143 replies to this topic

[Shae Starfyre]

My only issue is the trajectory.

It appears that they fly higher and drop down more on top of you. This causes a lot of before strategic cover locations to be obsolete.

This has reduced the areas to seek cover while advancing.

The speed is sort of an issue, but if the trajectory is reduced by 15%-20%, then play style will adjust to speed.

However, this is not taking into consideration organized team play, 4 man drops, and not having certain weapon/module/equipment like ECM/LRM added to Match Making for the Pug experience.

Note: the post above me is a good point tho; didn't read it until after posting.

Edited by Aphoticus, 22 May 2013 - 04:06 AM.

[William Knight]

PGI are aware they derped. They are working on it.

http://mwomercs.com/...93#entry2369593

Note: I didn't read Deeztar's post either.

Edited by William Knight, 22 May 2013 - 06:17 AM.

[Nightcrept]

Lrm's are still almost useless unless your opponent is a moron.

The only exception to this is when boated in quantities about 2xlrm 40's.
So the problem is boating. If you run into small quantities of lrms are they powerful? NO. No more then 1 ppc was.
We need to address the boating.

I am making a post in suggestions to address that if I can find that forum again.

[Teralitha]

Such a minor change to LRM's... and now ppl cant stand them. I explained to the devs a few times that they need to use the MW4 LRM system which IS SKILL BASED.

This system is impossible to balance.

But I will also say that you have to be pretty terrible at the game if you cant outplay an LRM boat

Edited by Teralitha, 22 May 2013 - 07:11 AM.

[Tarrasque]

Teralitha, on 22 May 2013 - 07:10 AM, said:

But I will also say that you have to be pretty terrible at the game if you cant outplay an LRM boat

Agreed, but what about a lance of LRM boats? Or more?

I'm glad the poptarts are getting their comeuppance, but this is dumb. Now I have to wait until they patch something else to play, again.

[Nightcrept]

Even a lance of lrm boats are fairly easy to get around.

Much easier in many ways then the ppc snipers where.

[Dirus Nigh]

White Bear 84, on 22 May 2013 - 02:53 AM, said:

Killed in my ecm raven by two volleys or LRM 10, even in closed beta the LRM issue did not compare. And this for reference is very bad (in case you cant see, pretty much a 90 degree change..)

Oh going up, going up, going up, DOWN!!!

90 degree dive? That looks a lot like a 45 to me dude.

[Tarrasque]

Nightcrept, on 22 May 2013 - 07:24 AM, said:

Even a lance of lrm boats are fairly easy to get around.

Much easier in many ways then the ppc snipers where.

If you say so, I'd agree, if it werent for lights with UAV's equipped. Really, with the improvements to NARC and TAG, its very easy for a light to get behind your group, stand there largely undetected, and spot for a handful of LRM boats, who you cant rush because they'd take you down before you got there.

It certainly isnt nearly as bad as LRMpocalypse, and they ARE fixing it, but to say that this is fine is absurd.

[Aegic]

Real life missiles are capable of far more incredible feats as well as causing much more damage. I think that we should compare real missiles to MWO missiles as little as possible.

[Osis]

Dirus Nigh, on 22 May 2013 - 07:28 AM, said:

90 degree dive? That looks a lot like a 45 to me dude.

If those are his missiles, then they must have "Vector Thrust" rocket motors to hit the target in question. Messed up big time again...

[Dirus Nigh]

Osis, on 22 May 2013 - 08:03 AM, said:

If those are his missiles, then they must have "Vector Thrust" rocket motors to hit the target in question. Messed up big time again...

Those are not his missiles. As you can clearly see from the pic the missiles are coming in from the players right. Most likely from the player in F4 if not G4 or 3. Also the player is clearly running a raven 3L with a pair of streaks.

[Josef Koba]

Here's my two cents (for what it's worth - less than two cents?).

I've had a Cat C4 sitting in my hanger for a couple of months now because, well, LRMs weren't that good and/or I wasn't very good at using them. I was bummed about it because I used LRMs a lot on table top. Eventually I stopped seeing LRMs deployed at all. When the patch came out I was stoked because I thought maybe my C4 would be viable again. I was pleased that the damage was increased slightly, and was curious as to the "new flight path," so I fired up a training ground and laid to waste some dummy mechs. I enjoyed the flight path because I liked the idea of plunging fire with missiles.

