17 replies to this topic

[Donnie Silveray]

So much rage these past few days! I am almost aghast at how unsatiable most of the community here is , it's becoming difficult to take some suggestions seriously.

Hardpoint size restrictons?
Firing Cones?
Golly, the arrogance of some people!

I don't care if you think the proposed balance changes suck, and I do agree with some of you that they do. But a simple cursory review of so many suggestions utterly miss the point:

Creative solutions are often the simplest.

The best way to tackle a problem that isn't coming from the very core of a system is to solve it in the most simplest of manners else you overcomplicate the whole. Paul's solution isn't fully there but it is probably far better than most ALL of the suggestions I have seen by a great deal. Adding a heat scaling when using weapons of the same type at once is a good way at 'actively' dissuading super alpha boating and encouraging players to pace themselves. That alone solves HALF of the gripes I've been hearing about excessive alpha on CERTAIN builds. This system DOES need enhancement and tweaks as I fear it is too benign to truly affect the game as it is but again, I would rather have this over the disaster that was the month of May and resuming PPCsniping as normal.

Although it would have been better to address the core heat mechanics it can only go so far in passively dissuading excessive min-max. But one thing you all must keep in mind that this game is being made in virtual real time. What PGI has laid down here is a decent foundation for improvement for the future to tweak and adjust. Much like the JJ shake, they intend to tweak it to account for weight so lightmechs will glide gracefully while Highlanders will quake. The simple fact that the system was put into place is more than enough for future tweaking without completely changing how the game works.

Again, what PGI is after for is a simple way to modify a large range of systems without tampering with the core gameplay as well as implementing more harsh punishments for running high energy weapon builds that exceed what Battletech would normally say. There is much progress to be made, and I expect PGI to keep this system updated and tweaked as they gain telemetry from our experiences.

[HighlandCoo]

Uh Oh - prepare to be LECTURED

[Jasen]

LOL

I remember when I still had faith... good times.

[HighlandCoo]

Jasen, on 12 June 2013 - 07:05 AM, said:

LOL

I remember when I still had faith... good times.

This is kind of the problem you see. Everyone trying to be soooo cool and snarky. If you are still hanging around you don't really get to comment. Well, not you personally Just irratating how many people in these forums just seem to pop up to go on and on and on about whatever they think is wrong.

I just play for shooty mechs. I really don't take it any further than that and I'm pretty satisfied with what the game supplies. Sometimes wish I could just turn off chat actually so then I didn't have to hear from ANY of the community because frankly - you are all pretty awful.

[Jasen]

HighlandCoo, on 12 June 2013 - 07:15 AM, said:

This is kind of the problem you see. Everyone trying to be soooo cool and snarky. If you are still hanging around you don't really get to comment. Well, not you personally Just irratating how many people in these forums just seem to pop up to go on and on and on about whatever they think is wrong.

I just play for shooty mechs. I really don't take it any further than that and I'm pretty satisfied with what the game supplies. Sometimes wish I could just turn off chat actually so then I didn't have to hear from ANY of the community because frankly - you are all pretty awful.

Its just.. in closed beta we made huge posts about the problems, they ignored us.
We told them they weren't ready for open beta, they ignored us.
Countless people have made countless amazing threads filled with excellent solutions to the problems... the ignore.

At this point, **** em. They are either arrogant, incompetent, unskilled, or all of the above.

Give it a few more months.. when that new shiny wears off, you'll be just like us.

[Donnie Silveray]

Indeed my patience does wear thin with regards to PGI's handling of this game. I am a game developer myself and keep up with all sorts of developments with regards to the games I've vested some interest in. Watching PGI seem to make some progress but frequently hit the deck weighs heavily on my confidence in them. Still, from a development standpoint the recent balancing pass has the 'potential' to resolve a good many issues. Issue I have with them is are they brave enough to push it harder?

[Jonneh]

If I had a penny for every person who claimed to be a game developer!

Even if you are, its irrelevant. If you think you can do better then design your own game!

Best you can do is provide valid feedback like the rest of us. Touting yourself as some high-and-mighty I-could-do-better really adds nothing to these forums.

[Petroshka]

fyi: being a forum mod or in testing doesn't qualify you as a game developer.

[Tennex]

paul's solution is very good in theory. but the number he uses are horrible. Aribtrary 0.5 cooldown based on arbitrary chain fire rate.

6 MLs just becaues of a hunchback variant. and 5 heat accruing is way too much



That being said. the boating restriction will probably be useful when clan tech comes in. To somehow keep it balanced with IS tech.

Though the system has the potential to become overcomplicated and convoluted very fast.

