.

The boost to BAP is... better than the current situation, and a viable counter (for once), but I don't like the fact that instead of making a must-have item less must-have, they have pretty much given that status to another item. This method of balancing does not provide a good result a few years down the road.

NARC, don't care about it. Does someone actually plan to ever use one?

The new LBX10 still doesn't feel worth it's tonnage. SRM is a better "flak" weapon and much cheaper in tonnage.

[TheMadPoet]

While we will have to wait and see how it all plays out, I really like every change outlined. I can finally get some real use out of BAP, and maybe my LB10X carries will be at least somewhat more effective.