13 replies to this topic

[Surtr]

I posted this in the Maps and Modes section a while ago, and didn't get much response so I thought I try the Btech forums, as you lots seem more inclined to take interest to my idea. I'll just copy/paste what I wrote before and add a bit:

I have always been a huge fan of stock only matches in Mechwarrior games. While I recognize the importance of the mechlab in Mechwarrior (and love it), I also am way too much of a Btech nerd. Sooo. This post is kind of to gauge interest in forming an unofficial "league" of sorts who is devoted to using only stock mechs. It would obviously have to be based on some sort of honor system, but I think it could be an interesting way to play the game for people who want to stick to the flavor of the designs without getting pounded into scrap all the time playing in the regular pool of 8v8 min/maxing.

This kind of just popped into my head so I'm still fleshing out ideas, but I'm thinking of assigning some kind of BV system to the stock chassis to balance games, as anything with star league tech would have a significant advantage in a ton for ton matchup.

So are there any opinions about this? Any units or individuals interested?

[Kyone Akashi]

It's an interesting idea. I don't have a whole lot of spare time (primary reason of why I'm not a member of a proper unit), but if this league is open to individuals who would only show up every now and then, I would give it a try!

[Dakkath]

Surtr, on 22 May 2013 - 06:24 PM, said:

I posted this in the Maps and Modes section a while ago, and didn't get much response so I thought I try the Btech forums, as you lots seem more inclined to take interest to my idea. I'll just copy/paste what I wrote before and add a bit:

I have always been a huge fan of stock only matches in Mechwarrior games. While I recognize the importance of the mechlab in Mechwarrior (and love it), I also am way too much of a Btech nerd. Sooo. This post is kind of to gauge interest in forming an unofficial "league" of sorts who is devoted to using only stock mechs. It would obviously have to be based on some sort of honor system, but I think it could be an interesting way to play the game for people who want to stick to the flavor of the designs without getting pounded into scrap all the time playing in the regular pool of 8v8 min/maxing.

This kind of just popped into my head so I'm still fleshing out ideas, but I'm thinking of assigning some kind of BV system to the stock chassis to balance games, as anything with star league tech would have a significant advantage in a ton for ton matchup.

So are there any opinions about this? Any units or individuals interested?

Moving topic to appropriate area.

[Mechteric]

Puretech and stock are two different things. Puretech means IS only on IS mechs, clan on clan, but customization isn't necessarily disallowed. Stock on the other hand means no customization.

Stock: A way a play stock against stock would be a great idea I think, to the point where I would rather it have its own queue.

Puretech: Hopefully when clan mechs are introduced they will only allow clan tech on clan mechs and IS tech on IS mechs. This is mainly because as the IS gets some new toys (light gauss, heavy gauss, rotary AC) it can help balance against those clan advantages.

[Surtr]

CapperDeluxe, on 23 May 2013 - 07:00 AM, said:

Puretech and stock are two different things. Puretech means IS only on IS mechs, clan on clan, but customization isn't necessarily disallowed. Stock on the other hand means no customization.

haha, I'm aware of the difference, I just needed a catchy name! But I do agree, I sincerely hope we can do puretech in the future, as well as stock only. Until then, I would love to see a player run organization of sorts to play stock only matches.

[Khanublikhan]

Thinking about Battletech lore:

Puretech and stock mechs suggest to me mechs that are assigned to a pilot, rather than mechs a pilot owns - i.e. These are the kind of mechs a cadet might be assigned to pilot as part of formal Academy training. Perhaps this kind of combat could be mock-combat / cadet training exercises.

A bit of fluff maybe - but PGI might be inclined to use Academy & Cadet training & stock mechs as a 'welcome mat' in a pleasant environment for newcomer players, if asked nicely?

[Surtr]

Khanublikhan, on 23 May 2013 - 09:08 AM, said:

Thinking about Battletech lore:

Puretech and stock mechs suggest to me mechs that are assigned to a pilot, rather than mechs a pilot owns - i.e. These are the kind of mechs a cadet might be assigned to pilot as part of formal Academy training. Perhaps this kind of combat could be mock-combat / cadet training exercises.

