32 replies to this topic

[Forty Eight]

So, I haven't been playing an insanely long amount of time but I just recently (a couple of days ago) switched from Heavy and Medium mechs to lights and I have to say: people generally don't pay attention to me in a Jenner hauling ***.

Occasionally, I'll get the enemies teams lights to play hide and go boom but for the most part, I can run lateral through an enemies lines and catch two or three poor hits on my armor.

So I was wondering, is that just the general idea of things with most pug games? I've lost countless games to a light mech finishing off teammates structure, capping all the points and hiding, etc. So why does no one ever attempt to blast them?

I know when I was in a K2 and 4 PPCing, I would intentional targets lights because they generally **** me off; however, everyone gets livid when you see a light go by, and shoot at it. My whole text box fills with "don't chase after a lone raven!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!"

I'm not complaining about it, because it gets me consistent 500 damage games in a Jenner, but what are your thoughts on the matter?

[Phoenix Gray]

"Never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake." -- Napoleon Bonaparte

It's Christmas for lights in PUG games. Enjoy it while it lasts.

[Pac Man]

There's a difference between firing at the Raven who runs across the map, and turning around and chasing him. That's what people get the most worked up about is having one light draw two, three sometimes four mechs off the front line to go dance around behind the main line.

I blast lights whenever I can, and will turn and engage them, but I generally don't chase them unless I'm in a light/medium myself. As for being the guy in the light, your ultimate success is when you annoy enough people into chasing you around while the rest of your team steam rolls over a ridge, or around a corner. Less and less now are lights actually used for scouting, and more and more as bait.

Edit: Spelling

Edited by Pac Man, 05 May 2013 - 07:59 PM.

[Kenyon Burguess]

depends on the situation and what the light mech is doing, but usually if I can get away with it, I apply quick alpha and move on to what I was doing. lights aren't protected by lag shield and broken hitboxes anymore (supposedly) and with the upcoming increase in lrm speed and BAP targeting lights will have to be extremely cautious around the big mechs from here on out.

[torgian]

On a personal note, I find that blasting lights is, well, quite frankly, too hard to do. I don't mean it's hard to hit them, I just feel like they're unsatisfying because of the following reason:

To me, lights should be more fragile than they are. I should be able to plant a couple of solid laser hits and hurt him bad, or fire an ac20 through a torso and move on. Instead, we get lights that can move through the combat lines with relative impunity, take a few hits, and move on. They should be fragile enough so that a few hits can disable them; this would make light mech pilots be smarter than the average bear... stick to hit and run tactics, hunt other lights, scout, or base tag.

Granted, this wouldn't satisfy the general player base, and the tears would flow if the above opinion was implemented, but that's just how I feel. In any game I do fight off the lights because I know how dangerous they can be if left to their own devices, but unless I have two or three friendlies teaming up against one light, I don't go chasing after them.

Meh, I'm probably not making any sense lol. Move on...

[Shiro Matsumoto]

torgian, on 05 May 2013 - 07:59 PM, said:

On a personal note, I find that blasting lights is, well, quite frankly, too hard to do. I don't mean it's hard to hit them, I just feel like they're unsatisfying because of the following reason:

To me, lights should be more fragile than they are. I should be able to plant a couple of solid laser hits and hurt him bad, or fire an ac20 through a torso and move on. Instead, we get lights that can move through the combat lines with relative impunity, take a few hits, and move on. They should be fragile enough so that a few hits can disable them; this would make light mech pilots be smarter than the average bear... stick to hit and run tactics, hunt other lights, scout, or base tag.

Granted, this wouldn't satisfy the general player base, and the tears would flow if the above opinion was implemented, but that's just how I feel. In any game I do fight off the lights because I know how dangerous they can be if left to their own devices, but unless I have two or three friendlies teaming up against one light, I don't go chasing after them.

Meh, I'm probably not making any sense lol. Move on...

Play one. You will feel diffrent then.

With at best 20 points of Armour on Torso locations (im speaking Commando here), a good hit from an AC/20 or Gauss will impair you. Surely you dont have to worry about stafing potion of a laser beam, a few times, but take too much of them, and your day gets ruined too.

And really of you want to live it IS ALREADY Hit & Run. Try to stand & slug it out means you ARE dead. Speed is your only defence... but on the other hand, playing one is really fun, cause you have to work with this.

