58 replies to this topic

[Reyge]

As the topic says, what would be, in your mind, the perfect lance of I.S. mechs? Any/all weight classes, circa 3049-3055. Note: this lance has to be rather self-sufficient, i.e.it has to have both some sort of scout/spotter and also some firepower. Please try to keep things balanced. If you have a light scout mech, for example, please don't pair it up with three assault mechs, as this means the scout couldn't contribute fully to the lance in a firefight. Also, please describe what role you would fill within said lance; recon, long range support, close quarters combatant, etc.

(BTW, for you newbies out there, check this link: http://www.sarna.net...i/Company#Lance to find out more info on lances)

And remember, this is just a forum for posting ideas... what actually works within the game of MWO is something we can't yet know.

P.S. I purposefully put the date "3055" as the ending date, that's not a typo. I figured there are a few of us who will still be playing in about 5-6 years, even if that means expansion packs/new games (I've been a fan for 20 years now). I didn't want to go out too much further than that because that involves Protomechs and such, and I don't want to get into those. No Clan mechs or Solaris/experimental mechs please.

[pursang]

There's no such thing.

[Kazzamo]

It depends on what they're attacking, what the environment is like, what the pilots are skilled at/used to, and all kinds of other factors. In short, there is no perfect lance.

[Reyge]

Then allow me to rephrase the question: if you were in a lance, what kind of role would you want to be in within that lance, and what mechs would you want as your lance mates? I'm not asking what role would you take... I'm asking what role are you specifically looking to tailor your mech/playing style towards. Given that we can't just throw our mechs together in ANY configuration (hardpoints don't allow for that), I feel this is a legitimate question. Sure, you're gonna want to fill any holes within your lance, but I'm not asking about that. I'm asking, what would your role be in a lance that was built/designed by you. Are you going to be it's commander? It's scout? What role would you LIKE to play the most as? And which mechs would you like to see fighting along side of you in that lance?

[Cerlin]

Y'all are pretty hard on him. He is just looking for an intellectual fun while he is waiting for mwo.

I'll choose to interpret "perfect" as what it is, a personal opinion only (since ideas like "perfect" are completely relative.)

For my play style, I really like to have a generally fast lance that is flexible at all ranges. For this I will have a basic philosophy of LRms and medium lasers on most my mech.

The Command mech will be a Catapult, standard duel lrm 15 build. This will offer heavy fire support at range, is pretty fast, and can escape with the rest of the lance if their is trouble. Since this is a game mech I will not link anything.

Next I would like to have a Centurion because of its weapon mix and speed that can generally fight along side the catapult. Together these two can hurt at range and once it is closer the Ac10 and Medium lasers will do their work.

For the faster side of my lance I would include firstly the Wolftrap. http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Wolf_Trap I fell in love with this mech in MW2 mercs and it is very fast (97kph) and has an Lbx ac 10 and an LRM 10. It is like a super fast upgraded centurion.

To work along with the Wolf trap in the speedy part of the lance I would want a Panther. While it is slow for a light, it is cheap and has a PPC so it can engage at range. http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Panther

In this setup, the Wolf Trap would be the Scout/Anti-scout with the rest working together to inflict damage and skirmish together. While the lance is slow compared to lights, it has a high overall speed and can really choose its fights with heavier lances. The purpose would be skirmishing until the time you needed to hit a critical point. Maneuver and tactical attack, not just pure tonnage.

If I was forced to keep it in MWO context, I would change the wolf trap to a second Centurion and then change the panther to a Jenner for my scouting.

Edited by Cerlin, 02 June 2012 - 03:37 PM.

[Ori Klein]

The lance is only as relliable as its warriors. The mech is only as valuable as its pilot.
The perfect lance is therefore one comprised of the most excelled and talented, ones with vast experience and a record of overcoming the odds.

Edited by Ori Klein, 02 June 2012 - 03:37 PM.

[chainedbeast]

I would have to say that I would have a combination of mechs. 1. Jenner 2. Marauder II 3. Archer 4. Raven.

[chainedbeast]

Depending on what you want your lance to do. Mobility is important, the Jenner is very fast. Firepower is also important the Maruader II and Archer provide a mix of both. Enhancement for the lance is an important feature as well the Raven takes care of that. An important thing to think about is the enviroment that you are in what effects it has on the equipment and munitions.

[Reyge]

Cerlin, on 02 June 2012 - 03:32 PM, said:

Y'all are pretty hard on him. He is just looking for an intellectual fun while he is waiting for mwo.

I'll choose to interpret "perfect" as what it is, a personal opinion only (since ideas like "perfect" are completely relative.)

For my play style, I really like to have a generally fast lance that is flexible at all ranges. For this I will have a basic philosophy of LRms and medium lasers on most my mech.

The Command mech will be a Catapult, standard duel lrm 15 build. This will offer heavy fire support at range, is pretty fast, and can escape with the rest of the lance if their is trouble. Since this is a game mech I will not link anything.

Next I would like to have a Centurion because of its weapon mix and speed that can generally fight along side the catapult. Together these two can hurt at range and once it is closer the Ac10 and Medium lasers will do their work.

For the faster side of my lance I would include firstly the Wolftrap. http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Wolf_Trap I fell in love with this mech in MW2 mercs and it is very fast (97kph) and has an Lbx ac 10 and an LRM 10. It is like a super fast upgraded centurion.

To work along with the Wolf trap in the speedy part of the lance I would want a Panther. While it is slow for a light, it is cheap and has a PPC so it can engage at range. http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Panther

In this setup, the Wolf Trap would be the Scout/Anti-scout with the rest working together to inflict damage and skirmish together. While the lance is slow compared to lights, it has a high overall speed and can really choose its fights with heavier lances. The purpose would be skirmishing until the time you needed to hit a critical point. Maneuver and tactical attack, not just pure tonnage.

