61 replies to this topic

[William Mountbank]

From 25t Mongoose mech on Sarna:

"This allowed it to mount much more armor than other light 'Mechs, giving the Mongoose the capability to survive a direct PPC hit to the chest without suffering internal damage."

[pow pow]

if I am reading the dev notes correctly, tonight we ll see a slight nerf to boating.

Your solution will just force all boaters to boat large lasers iinstead; which are as deadly if not even deadlier vs harder to hit (faster) moving targets like lights and mediums.

also: "The Particle Projection Cannon is a unique hard-hitting energy weapon. Unlike Lasers which have a firing duration over which damage is dealt, PPC weapons will inflict all of their damage at once, into a single part of the enemy 'Mech. Since the PPC has a feedback effect when focusing on targets at close range, a field inhibitor limiter will engage at ranges below 90m to prevent damage to the weapon and the firing 'Mech. Thus, at ranges below 90 meters, the PPC inflicts reduced damage; damage drops off linearly from 10 points of damage to 0, from 90m to 0m. The EMP effect of PPC weapons disable ECM on targets hit by a PPC bolt for 4 seconds[3]."

I do like Mors idea with the "trail" damage but that would be neat to develop into a new weapon as it wouldn't represent what the PPC is.

You can bring back the old (february) PPC values for all I care. slightly less velocity and a dab more heat. But, if my expectations are correct, you won't be seeing too many 4+ ppc warriors after the boat nerf.

[FunkyFritter]

I feel like the only thing ppcs need is a slower projectile. High heat alpha striking becomes a lot less appealing when it can miss or be dodged, even slow mechs care a lot less when they have time to torso twist and take that 60 damage shot to an arm instead of the center torso. I much prefer any change that increases interaction rather than a direct nerf that is purely a hindrance.

[WolvesX]

Yiazmat, on 16 June 2013 - 03:18 PM, said:

I'm. ...actually on board with this.

+1

[w0rm]

+1 for the medic

[BigMekkUrDakka]

Joseph Mallan, on 17 June 2013 - 07:11 PM, said:

Rather low actually. 7 is the most common roll. Also on TT 1/2 Armor so 30 damage on a Panther (CT 14 Armor and 11 Structure) 3 PPC core it. and those 2 PPC o the Leg (12 Armor & 8 Structure) Remove the Leg!

thank you i was referring to novels rather than to TT in that "canon" post, but again skirmishers need some viable energy weapon, its simply impossible right now to use anything else for this role (probably gauss then viktor released)
actually PGI just need to make proper heat cap and heat dissipation, so the 4ppc alfa will pop the mechs engine instantly, but chain fire those and you will be able to keep up substantial amount of DPS before hitting heat limit, and believe me chainfire noticeably decrease pinpoint amounts of damage giving you "spread" that you so desperately want, unless your victim will stand still for 30 seconds without even twisting its torso

[Braggart]

Joseph Mallan, on 17 June 2013 - 07:11 PM, said:

Rather low actually. 7 is the most common roll. Also on TT 1/2 Armor so 30 damage on a Panther (CT 14 Armor and 11 Structure) 3 PPC core it. and those 2 PPC o the Leg (12 Armor & 8 Structure) Remove the Leg!

what happens to the mech that fired the 6 ppcs in 1 round?

[Bishop Steiner]

One Medic Army, on 16 June 2013 - 03:16 PM, said:

So, I have a crazy idea for PPCs:
Right now they deal 10 dmg for 8 heat with a cooldown of 4 seconds.

Change them to deal 5 dmg for 4 heat at a cooldown of 2 seconds.

Boom, no more super concentrated single volley damage, but same heat efficiency and the same DPS.

So, lets have it, how stupid is this idea?

Yay! Lets make hard hitting weapons into even more dakka dakka style high dps, paper cut weapons!

And while we are at it, lets make AC20s do five damage and fire EVERY 1 second too!

Let's just totally ruin the game by turning all weapons into light damage fast fire rate stuff and rename it PapercutWarrior: Online.

Jeez. If PPCs were actually even the problem in the first place, I might almost see the validity. Although jsut totally ******* on what makes a PPC a PPC , why bother even making a Mechwarrior Game?

Or could we address the fact that PPCs, in and of themselves are fine, it's the abilty to boat and abuse the the things that are the issue. 1 PPC, nobody fears. Same with 2-3 (unless the 3rd is backed up by a Gauss Rifle). How often do relatively stock AWS or K2 mechs lead the scoreboard? Almost never. Because 1-3 PPC are effective, but far from OP. SO why do we continue to look for ways to treat a symptom, instead of actually addressing the problem itself?

