31 replies to this topic

[hashinshin]

NVM this patch actually removed content by making the already bad LPL completely unusable.

People often make jokes about developers using a dart board for balance decisions, but I'm starting to legitimately wonder here...

Wanna know how bad the Machine Gun is? A ton of ammo does 200 damage. Now go use Machine Guns and shoot. Notice how you're hitting multiple locations? With ludicrous amounts of spread? People say "no it's okay, you only need 1 ton of ammo for machine guns!" Do you realize that when you look at that in a negative light that it's NOT a good thing? If I'm using 3 machine guns and I barely ever use more than 1 ton of ammo (200 damage) that's not a good thing.

And the flamer. Dat 0.7 DPS did good. It didn't do BAD. But the Flamer should've been the one increased to 1.0 DPS, at least then this 64 range monstrocity might find a use.

[Deathlike]

hashinshin, on 18 June 2013 - 12:02 PM, said:

NVM this patch actually removed content by making the already bad LPL completely unusable.

People often make jokes about developers using a dart board for balance decisions, but I'm starting to legitimately wonder here...

Wanna know how bad the Machine Gun is? A ton of ammo does 200 damage. Now go use Machine Guns and shoot. Notice how you're hitting multiple locations? With ludicrous amounts of spread? People say "no it's okay, you only need 1 ton of ammo for machine guns!" Do you realize that when you look at that in a negative light that it's NOT a good thing? If I'm using 3 machine guns and I barely ever use more than 1 ton of ammo (200 damage) that's not a good thing.

And the flamer. Dat 0.7 DPS did good. It didn't do BAD. But the Flamer should've been the one increased to 1.0 DPS, at least then this 64 range monstrocity might find a use.

For a moment there, I thought you said ludicrous speed.

With that said... the Flamer DPS shouldn't exactly reach the level of the DPS of a Small Laser.. or the SPL for that matter.

[TheComet]

the MG shots are actually hitscan like the lasers, the bullets are just smoke and mirrors and are only there for show.

The spread isn't as bad as it looks, I'll be taking a look at the damage output on my 6x MG jager later tonight to see if it's a viable brawler-ish thing in pugs. Kinda concerned with the LPL though, I run 2x LPL on that mech and I might wind up going back to my ER PPCs for better heat/damage efficiency O.o

[General Taskeen]

Like I've said countless times, the MG needs to be changed to an actual mini-ballistic that actually SHOOTS shells and not hit-scan magic affects.

[hammerreborn]

New flamers are awesome

[Keifomofutu]

hammerreborn, on 18 June 2013 - 12:13 PM, said:

New flamers are awesome

108 damage

Edited by Keifomofutu, 18 June 2013 - 09:08 PM.

[General Taskeen]

^Stole kills during a good steam roll game.

[Rasc4l]

After the patch, I've been pugging with my 2xLPL+6xMG+300STD+11DHS Jägermech to see how the new tweaks work. I've been surprised to see my damages in the 400-500 range in a "good normal victory" -match and even had one game where I did over 800 with 4 kills.

In conclusion I would say

- the MGs finally work. They are not OP, they are not bad, they are fine. THANK YOU PGI for that.
- LPL "nerf" from the pulse laser normalization didn't break the weapon (even the heat isn't a problem when PPCs are "normalized" to +1/+2 heat . (sorry for off-topic blabber)

[stjobe]

Rasc4l, on 19 June 2013 - 03:27 AM, said:

In conclusion I would say

- the MGs finally work. They are not OP, they are not bad, they are fine.

Sure, if you can mount six of them on a heavy chassis with max armour and backed up by a couple of heavy energy weapons.

Now try four of them on a Spider and see if you'll say the same.

[Livewyr]

MGs weigh half a ton and have like no cooldown or heat.. what exactly do you guys want?

[Ph30nix]

on paper the machine guns seem godly as far as DPS goes (JMS-dd 6 machine guns alone with 6 dps? add in 2 er-ppc and holy crap http://mwo.smurfy-ne...4eb04fa635f4b74

but ill have to actually log in and goof around with them now lol. i dont think ive seen a build with a sustained DPS that high maybe back a few months ago before orignal SRM nerfs.

[General Taskeen]

Livewyr, on 19 June 2013 - 05:45 AM, said:

MGs weigh half a ton and have like no cooldown or heat.. what exactly do you guys want?

[MeiSooHaityu]

The LPLasers aren't that nerfed heat wise (then again, I use them in pairs and not 5 at a time).

The Flamer on the other hand, I think PGI is affraid to buff that weapon. The Flamer is one of those weapons that is really hard to get right.