[Ruutah]

torgian, on 05 May 2013 - 07:59 PM, said:

On a personal note, I find that blasting lights is, well, quite frankly, too hard to do. I don't mean it's hard to hit them, I just feel like they're unsatisfying because of the following reason:

To me, lights should be more fragile than they are. I should be able to plant a couple of solid laser hits and hurt him bad, or fire an ac20 through a torso and move on. Instead, we get lights that can move through the combat lines with relative impunity, take a few hits, and move on. They should be fragile enough so that a few hits can disable them; this would make light mech pilots be smarter than the average bear... stick to hit and run tactics, hunt other lights, scout, or base tag.

Granted, this wouldn't satisfy the general player base, and the tears would flow if the above opinion was implemented, but that's just how I feel. In any game I do fight off the lights because I know how dangerous they can be if left to their own devices, but unless I have two or three friendlies teaming up against one light, I don't go chasing after them.

Meh, I'm probably not making any sense lol. Move on...

LOL having only been playing about 3 weeks total time, I can say I enjoy lights way more than the Assaults that get all the "glory" and OMG GOTTA HAVE ONE! When team mates are spectating on you due to you being the last one left standing and you're getting comments like that "that thing is a beast" when you're driving an 2D commando, and routinely winning matches by being the last guy, whether by cap or kill. You can take the ECM is overpowered crap and shove it out the window, even with the upcoming fix there are still going to be those who cry about it. It saves you from being targeted at range, and keeps LRM's off your back. LOS still allows you to be targeted, TAG will still allow streaks to lock. You only live long as a light pilot by never stopping near an opponent, NEVER let yourself shut down, and being smart enough to use terrain and map obstacles to your advantage. Hit and run is the name of the game, if you catch a lone assault out by themselves they're dog meat unless they get a lucky shot and leg you. Run a coordinated group of lights together and you wreck havok among your opponents. 3 lights concentrating on a caught out assault or heavy and it will go down in 15-20 seconds. If they won't separate by themselves, pick away at one till he breaks and chases you, as it's been said, if you can get 2,3,4 to chase you, all the better, just keep moving. And yeah, I think somethings wrong if I don't have that critical damage warning going off over and over again. I find I pilot much better after taking a swat from something larger, reminds me I'm in a 25 ton crapcan that likes to dance around the kegs with pretty light shows.


Edit: oh and to all you heavy and assault pilots that like to ignore us and let us stand behind you blasting away, THANKS!!!!!!

Edited by Ruutah, 07 May 2013 - 10:23 AM.

[torgian]

Perhaps, but I played lights almost exclusively for about three months (and they were even worse in the bad netcode days).

Yes, I agree that many players do run around and use speed as a defense, but I still find them to be too strong, as far as armor is concerned. But that can't be avoided, so it is what it is.

[StalaggtIKE]

I've seen it go both ways:

• A whole team going chasing after a lone Spider leaving their two Atlai on the front line to succumb to superior numbers.
  
• A Jenner allowed to just lay into a Stalker's back while his (the Stalker pilot) allies just completely ignore the obvious need for assistance.

[Sepertar]

Ruutah, on 07 May 2013 - 10:18 AM, said:

LOL having only been playing about 3 weeks total time, I can say I enjoy lights way more than the Assaults that get all the "glory" and OMG GOTTA HAVE ONE! When team mates are spectating on you due to you being the last one left standing and you're getting comments like that "that thing is a beast" when you're driving an 2D commando, and routinely winning matches by being the last guy, whether by cap or kill. You can take the ECM is overpowered crap and shove it out the window, even with the upcoming fix there are still going to be those who cry about it. It saves you from being targeted at range, and keeps LRM's off your back. LOS still allows you to be targeted, TAG will still allow streaks to lock. You only live long as a light pilot by never stopping near an opponent, NEVER let yourself shut down, and being smart enough to use terrain and map obstacles to your advantage. Hit and run is the name of the game, if you catch a lone assault out by themselves they're dog meat unless they get a lucky shot and leg you. Run a coordinated group of lights together and you wreck havok among your opponents. 3 lights concentrating on a caught out assault or heavy and it will go down in 15-20 seconds. If they won't separate by themselves, pick away at one till he breaks and chases you, as it's been said, if you can get 2,3,4 to chase you, all the better, just keep moving. And yeah, I think somethings wrong if I don't have that critical damage warning going off over and over again. I find I pilot much better after taking a swat from something larger, reminds me I'm in a 25 ton crapcan that likes to dance around the kegs with pretty light shows.