Edited by Tennex, 12 June 2013 - 10:45 AM.

[Jasen]

Jonneh, on 12 June 2013 - 10:28 AM, said:

If I had a penny for every person who claimed to be a game developer!

Even if you are, its irrelevant. If you think you can do better then design your own game!

Best you can do is provide valid feedback like the rest of us. Touting yourself as some high-and-mighty I-could-do-better really adds nothing to these forums.

I'm a software engineer... i chose not to do game development as I prefer money over "glory"... however: he is right. They clearly have no processes... they have a severe groupthink issue as well with a single guy at the top making all the decisions - and none of his underlings having the balls to say... ya know what, this is stupid.

That whole "design your own game" **** is ******** too... people not need to invest years into something to have valid thoughts.

[zhajin]

Im pretty much convinced that PGI does not understand the concept of simple solutions, so why bother discussing them. They over engineer every "fix" in the game...

PS. I also am not a game designer, though i do have degrees in design and computer science. I just chose to work in a much more lucrative development field.

Edited by zhajin, 12 June 2013 - 10:41 AM.

[Tennex]

Jasen, on 12 June 2013 - 10:36 AM, said:

I'm a software engineer... i chose not to do game development as I prefer money over "glory"... however: he is right. They clearly have no processes... they have a severe groupthink issue as well with a single guy at the top making all the decisions - and none of his underlings having the balls to say... ya know what, this is stupid.

That whole "design your own game" **** is ******** too... people not need to invest years into something to have valid thoughts.

i'm sure paul has great work ethics. but he isn't the best at balancing the game. or creating any kind of elegant/intuitive system.

and lets be honest about game designers.. all the talented people in the game design industry go into art/programing. the people who don't have these talents are the ones designing games.

which in my opinion is really stupid. The designers need to be the most talented. but the talent goes where the money/lifestyle is.

Same reason our brightest doctors are plastic surgeons/dermatologists. When they really should be in life saving positions

Edited by Tennex, 12 June 2013 - 12:39 PM.

[Jonneh]

Jasen, on 12 June 2013 - 10:36 AM, said:

I'm a software engineer... i chose not to do game development as I prefer money over "glory"... however: he is right. They clearly have no processes... they have a severe groupthink issue as well with a single guy at the top making all the decisions - and none of his underlings having the balls to say... ya know what, this is stupid.

That whole "design your own game" **** is ******** too... people not need to invest years into something to have valid thoughts.

You have no evidence as to what their testing, discussion, balance or iteration process is. Everything you say is speculative and based off your own assumptions and perspective.

So yeah, "go design your own game" is a pretty useless thing to say. So it criticizing something with no valid points or evidence to support your argument. So thats kind of what I was going for really?

If you want to add value, make posts with some value.

[Tennex]

0.5 is very forced and easily exploitable
The cooldown between penalty needs to be related to the weapon's fire rate.


To make it feel even more fluid and organic. Boating penalty needs to decay depending on time after first shot. A boater firing at 0.1 seconds after the first shot recieves the full penalty. firing at 0.2 seconds recieves 75% of the heat penalty at 0.3 secs 50%. At 0.4 secs only 20% penalty and so on.

Etc. Heat penalty is reduced as the boater waits longer after the first shot.

Edited by Tennex, 12 June 2013 - 12:46 PM.

[Relic1701]

Hard heat cap (lower than current, think TT heat scale), increase effectiveness of DHS....would solve a lot of problems imho.

[mania3c]

Jasen, on 12 June 2013 - 07:25 AM, said:

Its just.. in closed beta we made huge posts about the problems, they ignored us.
We told them they weren't ready for open beta, they ignored us.
Countless people have made countless amazing threads filled with excellent solutions to the problems... the ignore.

At this point, **** em. They are either arrogant, incompetent, unskilled, or all of the above.

Give it a few more months.. when that new shiny wears off, you'll be just like us.

honestly..if these suggestion were so awesome how are suggestions on the forum right now, I think it's really better they ignored it..

Look.. I am not sure about heat penalties too..but seriously..what is so wrong with this game?? It has issues..as every single game.. but hell.. I have fun..so have tons others.. and you are still here.. sooo?

[Sug]

Donnie Silveray, on 12 June 2013 - 06:31 AM, said:

There is much progress to be made, and I expect PGI to keep this system updated and tweaked as they gain telemetry from our experiences.

Oh you must be new here. Welcome to MWO and the MWO forums. I suggest you watch the training video.

http://mwomercs.com/...raining-grounds

[Mike Forst]

Thank you for the thread Destined