Because for some reason, people would rather have totally unrecognizable weapons and "total freedom" in the Mechlab, then to see steps taken to remove boating of these huge weapons. (And because PGI is supposedly making it as close to TT as possible... except for heat side effects. Which is idiotic in and of itself).

[Petroshka]

Pater Mors, on 16 June 2013 - 03:23 PM, said:

I threw this in the other PPC topic so I think it applies here too. I'd like to see PPC's do damage as per the picture below:



5 damage frontloaded into the ball and 5 spread as the trail hits.

All other stats remain the same.

This is awesome. The OP is also great.

PGI: Sorry, the engine™ will not let us do this.

[BlackIronTarkus]

Pater Mors, on 16 June 2013 - 03:23 PM, said:

I threw this in the other PPC topic so I think it applies here too. I'd like to see PPC's do damage as per the picture below:



5 damage frontloaded into the ball and 5 spread as the trail hits.

All other stats remain the same.

Thats really great and I like that idea, but the projectile is so fast, would it be possible to spread the damage at all by moving?

[ExtremeA79]

Pater Mors, on 17 June 2013 - 06:28 PM, said:

Actually... I just made that idea up off the top of my head, not from Sarna. I rarely visit Sarna these days.

PPC's in game currently act exactly as shown in that picture, except all 10dmg is frontloaded into the 'ball' and the trail is just a visual effect. I just took something from both sides of the argument (PPC as beam weapon vs PPC as ballistic weapon). The way PPC's work right now is not canonical either, so it hardly matters.

And yes, I agree that the problem is heat (not boating, boating is not an issue it's a symptom). See my signature for my thoughts on that subject.

The PPC's in game a VERY close to canon. If anything, they should be going faster.
To explain the trail, look at the rail gun test in youtube, it leaves a trail of fire. And look at lightning, which doesn't go away instantly after it struck.
I might no be making sense or whatever.
Now the PPC closest to canon was in mw4.

[Livewyr]

One Medic Army, on 16 June 2013 - 03:16 PM, said:

So, I have a crazy idea for PPCs:
Right now they deal 10 dmg for 8 heat with a cooldown of 4 seconds.

Change them to deal 5 dmg for 4 heat at a cooldown of 2 seconds.

Boom, no more super concentrated single volley damage, but same heat efficiency and the same DPS.

So, lets have it, how stupid is this idea?

http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Autocannon/5

[bloodnor]

Pater Mors, on 16 June 2013 - 03:23 PM, said:

I threw this in the other PPC topic so I think it applies here too. I'd like to see PPC's do damage as per the picture below:



5 damage frontloaded into the ball and 5 spread as the trail hits.

All other stats remain the same.

best idea i have ever seen when it comes to dealing with PPC boating

[One Medic Army]

Livewyr, on 18 June 2013 - 11:32 AM, said:

http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Autocannon/5

If I could mount a 7ton/3crit AC/5 in my energy slots, and if it used my engine heatsinks rather than relying on ammo, then that'd be just fine.

[Sable]

lol as much fun as this would be, that would mean they do as much damage as a medium laser. Which brings the question to why take up 3 slots on a mech for the same damage as a 1 slot weapon?

Edited by Sable, 19 June 2013 - 01:01 PM.

[One Medic Army]

Sable, on 19 June 2013 - 01:00 PM, said:

lol as much fun as this would be, that would mean they do as much damage as a medium laser. Which brings the question to why take up 3 slots on a mech for the same damage as a 1 slot weapon?

Range, front-loaded concentrated damage, twice the firerate (and therefore twice the DPS).

[3rdworld]

return PPC splash.

like 7/3 or 6/4 pinpoint/splash.

Edited by 3rdworld, 19 June 2013 - 01:17 PM.

[Kiiyor]

One Medic Army, on 16 June 2013 - 07:13 PM, said:

What are you talking about, they're already a good brawling weapon, 90m is pretty freaking close and they only lose 1 dmg per 9m below 90.
5 dmg at 45, which is practically facehugging.

Then it's just a reeeealy hot medium laser, heh.

[Hellcat420]

this does not fix high alpha builds, it just removes the ppc in from the game and replaces it with a nonbeam laser.

Edited by Hellcat420, 19 June 2013 - 01:23 PM.

[One Medic Army]

Hellcat420, on 19 June 2013 - 01:22 PM, said:

this does not fix high alpha builds, it just removes the ppc in from the game and replaces it with a nonbeam laser.

An alpha over a period of 1 second is much easier to spread, both for the firer and the target.

Or else we'd be seeing complain threads about the Hunch-P and the Blackjack-1X which have 45pt and 40pt respective alpha strikes with pinpoint precision.