79 replies to this topic

[Wintersdark]

You seriously believe that a metagame advantage will lead most - or even many - players to pick a route that will exclude the most powerful mechs?

Clan mech's won't be less customizable, and they definitely won't cap how many you can have (mech bays are a major point of MC spending). Sure, there can be other metagame disadvantages, but really... Forget players. Forget polls. People who voted "I won't join a clan" didn't vote "I don't want to pilot clan mechs", as that's a very, very different answer.

Forget forum folks - we're a small subset of the playerbase, and we're the most likely to be outliers in such matters.

The choice is simple:

You can pilot the most powerful mechs in the universe, or not.

Do you really think many people will be content giving up their Dire Wolfs, etc? And, this is the important part: Particularly after facing them in combat?

The vast majority of people will always take the route that gives them the most direct power. And, while we're all looking forward to Community Warfare, everything will still be decided on the battlefield. The major focus of the game? Ultimately, the battlefield.

Lots of people may initially pick IS factions, but if they find they cannot use clan mechs (something I still think is absolutely not going to the be case) they'll desert in droves. This is something that's played out over and over in MMO's everywhere. If one class is substantially more powerful than others in game, people will gravitate to that class - and they'll do that when it's just a balance problem that they know will be fixed over time. If they knew it wouldn't be fixed? That one (or several, in this case) factions simply get more powerful mechs?

Yeah...

No, Clan mechs will be available to everyone. They have to be, or people will desert the IS in droves.

[armyof1]

As long as it comes standard with over 9000 heat before shutdown.

[Covah1606]

Everyone is assuming that YOU CAN BUY CLAN TECH!!!!!! If memory serves, an IS individual had to either salvage ANY clan tech from defeated clanners, OR, become a clan bondsman and hope to god that a mechwarrior slot opened. Clan tech was never on the market.

[Fastfire]

Covah1606, on 14 May 2013 - 01:07 PM, said:

Everyone is assuming that YOU CAN BUY CLAN TECH!!!!!! If memory serves, an IS individual had to either salvage ANY clan tech from defeated clanners, OR, become a clan bondsman and hope to god that a mechwarrior slot opened. Clan tech was never on the market.

And lone wolfes dont walk over to the manufacturer and order "4 Atlas mechs to go please, one of each variant, i got the millions of C bills right here in my pocket."

What "should be according to Battle tech lore" and what "WILL be because of gameplay reasons"
are two very different pair of shoes.

[Nick Drezary]

Covah1606, on 14 May 2013 - 01:07 PM, said:

Everyone is assuming that YOU CAN BUY CLAN TECH!!!!!! If memory serves, an IS individual had to either salvage ANY clan tech from defeated clanners, OR, become a clan bondsman and hope to god that a mechwarrior slot opened. Clan tech was never on the market.

The thing is that PGI has already rejected from the mech parts salvage system, same with R&r.
And Great houses were working on manufacturing of Clan tech.(May be good idea would be to give Clan tech to clanners first and then month or two after make it available to the IS folks)
About the prices... I'm rite now sitting on the 300million C-bills, so I'm fine with them

[Schrottfrosch]

Nick here is absolutely right - also in addition:

Clans are extremely competitive. The Warrior castes bullied all other castes around all the time - I bet that the trader castes and the dark castes are going to pay them back, by leveling the battlefield a bit.

Ever watched "Lord of war" with Nicolas Cage?

They are going to sell a lot of godd hardware to the enemy just for profit - and for the prospect of some bloody noses of their fellow warrior clans-brethren....

also they are genetically enhanced - so what could possibly go wrong by giving some dead technology away?

[Monsoon]

In7h, on 11 May 2013 - 02:22 PM, said:

You say that like it isn't already.

You say that like you've never played any other MMO ever. Go ahead, jump on in on Eve Online, Neverwinter, or any other game you like and see just how 'cheap' they really are in comparison.

[Gremlich Johns]

Actually, if I select Clan as my faction, I should just win my mech in a Trial.

[Hellcat420]

Carl Wrede, on 10 May 2013 - 07:09 PM, said:

The clanmechs should be that expensive yes.

considering how nerfed clantech is gonna be and how innersphere mechs are already essentially omnimechs i dont think they should be that expensive.