Edit: oh and to all you heavy and assault pilots that like to ignore us and let us stand behind you blasting away, THANKS!!!!!!

I took out a cataphract in my spider, and he barely turned around! True on the edit there!!!

Edited by Sepertar, 08 May 2013 - 04:52 AM.

[Mechteric]

I think if you're the only target in front of the enemy they'll be obliged to shoot you, but if its a choice between shooting at you or the mech 2-3 times your weight nearby they will likely go for it first because its a bigger threat and its easier to hit

[Kommisar]

I will post my recent experience in Ravens.

They will shoot a Raven first. I've been staying in close with my Assault lancemates, supporting and screening them and if we get ambushed, I'm always the first casualty. Just last night, running a 4 man with two Misery Stalkers and a Highlander, we got flanked on Alpine by a 6 PPC Stalker that came up over a ridge on us. His first shot was right into me. And he had to shoot through a narrow gap between the two Stalkers to do it. Yea, he could have missed... but given that he killed me in one shot I'm guessing he placed that blow.

Same happens any time I'm out with a Raven.

With a Spider, it is very different. I am relegated to a far lower priority. Which is nuts, really, as my Spider is FAR more dangerous to a larger mech in a fight and a much nastier threat in capping a win.

[TruePoindexter]

Kommisar, on 10 May 2013 - 07:58 AM, said:

I will post my recent experience in Ravens.

They will shoot a Raven first. I've been staying in close with my Assault lancemates, supporting and screening them and if we get ambushed, I'm always the first casualty. Just last night, running a 4 man with two Misery Stalkers and a Highlander, we got flanked on Alpine by a 6 PPC Stalker that came up over a ridge on us. His first shot was right into me. And he had to shoot through a narrow gap between the two Stalkers to do it. Yea, he could have missed... but given that he killed me in one shot I'm guessing he placed that blow.

Same happens any time I'm out with a Raven.

With a Spider, it is very different. I am relegated to a far lower priority. Which is nuts, really, as my Spider is FAR more dangerous to a larger mech in a fight and a much nastier threat in capping a win.

Yeah people are programed to kill Ravens on sight now. Spiders do tend to get ignored for some reason.

[Doelloos Verdwaald]

I actually find that I'm targeted a lot even when there are other targets. Maybe they see a quick kill before they go down or maybe I'm finally getting up to annoying level with my aim

[Ruutah]

I love running my commando, I love it even more when I can convince that enemy atlas to quit brawling with a highlander teammate to try and draw a bead on my circling weaving buzzing little PITA. I hit 65k xp beyond master today in it. I routinely can get 2-3 enemy machines chasing me, which keeps them off the rest of my team.

An example of my typical assault match; a quick squirt out to a flank to get an idea on what the enemy is doing, followed by spotting and calling for any LRMs on the idiots that like to tramp through the open. Once the fighting starts, I'm looking for one of two things, either anyone hanging back trying to rain LRMs, or play a support role with limited close range firepower, or for an enemy light to try and push through or harass our line. If an enemy light makes themselves known, its my job to keep them busy, or take em out. 3L's are about the only things I have a problem with by myself. Occasionally, a good spider or jenner pilot shows up and makes it a worthwhile duel, or scrap.(I've yelled at teammates on TS to stay out of my light duels, unless the other team decides to jump in on it, then they're fair game) Usually after a circle or two they go running for their teams line, which I happily chase them to, and through, the whole time popping streaks at them, and getting zaps in with my laser on whomever I can get as we go by.9 out of 10 times they decide to try and bail and lose me by running off after running through their line. Sometimes, I've got to find a quick exit, and get back to my line waiting for them to make themselves seen away from their big stompy buddies, and the chase resumes. The whole time I'm watching our backs, and putting pot shots in wherever I can, and jamming ecm wherever I can. Pugs usually net me 5-900 xp on a win, 4-650ish in a TS group, due to calling and concentrating fire generally its about over by the time I deal with any lights, and base cap attempts. 80-140k in cbills, not to shabby for a light pilot that's literally been playing for 15 days.