I remember in early closed beta when the flamer was OP...YES I said OP. With a 9 Flamer Hunch, you could kill an Atlas in about 10 Sec. LOL. It would overheat and shut down the Atlas within about 3 to 4 sec. Then a few seconds later, the ammo would explode, blow off limbs, and destroy the engine LOL. Imagine being in a mech that gets shut down in seconds and having to watch as you die and can't do a thing about it.

I agree that the Flamer needs improvement, but go too far, and people will boat it and cause a LOT frustration within the community. It's bad enough when a weapon is overpowered, but add the disabling affect of the Flamer, and people will go crazy.

[Waking One]

Livewyr, on 19 June 2013 - 05:45 AM, said:

MGs weigh half a ton and have like no cooldown or heat.. what exactly do you guys want?

You forgetting ammo? They weigh more than small lasers.

[Sable]

Get so tired of saying this... the machine gun IS NOT supposed to be a primary weapon. Its always been something to shoot while your other weapon systems are cooling down.

The large pulse laser change was to give pulse lasers common characteristics in PREPARATION FOR FUTURE WEAPONS BALANCING....

The game's scheduled full release is september and there's only 2 months between then and now so its safe to assume a weapons balancing pass will be coming soon. I actually expect it in the next patch if not then the very next patch after that.

[Sephlock]

Sable, on 19 June 2013 - 08:01 AM, said:

Get so tired of saying this... the machine gun IS NOT supposed to be a primary weapon. Its always been something to shoot while your other weapon systems are cooling down.

The large pulse laser change was to give pulse lasers common characteristics in PREPARATION FOR FUTURE WEAPONS BALANCING....

The game's scheduled full release is september and there's only 2 months between then and now so its safe to assume a weapons balancing pass will be coming soon. I actually expect it in the next patch if not then the very next patch after that.

From beginning to end (although it got funnier and funnier towards the end) LOOOOOL!

[stjobe]

Sable, on 19 June 2013 - 08:01 AM, said:

Get so tired of saying this... the machine gun IS NOT supposed to be a primary weapon. Its always been something to shoot while your other weapon systems are cooling down.

Perhaps you get tired because it's wrong?

There are no "primary" weapons in BattleTech. A weapon that is tertiary in one load-out may be primary in another.

Many IS light 'mechs have loadouts with a single light-weight energy or missile weapons, and a couple of MGs. The Piranha (crazy and broken as the build is) has twelve MGs as primary armament.

[Mudhutwarrior]

Why buy anything over a few million dollars now? Assults are completley vunerable to spiders with flamers and MG so cheap simple stupid is the way to go. Of course this make no damn sense in any reality and removes any incentive to invest in expensive mechs. PGI is killing the game by trying to balance lights and assults and giving team play every advantage over single players. They do nothing to curb the countless exploit warriors on the server either. Teams openly discuss their synch drops in chat and exploit pilots like ac-2 yeagers can dominate with abandon. Meanwhile I have gone through five people I have got to join after they were smeared over and over by kill teams in a couple of minutes. Aparently they were all smart enough not to get caught in the investment trap buying crap that that cant help and were smart enough not to grind for eons whle kill teams make huge xp at their expense. Game is screwed top to bottom now and features ain't going to fix it.

[stjobe]

Mudhutwarrior, on 19 June 2013 - 08:12 AM, said:

Why buy anything over a few million dollars now? Assults are completley vunerable to spiders with flamers and MG so cheap simple stupid is the way to go. Of course this make no damn sense in any reality and removes any incentive to invest in expensive mechs.

You must be playing a very different game than I am. I've been a dedicated light/medium pilot for almost a year now, and lights have *never* been more fragile than they are at the moment, nor has there ever been less incentive to actually drop in one. The whole game is geared towards rewarding the things heavies and assaults are good at, and almost completely neglects the things lights are supposed to be good at.

If you get killed by a light - especially a "Spider with flamer and MG" - when in an assault, it's because the light pilot is way, way better than you are. You hold every trump card in that match-up, and if you lose it, it's not because of anything the devs did.

[Tickdoff Tank]

Livewyr, on 19 June 2013 - 05:45 AM, said:

MGs weigh half a ton and have like no cooldown or heat.. what exactly do you guys want?

For the MG to do about the same damage as a SL. NOTE: That does NOT mean the same DPS. Right now the MG has the same DPS as a SL, but the way that damage is delivered makes all the difference in the world. With the current MG mechanics the MG needs to be at about 1.4 DPS (might need to be higher, even up to 2.0 but that sounds a little excessive even to me).