[Nehkrosis]

Hold on now.
If were saying that we think that people will play Clans arbitrarily because they will naturally do better and are more powerful etc,
we do also have to factor in the very possible likelihood that it wont be fairly matched numerically.

3 IS lances vs 2 CLAN Stars sounds about right to me.

and those who might just want to use the most powerful tech will still have to play pretty well.
I think it will end up pretty balanced.

[aralad]

I'm looking forward to lots of expensive Timber Wolves with XL engines poked up above ridge-lines ready to get shot off. See the sig above.

That made a lot more sense when I was replying on page 1

[Stormwolf]

The price is probably going to be lower since the IS mechs from TRO 3050 also got their prices lowered:

Atlas AS7-K
Original: 22,372,000
MWO: 13,691,066

Centurion CN9-D
Original: 9,448,500
MWO: 8,158,590

Stalker STIK-5S
Original: 15,920,175
MWO: 10,921,480

[OpCentar]

Nehkrosis, on 05 June 2013 - 06:17 PM, said:

Hold on now.
If were saying that we think that people will play Clans arbitrarily because they will naturally do better and are more powerful etc,
we do also have to factor in the very possible likelihood that it wont be fairly matched numerically.

3 IS lances vs 2 CLAN Stars sounds about right to me.

and those who might just want to use the most powerful tech will still have to play pretty well.
I think it will end up pretty balanced.

That works in TT where you have rolls to hit etc.

In MWO with pinpoint targeting 2 stars (10 clan mechs) win vs 3 lances (12 IS mechs) every time.

[Nauht]

As others have said we're basically playing with omnimechs now. It's not like we're playing with fixed IS config mechs (as they should be) v Clan omnis. The difference is not that big now.

It'll be more like what faction do you want to play more. You'd be surprised - in every faction game to date there always seems to be a good balance of people choosing the 'good' side as opposed to the 'evil' side. Matter of personal preference. I'm predicting that we'll probably have a good spread. Sure the masses will go Clan when they first come out then it'll even out.

As to cost i've already got close to 45mil cb and nothing to spend it on. This is with 15 mechbays, all full, one hero (Flame) and bought all the modules/engines I need. Each of my four selected active mechs has a seismic and capture accelerator as standard modules with the third tailored to that mech role. By the time the clans come I'd say I could easily buy 3 variants of the Timber Wolf no problems.

[w0rm]

Only 24,000,000? I'll buy a dozen then.

[Morang]

I want really scary clanners, not "balanced" clan tech. Overpowered to the core, but overpriced in store and outweighted/outnumbered in battle, this way.

Edited by Morang, 06 June 2013 - 03:29 AM.

[Nick Drezary]

Nehkrosis, on 05 June 2013 - 06:17 PM, said:

3 IS lances vs 2 CLAN Stars sounds about right to me.

3 Lances vs 2 stars is 12vs10, victories with one or two guys down from the beginning are pretty common even now, with clantech 10 team will just annihilate 12 one

Edited by Nick Drezary, 06 June 2013 - 03:35 AM.

[Nehkrosis]

Well as said above, IS mechs are not going to be the under-powered things they are in the fluff.
If i can lash Endo, DHS, an XL, and totally kit out my weapon and equipment loadout based on what my team are equipping, then i am an IS Omni-mech without the Clan tech.

and i am fairly positive that having two additional players on the IS team is going to be a decently balancing factor against me and my clan buddies having ER, Streak, Ultra and LBX tech.


It is not like IS forces will be dropping in trial mechs.

[Commander Kobold]

aralad, on 05 June 2013 - 09:04 PM, said:

I'm looking forward to lots of expensive Timber Wolves with XL engines poked up above ridge-lines ready to get shot off. See the sig above.

That made a lot more sense when I was replying on page 1

Clan XLs don't explode then the side torso goes...

[Der BruzZzler von Wiesndoof]

Morang, on 06 June 2013 - 02:52 AM, said:

I want really scary clanners, not "balanced" clan tech. Overpowered to the core, but overpriced in store and outweighted/outnumbered in battle, this way.

^This!
24.000.000 for a Timber Wolf? Yeah, y not! I have enough useless C-bills. I could buy more than ten of them, but i prefer the "select clanfaction and win a Omni by a trial theory"!