If I was forced to keep it in MWO context, I would change the wolf trap to a second Centurion and then change the panther to a Jenner for my scouting.

Thank you, Cerlin. This was indeed my intent, since NONE of us posting here have the MWO beta yet (and if you ARE posting with a beta, STOP!!!). Perfection is indeed a relative thing... perfect for <fill in the blank>. Thank you for understanding my question in it's intent, and responding appropriately.

BTW, I think I like your idea of a lance... good mix of speed and firepower. Wouldn't be MY choice of mechs, but that's where our play-styles are just different. We're two different people, and we're GOING to play differently! Kinda glad of that, actually... it'd be rather monotonous if everyone played the game the same way!!!

[StaIker]

The question itself betrays a lack of understanding. There is no such thing as a perfect lance and there never can be. A lance can only ever be optimised for a particular set of circumstances outside of which it will perform poorly. It's like asking what the perfect clothes are or what the perfect motor vehicle is. Perfect for what? Anything you choose will be perfect only for a narrow purpose and of little value otherwise. Unless you full describe every possible variable you are optimising for, perfect is a useless term.

[Dvinn]

No such thing as a perfect lance in my opinion. It all depends on the situation, pilots, opposition, mechs, and lots more stuff. A perfect lance in one situation can get eaten alive in another. I think a "perfect" lance would be one in which the pilots work well together and are good at their job/role and you would also want to have your bases covered on the jobs so a couple scouts 1-3, a couple heavy hitters 1-3 and probably 4 mediums as the workhorses of the group for an 8 player team.

[Pyriel Ward]

Some people take these open ended questions just a bit too seriously.

[Ancalagon]

The 400 ton Stiener Scout Lance obviously. Can anything really beat that? .

[Steel Raven]

There is no such thing as a Perfect Lance, you put your best people in their best machine and try to roll the dice in your favor.

[Reyge]

StaIker, on 02 June 2012 - 04:33 PM, said:

The question itself betrays a lack of understanding. There is no such thing as a perfect lance and there never can be. A lance can only ever be optimised for a particular set of circumstances outside of which it will perform poorly. It's like asking what the perfect clothes are or what the perfect motor vehicle is. Perfect for what? Anything you choose will be perfect only for a narrow purpose and of little value otherwise. Unless you full describe every possible variable you are optimising for, perfect is a useless term.

Not a lack of understanding. I understand perfectly well that circumstances beyond one's ability to control factor into the lance's efficiency. That however, was NOT what I asked, and I tried to clarify it in a later post. What I'm trying to do is get a sense of who I might want to invite into a merc company by asking a VERY simple question... a question that so far, only one person has managed to answer (that was Cerlin, BTW). I want to know who's going to be a team player versus who's gonna be a lone wolf. Who's gonna fall in line versus who's gonna get the lance killed. By answering as many of you have, you're the ones showing a lack of understanding. Anyone's who's ever been to boot camp knows this... they weed out the lone wolves from the start, kick them straight out of boot, and work with the ones who'll obey orders. Do you understand my question now? Which role do you want to play?

[BattleBadger]

umm well, for this game or from canon?

in mwo, if you are having a lance vs. lance fight, it would be a good idea to have mixed weights and armaments, but in 12 v. 12, it might be better to have a scout lance, command lance, and a med/heavy lance.

in canon, mechs in a lance tended to have similar tonnages...


it also depends on what your play style might be. you could want a fast strike lance in even lance v. lance that could sweep in, possibly take out a mech, and get out before getting too damaged, which is much more possible with the radar this game has compared to other mechwarrior games

Edited by BattleBadger, 02 June 2012 - 05:24 PM.

[JaRoo]

Agreed with some of the above replies - There is no such thing as a perfect lance there are too many variables that can change the end result. All you can do is put the best you think and go for it.

[Crimestick]

For myself the perfect lance would be a medium lance, mobile and respectable fire power. Centurion, Enforcer,
Hunchback, and a Hatchetman. This would be sort of a 'Jack-of-all-trades' lance. It can provide it's own recon and fire support and the Hunchback and Hatchetman are nasty up close. Also, if the lance had to go geurilla, it would fare pretty decently as no single unit in the lance is %100 ammunition reliant.

Another ideal lance ( for me ) would be Thunderbolt ( jump jet variant, I believe the Eridani Lighthorse used this variant ), Ospery( this mech appeared in a Battletechnology issue. It sports a LRM-10 and a Gauss rifle), Hoplite, and a Wolverine ( PPC variant). This is a very self sufficient lance, excellent for strike missions and recon. Also capable of fire support, rear actions, holding the line. You name it.

Edited by Crimestick, 02 June 2012 - 05:44 PM.

[latdheretic]

For an all comers, not sure what I'm going to be up against lance, In the given timeframe without doing crazy upgrades, I would pick the following:

Jenner JR7-D (normal stock Jenner) 35 Tons
Role: Scout/Hit & Run

Wolverine WVR-6M (Large Laser varient of Wolverine 55 Tons
Role: Tactical Flexability

Axman AXM-1N (Stock Axman)
Role: Brawler

Archer ARC-2R (Stock Archer)
Role: Fire support/Command

Why: I only like 1 assault mech: the Bezerker (which is a few years after the question timeframe. Overall weight average is ~ 56 Tons making it a fairly typical lance. A hevier lance would be able to out-slug me, but would give up tactical flexibility to do so.There is very little newtech, with the majority of it in the Axman.

[Vora MacEvedy]

Perfect lance...

For close-in fighting an Annihilator backed up by a Bombard, a -R60L Urbie and a Hunchback.

Meet that group in a back alley somewhere...