Conquest rounds usually go something like this; quick jump to a cap point, and then you have to feel it out. In a premade group, I usually jump back to my team, depending on what I'm being fed for Intel, I might make a run for the next cap, or try to support any teammates nearby. If you see an opportunity for a cap, jump on it. Even if you just bring it down to neutral, that's points the other team is not getting.

[Jay Z]

In general, you want to eliminate your targets on a firepower/health ratio. In other words, you want to kill the enemies that can do a lot of damage but are easy to kill as this is how to quickly remove attacking potential from the enemy team.

For example, an 2xAC20 Jager has lots of firepower but will be running an XL so it will be targeted down first. Followed by other heavies and then assaults/mediums.

Lights, don't have much firepower (outside the Jenner which has a huge CT) so they are focused later, unless they are scouting and are the first thing the enemy can point guns at. Lights are also very hard to hit due to their speed and even now, some shots that hit don't register (confirmed that PPCs produce the energy splash animation on a spider without registering damage) and hence deter pilots form wasting heat/ammo that can be better spent on a slower, easier to hit target.

For reference, the Jenner is my favourite mech of all time with the Stalker a close second. A good light pilot will try not to be noticed and just be a literal pain in the backside. A good assault will be close their team and will not be afraid to use team chat to ask for a back scratch if they can't shake it off.

[Kiiyor]

I'm seeing a bit of the opposite. I hunt lights at the moment. With HSR and a bit of patience they are reasonably easy kills, although results can vary wildly on the map and pilot.

IMHO, the biggest threats at the moment are MLAS Jenners. They're pretty awesome.

If a light is brawling or running predictably in the open, it's meat.

[Crock]

Only been around about a week now and decided learning to play in a light would help to boost my skills, but its pretty rare for me to get into a game where my Spider gets ignored in favor of any other mech and rarer still that my team take advantage of either a distraction my actions cause to the enemy or give any assistance to throw off my pursuers even if I run straight through the main group.

Edited by Crock, 11 May 2013 - 12:45 AM.

[BoPop]

Forty Eight, on 05 May 2013 - 07:52 PM, said:

people generally don't pay attention to me in a Jenner hauling ***.
So why does no one ever attempt to blast them?

Aye, the jenners (and all the lights) are fast moving, tiny targets and if you have an 'ammo based' mech, the last thing you want to waste ammo on is something you probably wont hit whether it be due to latency, distance or size of target, or the fact that you aren't a good shot.

furthermore that jenner doesn't pose quiet the immediate threat that say ERPPC stalker boats, JJing Highlanders, Atlas and Jagermechs do. These are mechs that can kill you in one shot, from great range OR close up. ONE SHOT. I don't think there's many light mechs that can do that, save for an extremely lucky cockpit alpha strike.(pretty rare)

even with energy weapons, if you aren't sure you're going to jack that light up, you're heating yourself up for no real reason. I like to keep my "3" button for ONE medium laser or, my longest range most heat efficient weapon, so I can send tracer fire at them and hopefully do a little damage. with one medium laser you can keep most lights off ya as long as your a good enough shot to keep grazing them.

most people like to 'swat' at light mechs, like flies, even though they are more like hornets. generally though, i'd say most people try to take shots at their legs just to keep them scared off, otherwise, there are much larger and slower moving targets to focus on,(not to say that you should ignore lights, not at all) Sure the heavies and assaults are harder to take down, but they also stand a greater chance of taking you and your team down as well.

the only reason you've probably seen a light get 3-5 kills and win the game is because he was prancing around 'stinging' enemies thereby causing (noob)enemies to turn their attention on him. Then all the lights allied heavies and assaults dealt the real damage in just enough time for the enemies to turn back around and basically have a Mexican standoff, and the jenner gets to go around like a scavenger finishing off what's left. I've done this several times myself, and especially in a raven 3L.

don't let lights drag you into what one player called "the circle jerk of doom" but at the same time, let them know you see them, and can hit them, and they better stay the F away. hehe

[Shiro Matsumoto]

I fondly remember a cloud of 5 Lights, 3 Jenners, a Commando and my Spider mopping up an enemy formation... pained comment after Defeat; "They had so much lights...."

Rule No1.. do not run in a straight line towards any Medium or heavier enemy.