I thought I was ready for the big show. My results were sub-optimal. While I was doing more damage before dying than I had with the C4 previously, I was still not getting any kills. So the increase in damage was, to me, noticeable. However, I probably need more practice because I still am terrible at using the LRMs. In essence, I've not noticed any dramatic increase in my personal use of them. This, again, could simply be my inability to effectively use LRM tactics, as others have noted a big increase in LRM efficacy.

On the flip side, I haven't experienced that many more deaths from LRMs in an admittedly small sample size (I think I did six or eight matches last night), despite seeing vastly more LRMs deployed. So I can't speak to the OP nature of LRMs at the moment. I'm not saying it's not true; it seems that many are having some issues. I think that these issues are valid even if I haven't experienced them.

I have no real issues with the speed or trajectory of the new missiles. Speed has always been a problem with my use of them. Perhaps the simplest solution is to lower the damage back to 0.7? I don't know. I'm not a master at this game by any means nor am I as familiar with the inner workings as some of my peers. In the end, I would like to see LRMs as a viable weapon system, but no so viable that they rule the battle space. As it stands (or stood), most everything was pretty balanced from my perspective. As annoying as the poptarts were, I was able to nullify that tactic effectively. Six PPC Stalkers are troublesome, but use some cover and concealment and get in their rear and take care of 'em. I've no problem trying to figure out effective tactics to counter new systems and their implementation, and frankly, I'm looking forward to the challenge of combating massive LRM boats. Should be fun!

[Nightcrept]

Tarrasque, on 22 May 2013 - 07:32 AM, said:

If you say so, I'd agree, if it werent for lights with UAV's equipped. Really, with the improvements to NARC and TAG, its very easy for a light to get behind your group, stand there largely undetected, and spot for a handful of LRM boats, who you cant rush because they'd take you down before you got there.

It certainly isnt nearly as bad as LRMpocalypse, and they ARE fixing it, but to say that this is fine is absurd.

Not that hard. Most of the players using lrms right now are just jumping at the opportunity to use something new. But they have no clue how to properly use them.

I played a game last night against a team of almost all lrm boats. We had a few but not nearly as many. So we all got behing cover and sniped at them randomly to get them to fire while our lights drew out their lights.

Then we just waited for them to run low on ammo. It ended in a 8-2 slaughter of their team. And we didn't even have a ecm mech.

Remember lrms have horrendous damage to ton ratios. If you're patient then they will quickly run out of enough ammo to kill your team.

[Josef Koba]

Here's my two cents (for what it's worth - less than two cents?).

I've had a Cat C4 sitting in my hanger for a couple of months now because, well, LRMs weren't that good and/or I wasn't very good at using them. I was bummed about it because I used LRMs a lot on table top. Eventually I stopped seeing LRMs deployed at all. When the patch came out I was stoked because I thought maybe my C4 would be viable again. I was pleased that the damage was increased slightly, and was curious as to the "new flight path," so I fired up a training ground and laid to waste some dummy mechs. I enjoyed the flight path because I liked the idea of plunging fire with missiles.

I thought I was ready for the big show. My results were sub-optimal. While I was doing more damage before dying than I had with the C4 previously, I was still not getting any kills. So the increase in damage was, to me, noticeable. However, I probably need more practice because I still am terrible at using the LRMs. In essence, I've not noticed any dramatic increase in my personal use of them. This, again, could simply be my inability to effectively use LRM tactics, as others have noted a big increase in LRM efficacy.

On the flip side, I haven't experienced that many more deaths from LRMs in an admittedly small sample size (I think I did six or eight matches last night), despite seeing vastly more LRMs deployed. So I can't speak to the OP nature of LRMs at the moment. I'm not saying it's not true; it seems that many are having some issues. I think that these issues are valid even if I haven't experienced them.

I have no real issues with the speed or trajectory of the new missiles. Speed has always been a problem with my use of them. Perhaps the simplest solution is to lower the damage back to 0.7? I don't know. I'm not a master at this game by any means nor am I as familiar with the inner workings as some of my peers. In the end, I would like to see LRMs as a viable weapon system, but no so viable that they rule the battle space. As it stands (or stood), most everything was pretty balanced from my perspective. As annoying as the poptarts were, I was able to nullify that tactic effectively. Six PPC Stalkers are troublesome, but use some cover and concealment and get in their rear and take care of 'em. I've no problem trying to figure out effective tactics to counter new systems and their implementation, and frankly, I'm looking forward to the challenge of combating massive LRM boats. Should be fun!

