46 replies to this topic

[Odins Fist]

MuKen, on 23 May 2013 - 02:17 PM, said:

Community: ECM needs a counter.

PGI: Nah, ECM is about where we want it.

100s of threads about ECM later, ECM now has a counter.

Seems like we have an impact to me.

ECM was never even a factor... So I couldn't see his triangle, didn't matter, I still fired...

I understand that there is a portion of the player base that complains a lot, but I think you're going to see more as the development of MWO drags on, and on, and on, and on, and on, until (full) game release, and then they will be sick of waiting even more because of the whole "Clan Tech planned for 6 months after release" thing...

Most people understand the whole "we need time to develop it" thing, but the real reality is that players will only wait so long.
Forever is not an option, neither is 18 more months, just watch..

[Cferre]

HarmAssassin, on 23 May 2013 - 01:53 PM, said:

It is as if they are trying to make this game optimized for 6 year olds to play.

This.

Bryan Ekman, on 21 March 2013 - 03:38 PM, said:

Reduces friction for non-MechWarrior players, non-core players, and expands the MWO market to a broader audience. It helps to make the game more accessible and less intimidating.

It's from the 3Rd person topic, but can be applied here just as well.

Edited by Cferre, 23 May 2013 - 02:31 PM.

[Splitpin]

Gee I can't even imagine how OP a rear view mirror would be, but the crying would be very predictable.

[Cferre]

Splitpin, on 23 May 2013 - 02:31 PM, said:

Gee I can't even imagine how OP a rear view mirror would be, but the crying would be very predictable.

No, a rear view camera means that you have to look further than you own radar... just like you normally would do....
when you have to pay attention of what happens in front of you...lol.

Edited by Cferre, 23 May 2013 - 02:41 PM.

[LethalMezzle]

Cferre, on 23 May 2013 - 02:28 PM, said:

Bryan Ekman, on 21 March 2013 - 03:38 PM, said:

Reduces friction for non-MechWarrior players, non-core players, and expands the MWO market to a broader audience. It helps to make the game more accessible and less intimidating.

It's from the 3Rd person topic, but can be applied here just as well.

I don't think this really applies here. A module for 7,500 GXP is never going to be used by a newbie or free-to-play player. They will not have the patience to grind long enough to earn it - only way I unlocked it was by using the convert Mech XP function but that requires you to use MC.

If that is the case though, it's an incredibly dumb idea. MWO could be made a lot more accessible by 1) adding a good in-game tutorial, 2) making the Trial Mech builds actually competitive and 3) not giving all the awesome tech (DHS, ES, XL Engines on certain chassis) to people who have already sunk enough time in the game to pay for all the goodies.

[Cferre]

LethalMezzle, on 23 May 2013 - 02:43 PM, said:

I don't think this really applies here. A module for 7,500 GXP is never going to be used by a newbie or free-to-play player. They will not have the patience to grind long enough to earn it - only way I unlocked it was by using the convert Mech XP function but that requires you to use MC.

Dude, I have never ever used MC to unlock a module, and yet I have bought most of them.
You assume too much.

Edited by Cferre, 23 May 2013 - 02:58 PM.

[Sheraf]

I

MuKen, on 23 May 2013 - 12:53 PM, said:

Good game mechanics are ones that enhance the benefit you get from outplaying your opponents, not mechanics that lessen the advantage they get from outplaying you. We should not have a sensor that allows you to find an opponent who has successfully outmaneuvered and snuck behind you. Getting behind your opponent means somehow or another, you have outplayed them, the less benefit you get from doing so, the less this is a skill-based game.

This is far and away the best module, so everyone will carry it. So now it is generally simply not as good to get behind opponents in this game. That reduces the tactical level of the game as a whole.

If you engage the enemies as individual then seismic sensor matter, if it is map level strategy of the team, knowing who coming or not, it is already checkmate

[William Radick]

Thundercles, on 23 May 2013 - 02:00 PM, said:

Regardless of how it affects gameplay long-term, you'll be glad you have it when the graboids swing by.

^
Lol

[WVAnonymous]

I did unlock a big batch of GXP two sales ago, and then sat on them for months because the Air Strike/ Artillery unlocks didn't seem worth the effort.

I will likely buy seismic, but it's been so long since I used GXP that I'm still not dipping into the GXP I paid for.

But the posters claiming it's OP are what is encouraging me to get it.

