38 replies to this topic

[zorak ramone]

So I read the new hotfix notes, and splash damage is getting reduced ... again.
http://mwomercs.com/...t-fix-24052013/

Just remove freaking splash damage already!

There is no reason for splash damage to be in the game. None at all.

If the goal of splash damage is to spread missile damage out, then it is not only unneeded, but it also fails miserably at its goal. It is unneeded because the flight mechanics of missiles already spread out their hit locations, and it fails miserably because the splash effect tends to ensure that the CT is always hit by every missile (unless the missiles hit the arms ... on a large mech).

If the goal of splash damage is to give missiles a bonus, then I ask, why do they need a bonus? What is the concept behind missiles? I thought that the whole concept behind missiles is that they gained very high damage potential (higher than any other weapons in the game) with the trade off that they tended to spread damage. This can be achieved completely without splash damage: just increase missile damage and their flight path takes care of the damage spreading part. If I'm wrong about the concept behind missiles, then what exactly is their place in the grand scheme of weaponry?

Splash damage was the ONE AND ONLY reason missile damage was bugged. It is probably THE REASON why LRMs seem to home in on the CT (they aren't, but splash ensures that almost every missile hits the CT).

It is pointless to keep tweaking missile damage and missile flight path when the one bugged mechanic of the weapon remains.

[Stoicblitzer]

It seems like every time there is a problem with missiles in this game, it has something to do with splash damage. I ******* hate splash damage now. Get rid of it or fix it fast. Sick of hearing about it.

[ICEFANG13]

Of course it should be removed. SSRMs all hitting CT, LRMs all hitting CT, SRMs spreading all the weak damage all over. Make the missile stronger, but remove splash, who wants splash, who wants to spread damage all over?

[JudgeDeathCZ]

I agree.Give them dmg about 1,6 like it was be4 and remove splash.

[Livewyr]

Splash is what makes them a support weapon, for weakening the general armor on an opponent, instead of an indirect LBX 5,10,15,20...

If I had my way, missiles would do about 1.5 per missile, spread out over a splash area. (Rather than .9 at the center and then various rings of splash, since that benefits having large areas by accepting fewer instances of damage.)

[Joseph Mallan]

I was testing an LRM10 on a Centurion on the testing grounds. I fired salvo after salvo into an Awesome. My Missiles did no hunt the CT, they spread out differently and actually hit multiple sections. Now I was not able to test Spotted Targets bu they seem to not be CT hunting.

[Monky]

Splash would work if mechs had a single hitbox.

The only thing that could be a viable rework is damage transfer from section hit with a missile. volumetric based splash (the current model) will only continue screwing up missile damage.

In my opinion - ditch it altogether, the missiles hit where they hit.

[Kitane]

Properly working splash damage should be more powerful against small mechs, because every explosion will affect more components. A high concentration of component hitboxes would work against them, and it would balance out their natural ability to spread damage caused by lasers and smaller/medium ACs.

[Stoicblitzer]

Joseph Mallan, on 24 May 2013 - 08:06 AM, said:

I was testing an LRM10 on a Centurion on the testing grounds. I fired salvo after salvo into an Awesome. My Missiles did no hunt the CT, they spread out differently and actually hit multiple sections. Now I was not able to test Spotted Targets bu they seem to not be CT hunting.

Artemis + TAG? Also testing grounds is horrible.

[hammerreborn]

And this couldn't have been posted in the thread that you clearly noticed because you linked to it?

Everyone needs to be a special little snowflake I guess.

[Joseph Mallan]

No enhancements... Meh, your opinion, I find it helpful.

[MaddMaxx]

Joseph Mallan, on 24 May 2013 - 08:06 AM, said:

I was testing an LRM10 on a Centurion on the testing grounds. I fired salvo after salvo into an Awesome. My Missiles did no hunt the CT, they spread out differently and actually hit multiple sections. Now I was not able to test Spotted Targets bu they seem to not be CT hunting.

That was with direct LoS right? My question on the whole CT homing issue is a indirect LoS issue as I see it.

If my TC has only a RED box with which to target a distant unseen enemy, I simply assume the TC will select the center as its target and fire accordingly. Indirect fire maintained and the missiles arrive at the center of that same target box.

How is the TC supposed to select individual Mech components, unless it can actually "see" the target components? It being the pilot who "sees" and selects the left side of the Red target box, they go left side + spread + splash etc etc

Random selection, somewhere inside that RED Box would be... random and then add spread... ouchers.

Edited by MaddMaxx, 24 May 2013 - 08:43 AM.