[StillEvil]

I usually don't complain much but this is too much. With such a speed and angle of LRMs I can hardly dodge missles or hide in my 152km/h jenner. If I manage to catch a volley it's in most cases a death sentence for me since no armor left so anyone can shoot me down. I'm feeling like throwing jenner away, it seems useless now. That's not the way for the balance.

[Chimperator]

The damage increase isnt the Porblem, the speed while flight isnt it too...
But this flightpath is just a joke, to get the PPC-Monster and Jumpsniper getting in control or balance u put a third and much more overpowered option into this game....
With the PCC-snipers and jumpsnipers the game was playable but with that new flight path its unplayable....
U cant hide somewhere. shooting behind hills and buldings no problem... u cant get a target behind there no problem too.. the scouts narc and tag all for u, best variant Raven 3l - ECM + LRM10 + LRM5 + 2 medium lasers +tag + 3tons LRM AMMO and a XL255 did it very well.
this cannot be serious you. the solution for a good balance is so simple and before the patch u were so near to a good balance. then such a thing comes...

Edit: btw before patch it wasnt a problem to do more then 600 dmg per game with an LRM boat!

Edited by xraison, 22 May 2013 - 01:43 PM.

[TwK]

The damage increase isnt the Porblem, the speed while flight isnt it too
But this flightpath is just a joke, to get the PPC-Monster and Jumpsniper getting in control or balance u put a third and much more overpowered option into this game.

Edited by TwK, 22 May 2013 - 01:51 PM.

[Socom EBDA]

The thing is to find balance. The increase in damage and speed are not the problem. Its the firing arc. You cant really hide from the missiles any more. Not everyone wants to run an LRM boat in this game, as well as not everyone wants to run a ppc boat as well. Before this patch I still hade to hide from missiles because the more hits you take the more likely you will die (obvious). But I agree that they were not much of a fearful weapon. The thing is why have all the different weapons and styles of mechs when you can only use a few to avoid getting blasted my LRMs in seconds. I nor other players had a hard time getting hits with LRMs with the old flight path. Increasing the speed and damage definitely makes for more of a consequence if you screw up and stick yourself out there. But you should be able to move and recover. Then come up with a new plan to fight it out. No weapon that locks on should be the most powerful weapon in the game. Yes there is some skill involved in using them but much less that something you have to aim. PPCs and Gauss are not just point and shoot. Mechs that are behind cover cant be hit as well as moving mechs are harder to hit than ones standing still. The only real problem I have with the LRMs is the flight path.

[xXBagheeraXx]

Garrath, on 21 May 2013 - 12:23 PM, said:

You're way oversimplifying. It's more than 'lock on' to run missiles. Just like a fail poptarter, a bad missile boat will hide behind a hill and well...suck. The good ones position well, maintain LOS, maintain tag marking, and a variety of other things, which actually require skill, all the while making themselves vulnerable. Those who play well are rewarded, just like any other skilled player. And there are a LOT of bad ones.

THIS.

Even before the lrm patch, i could handle myself very nicely with my lrm catapults. I like to fire while im constatly on the move, with only a little bit of my mech showing at the top of ridgelines. My lrm catapults all go about 65+kph, which is much faster than most ddcs and poptart highlanders ive seen....Ive had plenty of kills where atlases rush up with ac20's and ppcs blazing away and missing, trying to min-range my missiles, while I kindly walked away from them filling thier faces with artemis lrms....there is a difference between missile boating, and fire support, and i rather enjoy my catapults.

[Chimperator]

Thats what i mean the LRMs wasnt bad before the patch.
With my Awesome LRMboat i dominate often the battlefield all u need is a team who know a bit what they doin
just moving to get the targets in direct sight to kill them with u artemis worked pretty good before the patch....
Thats why im writing dmg and speed increase was ok for not so skilled players to make lrm more intressting.
But for the new flightpath u dont need high skill or low skill... u need NO-skill.