23 replies to this topic

[MrTarget]

So CASE, how should this work?

Is it supposed to protect the Components in the torso or Protect the other Parts of the mech from the Ammo Explosion(Like CT).

If the latter then why is it always found on mechs with XL engines when it will provide no benefit at all.

Example Stock build: http://mwo.smurfy-ne...ae339f0e12b03a3

I know that there are lots of stock builds that have XL's and no Case but there are a few that have both.

If it is only there to stop the damage from spreading to the CT/Arm then why put it on mech's with an XL engines?

Sarna Extract:
CASE, short for Cellular Ammunition Storage Equipment, was created by the Terran Hegemony in 2476 as a system designed to reduce the hazards of carrying volatile or explosive equipment, usually ammunition. CASE is essentially a specialized container structure for housing the equipment, and redirects explosive force in the event that the equipment explodes. While this makes it invaluable for preventing excessive internal damage, CASE does not actually stop the explosion, it merely contains and redirects the explosive force, so after an explosion units likely will be crippled or nonfunctional, though not destroyed outright.

It has kinda been bugging me since closed beta so a friend and I tested it out in a match (apologies to those in the match, if we could gift some C-Bills we would) by placing an XL, a side torso full of ammo and then put case in the same torso. I then fired at that torso and his mech was blown to high heaven.

Anyone give an answer to this?

Thanks for your input guys!

Edited by MrTarget, 07 May 2013 - 09:46 AM.

[Kargush]

I use it on mechs that have explosive stuff in the arms or sidetorsos (note: never on XL mechs). Might just save me when that gauss rifle goes boom.

[Demos]

Yes, you are right. In the current game CASE is superflous when using a XL Engine.
It would be useful, when R&R would be implemented, as it would be cheaper to repair a mech than the replace a completely destroyed one.

[Kibble]

Putting a CASE on a mech with xl is just worthless or it's just filler space to get the tonnage to a nice round number. All CASE does is prevent any ammo exploading damage from traveling inward to your CT.

[Lord Perversor]

Most of the Stock configs with XL and C.A.S.E. are a legacy from TT where the survival of more mech parts/engine parts along a campaign was important in order to save extra credits.


As far i recall (not 100% sure on this) the C.A.S.E. do not prevent the mech destroyed if the side torso blows up but it could prevent the loss of the Xl engine on the long run.

[Sadistic Savior]

MrTarget, on 07 May 2013 - 09:45 AM, said:

So CASE, how should this work?

Is it supposed to protect the Components in the torso or Protect the other Parts of the mech from the Ammo Explosion(Like CT).

It prevents spillover damage. Thats it.

If you have an ammo explosion in your right leg/torso/arm, for example, it will never get to your CT or head. No matter how much damage it is. It is stopped at wherever CASE is located.

[Yiazmat]

CASE dose protect from blown gauss rifles though. So, in theory, a CASE can save your XL from poping from a Gauss rifle explotion. Takt the K2 with an XL engine. You're not running CASE and someone opens up your side and crits out the Gauss rifle. POW! 20 damage to your side, XL engine pops, you're dead. But if you have CASE in the side, your torso is opened, the Gauss goes boom, but you're still up and have a second rifle to use still. IMO, a dead gauss cat is worth much much less than a crippled gauss cat.

[TruePoindexter]

All CASE does is prevent damage from transferring - the damage can and will still destroy the section it is in. CASE is only useful if you absolutely must put ammo in LT/RT and do not have an XL engine. There are very few cases where CASE is useful.

I'm not sure if it prevents an ammo explosion in your LA/RA/LL/RL from transferring all the way to your CT but MWO's explosions aren't that strong anyway so if this is happening you're basically dead already.

[ShadowbaneX]

Yiazmat, on 07 May 2013 - 10:18 AM, said:

CASE dose protect from blown gauss rifles though. So, in theory, a CASE can save your XL from poping from a Gauss rifle explotion. Takt the K2 with an XL engine. You're not running CASE and someone opens up your side and crits out the Gauss rifle. POW! 20 damage to your side, XL engine pops, you're dead. But if you have CASE in the side, your torso is opened, the Gauss goes boom, but you're still up and have a second rifle to use still. IMO, a dead gauss cat is worth much much less than a crippled gauss cat.

Actually that's how CASE II worked and it opened up the rear armour...actually, in all cases CASE blew out the rear armour, which is a hint that it's main purpose was to prevent those lucky crits from striking an ammo bin and taking out the entire mech.

The way ammo (or Gauss rifle) explosions work is that when they go up they do damage to the section they're in first and if there's any left over damage it's applied inward (usually to the CT). In the case of Gauss and an XL, the damage would still be applied internally likely blowing up the 3 parts of the XL engine which would drop you.

[Escef]

Sadistic Savior, on 07 May 2013 - 10:10 AM, said:

It prevents spillover damage. Thats it.

If you have an ammo explosion in your right leg/torso/arm, for example, it will never get to your CT or head. No matter how much damage it is. It is stopped at wherever CASE is located.