A bit of fluff maybe - but PGI might be inclined to use Academy & Cadet training & stock mechs as a 'welcome mat' in a pleasant environment for newcomer players, if asked nicely?

I like the academy idea. It would definitely teach new players good heat management and positioning. But what I'm talking about is more of a competitive or league/tournament based environment for super nerdy battletech fans like me!

I'm going to begin working on a charter, basic rules, and point values for the existing mechs and chassis, probably using the basic BV 2.0 values from the MUL. I'm not a math whiz so I won't know how to approach altering them for balance, but I figure with the combat abstraction from battletech not translating to MWO the changes in armor and weapon damages will probably offset eachother. We shall see!

[Blue Footed Booby]

I don't understand why so many people are so fixated on stock mechs. Is it just nostlagia for TT or do they really LIKE mechs that suck at everything rather than specializing?

[Surtr]

Blue Footed Booby, on 23 May 2013 - 03:00 PM, said:

I don't understand why so many people are so fixated on stock mechs. Is it just nostlagia for TT or do they really LIKE mechs that suck at everything rather than specializing?

For me its a combination of nostalgia and roleplaying. The mechlab, which while I do love it, and it definitely has a place, also has a tendency to make mechwarrior games less...mechwarrior-y... Its just far too easy to exploit. And the simple way around that is to play mechs as they were designed.

And this idea of mine is basically a way that would allow myself (and others with a similar interest) to play the game as we want. When (if) PGI decides to implement stock only then it will become obsolete.

I

[Yanlowen Cage]

Blue Footed Booby, on 23 May 2013 - 03:00 PM, said:

I don't understand why so many people are so fixated on stock mechs. Is it just nostlagia for TT or do they really LIKE mechs that suck at everything rather than specializing?

I think reasons are legion for people who would like to play stock or light mod. Most obvious are that people kinda get sick of the mechlab super builds. Another is that by playing stocks mechs from the houses the you choose to be part of makes you feel like you are more connected to the lore of the game. Another reason would be because mechs to a lot of people are meant to be all purpose war machines and in the battletech universe no house,clan, or pirate group would play such a limited role mech. As they need these mechs to operate over a wide variety of maps and mission. Customization isn't really a huge part of TT like in mechwarrior video games. There are more reasons, but tired of listing them. Another thought is that stock mechs in TT don't really suck. But due to the nature of the conversion from turn based roll to hit to real time eye ball aiming they do not translate well. For example in table top if you had an enemy mech at med range and you didn't move and he didn't and your gunnery is 4 then you have a base of 6 or better to hit with your lrms. That doesn't translate to the mechwarrior game where you gain lock, fire and then your target runs behind cover. You lose lock and miss. Thus a lrm boat in TT can mother his 1 ton of ammo until he has a high certainty that he will hit. Meaning he does not need 10 tons of ammo.

Edited by Yanlowen Cage, 23 May 2013 - 06:23 PM.

[Small Baguette]

I'd definitely be interested in this, sounds like a great idea!

[Sybreed]

I'm in, but for this mode to be really fun, devs need to look at ammo per ton and SHS.

[Surtr]

I think it would work just fine as is. Armor values are doubled from TT which is why we have increased ammo/ton. Also heat is supposed to be a big concern in most stock mechs, it will make the games more methodical and deliberate, with less room for error

[Surtr]

So I went through the MUL and made a spreadsheet with all the BV's and C-bill costs for all mechs currently in the game. For hero mechs I made a Skunkwerks loadout for each one, getting as close as possible. I ran into a bit of trouble with the Champion mechs and engine sizes on some of the Hero's, I got as close as possible in most cases.

My next step will be figuring out a rough estimate of what size teams would need to be. I think what I'll do is average BV and C-bill cost for each mech, then each weight class, then approximate for now. That way matches of different weight brackets can be played.

If anyone is interested in helping figure this stuff out, specifically people who like fiddling with math, please let me know! I would love to get this thing off the ground.