[El Bandito]

MuKen, on 23 May 2013 - 12:53 PM, said:

Good game mechanics are ones that enhance the benefit you get from outplaying your opponents, not mechanics that lessen the advantage they get from outplaying you. We should not have a sensor that allows you to find an opponent who has successfully outmaneuvered and snuck behind you. Getting behind your opponent means somehow or another, you have outplayed them, the less benefit you get from doing so, the less this is a skill-based game. This is far and away the best module, so everyone will carry it. So now it is generally simply not as good to get behind opponents in this game. That reduces the tactical level of the game as a whole.

I have to agree with this, since I love to ninja behind enemy's back.

[Fate 6]

WVAnonymous, on 23 May 2013 - 01:52 PM, said:

Sure, but all those modules are still hypothetical. The actual modules deployed such as target decay, target info, sensor range, coolant et al are to make it easier to hit targets, find weak points, find enemies, and so on, reducing required skills to get the same level of performance as a more skilled player who may not have or need the module.

Those modules still reward you for playing well, not hurt the opponent for playing well. If a person is in cover, target decay, target info, sensor range, and coolant all do nothing. If you can target a person in the open and you have those modules then they give you an added benefit for your good positioning (or they punish the enemy for their bad positioning). Either way you want to see it, they don't punish a player for playing well like the seismic sensor does. If I run my CN9-A as the beefy assassin that I love to be, I am now rewarded less if I run around and flank a mech.

Edited by Fate 6, 23 May 2013 - 05:48 PM.

[Fate 6]

Splitpin, on 23 May 2013 - 02:31 PM, said:

Gee I can't even imagine how OP a rear view mirror would be, but the crying would be very predictable.

If you gave it to everyone instead of making it a module I think it would be entirely ok. In fact, I think if everyone had seismic sensor it would be ok (we could rename it radar lol). Right now though it's like the ECM of modules. So much benefit, don't have to do anything to get it. In fact, it rewards you for standing around behind a building not doing anything, because now you know when an enemy is getting close and they have no clue you're there.

Like, imagine if advanced zoom wasn't complete garbage because of the game engine. It would be balanced because it only adds a small bit of zoom. If zoom in general was a module, you'd better believe that would be broken.

[stjobe]

Battlefield awareness. It used to be a player skill, now it's a module.

[Blackwinter]

It is much better than Sixth Sense in WoT and a crew without that gimps your tank. No one in his right mind would ever take another skill first. Go figure.

Edited by Blackwinter, 24 May 2013 - 02:38 AM.

[Jaguar Prime]

Just curious, How would you guys feel if we had 360 radar in this game instead of the line of sight thing?

[Vassago Rain]

Jaguar Prime, on 24 May 2013 - 02:46 AM, said:

Just curious, How would you guys feel if we had 360 radar in this game instead of the line of sight thing?

We'd have seismic sensors for free.

[Livewyr]

I think the module should just show seismic events, Neutrally, period.. including ripple effects.

If there are a bunch of people around, let the player figure out if one of 'em shouldn't be there.

[Artgathan]

The Sesmic Sensor disproportionately affects short range weapons (SRMS, AC20, ML) because these weapons needs to be used under the 400m detection range (IE: a sniper hiding behind cover will detect my SRM / AC20 brawler 130m before I can effectively use my weapons). On the other hand, it's also handy for a brawler to take because it essentially gives you 360 degree awareness of the enemy out to 400m around you (handy in a brawl).

I'd like to see some way to 'spoof' the module (such as by shooting the ground, or by having random earthquakes on maps) it'd be a bit more balanced.

[Tennex]

i suppor this. SS was a really bad idea.

after ballistic and laser state rewind, light mechs don't need crap like this

[Satan n stuff]

Livewyr, on 24 May 2013 - 04:05 AM, said:

I think the module should just show seismic events, Neutrally, period.. including ripple effects.

If there are a bunch of people around, let the player figure out if one of 'em shouldn't be there.

That's not a bad idea, but you'd be able to see the arrows indicating friendlies which of course wouldn't appear for hostiles which kind of defeats the purpose. It would at least make hostiles harder to spot when they're near friendlies.

Artgathan, on 24 May 2013 - 04:31 AM, said:

I'd like to see some way to 'spoof' the module (such as by shooting the ground, or by having random earthquakes on maps) it'd be a bit more balanced.

However combined with this the aforementioned it seems like it might work. It would make the minimap very hard to read in a brawl, so the seismic blips should be more transparent as well.

Also there is a ( sort of ) counter to the module in the form of jump jets. You will not be detected while you're up in the air. If you know or suspect the enemy is at a specific position you could jump from outside seismic range into range and unless the enemy was closer than you expected you could close up to about half the distance in a blackjack, catapult, cataphract or highlander or close the whole distance and drop right on top of the position in a raven, jenner or spider and possibly a trebuchet.

Edited by Satan n stuff, 24 May 2013 - 05:39 AM.