Damage does not transfer to or from the head. At least not in TT. Hell, using Experimental level rules in TT, the best way to prevent an ammo explosion from coring your mech is to use a torso-mounted cockpit and put all the ammo in the now-mostly-empty head.

[Yiazmat]

huh. odd. while i believe you're right, shadowbane, I think mwo may have it wrong. I've had my gauss crit out before with an xl and case and lived. Several times actually. bug, perhaps?

[TarkaTarquol]

Having a Gauss explode with an XL does not instantly mean death. Gauss only explodes for 20 points of damage. Your Side Torso, if it has more than 20 HP left, will survive if the Gauss explodes.

[ShadowbaneX]

Yiazmat, on 07 May 2013 - 06:33 PM, said:

huh. odd. while i believe you're right, shadowbane, I think mwo may have it wrong. I've had my gauss crit out before with an xl and case and lived. Several times actually. bug, perhaps?

There's a 90% chance of the Gauss detonating which means 10% of the time it does no damage when it's destroyed. Also, if we're following TT rules, it does 20 points of damage, which might not be enough to destroy the section it's in...especially if it's in an arm as the damage would be applied to the arm's structure first, then the torso's structure. It'd quite possible to lose a gauss and not lose the side torso beside it.

Ammo on the other hand does a stupid amount of damage when they explode so if one of those go up, expect to lose whatever's nearby...and that's why CASE exists.

[ProtoformX]

Yep, CASE works great for Gauss rifles even with an XL engine. It seems that instead of the 'rear ejection' and loss of the torso section you get with ammo, the rifle simply doesn't explode. I experienced this first-hand playing many many rounds in an XL Atlas in the competition last week(it got ballistic-side-torso-cored almost every single round, and the Gauss rifle never exploded with CASE installed).

[Lyoto Machida]

ProtoformX, on 07 May 2013 - 08:59 PM, said:

Yep, CASE works great for Gauss rifles even with an XL engine. It seems that instead of the 'rear ejection' and loss of the torso section you get with ammo, the rifle simply doesn't explode. I experienced this first-hand playing many many rounds in an XL Atlas in the competition last week(it got ballistic-side-torso-cored almost every single round, and the Gauss rifle never exploded with CASE installed).

XL Atlas...sounds crazy. Was it a K also or did you put an XL in one of the other variants???

[ProtoformX]

Lyoto Machida, on 07 May 2013 - 09:06 PM, said:

XL Atlas...sounds crazy. Was it a K also or did you put an XL in one of the other variants???

RS actually. It was just to be stupid and fun, but it turned out to be a solid build; however, not a match survivor. He's since been refitted to a STD engine, which has made a world of difference.

[Roadbuster]

Kibble, on 07 May 2013 - 09:49 AM, said:

Putting a CASE on a mech with xl is just worthless or it's just filler space to get the tonnage to a nice round number. All CASE does is prevent any ammo exploading damage from traveling inward to your CT.

Why should it be useless for XL engines then?
If you carry a Gauss in your torso and run a XL it's a good idea to put a CASE in that body part too.
Same with ammo.

EDIT: Ok. If CASE shouldn't or doesn't work with Gauss then, yes, it's useless for XL engines.

Edited by Roadbuster, 08 May 2013 - 04:20 AM.

[ShadowbaneX]

Putting CASE in with Gauss and not having it explode has to either be 1) a bug or 2) you're extremely lucky.

CASE should not prevent a Gauss Rifle from exploding, it should just prevent the explosion from hitting the Center Torso. Further, CASE only works for the section it's in. If you've got (non-Gauss) ammo in your arms or legs and it cooks off any extra damage should transfer to the Side Torso that the limb is connected do. If there's still sufficient damage (and in the case of ammo explosion this is very liikely), then any extra damage should be applied to the components inside that section, then be applied to the rear armour, and any additional damage left over after that should be vented out the back (ie ignored).

For any interested here's the Sarna entry for CASE.

[ProtoformX]

Agreed, Shadow, it should not work like this according to lore. I'm saying this is what I've observed in game. You can hear when your Gauss rifle pops(glass smashing sound), and seconds later it'll explode almost every single time(90% obviously). With CASE, no explosions. Personally I kinda like that it gives at least a small use to CASE for XL engines.

On another note, I see a couple of you talking about CASEing arm ammo/Gauss. Sadly you can't put CASE in your arms. It's a torso-only component.

[armyof1]

Ammo only has a 10% chance to explode and Gauss only explodes for 20 damage and the spillover damage from the side torso to CT I believe is only 50% of the rest damage when the said side torso is gone. For example if your side torso internals with Gauss has 15 HP left when the Gauss explodes, it'll take out that side torso and the rest damage of 5 turns into 2.5 damage to the CT, and Case will just prevent that 2.5 damage. So case really isn't that useful unless you have huge amounts of ammo and of course running a std engine. I usually put most ammo in the legs and the rest that usually gets used up before I get my armor stripped in the arms/CT.