[zorak ramone]

Livewyr, on 24 May 2013 - 08:02 AM, said:

Splash is what makes them a support weapon, for weakening the general armor on an opponent, instead of an indirect LBX 5,10,15,20...

If I had my way, missiles would do about 1.5 per missile, spread out over a splash area. (Rather than .9 at the center and then various rings of splash, since that benefits having large areas by accepting fewer instances of damage.)

Splash is unnecessary for making them support weapons. The weapon mechanics (multiple missiles/flight pattern) could spread damage on their own without splash. In fact, the splash actually increases the probability that you hit CT with at least some damage with every missile.

That said, if you were going to do splash correctly, you'd have to first calculate how many panels the splash hits, then divide damage equally between the panels. I.e. if LRMs do 1.5 damage each, a LRM hits RT, and the splash hits CT and RA as well, then the CT, RT, and RA would each take 0.5 damage. If the LRM instead hit RA, and splash hit RT, then the RA and RT would take 0.75 damage each. You'd still have the problem of the CT tending to take damage frequently because its the most likely location to be hit by splash and/or a missile.

[El Bandito]

I personally have no complaints against missiles.

Buff SRMs BTW.

[MustrumRidcully]

Remove splash damage completely, buff damage of missiles.

[Sheraf]

zorak ramone, on 24 May 2013 - 07:46 AM, said:

So I read the new hotfix notes, and splash damage is getting reduced ... again.
http://mwomercs.com/...t-fix-24052013/

Just remove freaking splash damage already!

There is no reason for splash damage to be in the game. None at all.

If the goal of splash damage is to spread missile damage out, then it is not only unneeded, but it also fails miserably at its goal. It is unneeded because the flight mechanics of missiles already spread out their hit locations, and it fails miserably because the splash effect tends to ensure that the CT is always hit by every missile (unless the missiles hit the arms ... on a large mech).

If the goal of splash damage is to give missiles a bonus, then I ask, why do they need a bonus? What is the concept behind missiles? I thought that the whole concept behind missiles is that they gained very high damage potential (higher than any other weapons in the game) with the trade off that they tended to spread damage. This can be achieved completely without splash damage: just increase missile damage and their flight path takes care of the damage spreading part. If I'm wrong about the concept behind missiles, then what exactly is their place in the grand scheme of weaponry?

Splash damage was the ONE AND ONLY reason missile damage was bugged. It is probably THE REASON why LRMs seem to home in on the CT (they aren't, but splash ensures that almost every missile hits the CT).

It is pointless to keep tweaking missile damage and missile flight path when the one bugged mechanic of the weapon remains.

Try cover:)

[zorak ramone]

El Bandito, on 24 May 2013 - 12:30 PM, said:

I personally have no complaints against missiles.

Buff SRMs BTW.

SRMs totally need to have their damage buffed. However, if we don't eliminate splash, they'll be doing 15 damage per missile again to lights.

Buff SRM damage to 2.5 per missile (just like it was), but eliminate splash damage. Max SRM damage is now 15 damage (per cluster!) against any target.

MustrumRidcully, on 24 May 2013 - 12:32 PM, said:

Remove splash damage completely, buff damage of missiles.

Great minds think alike.

Sheraf, on 24 May 2013 - 12:32 PM, said:

Try cover:)

This is a dumb reply. Did you read the post?

I'm asking for the one buggy mechanic in missiles (splash) to be removed. This is a not "QQ LRMs killed me neeeerrrrfff!" thread. In fact, I'd like to see LRMs and SRMs have their damage boosted to their pre-nerf levels.

Edited by zorak ramone, 24 May 2013 - 01:42 PM.

[Budor]

Remove it until you can make sure it doesnt affect the different chassi in different ways please. Its a broken mechanic.
http://mwomercs.com/...ted-2013-03-15/

Edited by Budor, 24 May 2013 - 12:37 PM.

[TOGSolid]

Joseph Mallan, on 24 May 2013 - 08:06 AM, said:

I was testing an LRM10 on a Centurion on the testing grounds. I fired salvo after salvo into an Awesome. My Missiles did no hunt the CT, they spread out differently and actually hit multiple sections. Now I was not able to test Spotted Targets bu they seem to not be CT hunting.

You're blatantly lying because I just did that with an LRM20 and no TAG or Artemis and I center punched everything I shot at.

Splash damage is a proven to be broken mechanic that adds nothing to the game except headaches and problems. It needs to be removed.

Edited by TOGSolid, 24 May 2013 - 12:43 PM.

[Renthrak]

We can have our cake and eat it too. LRMs can spread damage over the 'Mech without the existing splash damage system:

http://mwomercs.com/...eeking-to-lrms/