35 replies to this topic

[Tennex]

Thontor, on 19 June 2013 - 05:27 PM, said:

the underlined can make a big difference in regards to mass. and as i said earlier, if a Stalker was shrunk so it weight 65 tons, it's dimensions would still be 91.45% of what they are at 85 tons.

and here's an image with transparent overlay for you



the Catapult is slightly larger in some areas, but the Stalker is much larger in others.

there is a lot of mass in those fat legs, big "butt" and extended "nose"

keep in mind, according to the devs, the Catapult's "ears" are mostly empty space.

in those areas, the Catapult isn't even close to 91.45% of the Stalker's dimensions, which is what the expected difference would be for the dimensions of equally proportioned objects of 85 and 65 tons.

i did some calculations with photoshop's histogram window, which shows the number of pixels selected by magic wand.

This isn't an exact measurement of volume by any means. but its the best we got.

The catapult actually occupies more volume than the stalker.


These tests can be repeated. But don't use the images Adridos gives because theres some weird pixle/aspect ratio stuff going on with those.

Edited by Tennex, 19 June 2013 - 06:27 PM.

[Tennex]

Thontor, on 19 June 2013 - 06:04 PM, said:

I'm not convinced. Measuring a complex 3d shape is not as simple as measuring how many pixels are in the top front and side silhouettes.

Is there a way to slice the models up into equal thickness slices and then measure the area of each slice? If so, then multiply that area of each slice by the thickness of each slice then add those volumes together...

i mean its the closest thing we got right now. With the catapult actually larger than the stalker using this method. I doubt the actual volume will show that the stalker is bigger than the catapult by any great amount.


there are ways to get readings from game files and models. but those methods don't work well either because there are many random holes and spaces within the models and between joints.

Edited by Tennex, 19 June 2013 - 07:18 PM.

[Tennex]

plus its a great deal more scientific than just going by how one looks a bit more fat here and the other is a bit taller there etc etc.

Edited by Tennex, 19 June 2013 - 07:18 PM.

[Bishop Steiner]

Thontor, on 19 June 2013 - 06:04 PM, said:

I'm not convinced. Measuring a complex 3d shape is not as simple as measuring how many pixels are in the top front and side silhouettes.

Is there a way to slice the models up into equal thickness slices and then measure the area of each slice? If so, then multiply that area of each slice by the thickness of each slice then add those volumes together...

the Dev's say that the ears, weighing between 7-10 tons each before ammo, are mostly empty space? Priceless. And nonsensical. At best it means Catapult pilots are penalized with the worst cockpit hitbox, AND ears that are far bigger targets than needed, but also house their primary armament?

So basically, even if they got the scale right (and sorry, like you on mine or Tennex argument, I am not convinced) they totally screwed the design from gameplay aspects.?

[Johnny Reb]

My biggest complaint with the QuickDraw is the torso twist, basic helps and when I get it to elite with 2x twist should, hopefully, fix that.

Edited by Johnny Reb, 19 June 2013 - 09:07 PM.

[KrazedOmega]

omegaorgun, on 19 June 2013 - 04:10 PM, said:

I think it is a sluggish piece of excrement, that is beaten hands down by a hunchback as with a hunchie u can get same speed standard engine similar firepower, and actually feel like you are in a mech not a canal boat chugging away down the waterway.
I was expecting a dynamic moving heavy even the dragon is better than this way more fun.

You're comparing a medium mech to a heavy. They hardly are the same speed with stock engines.

Hunchback 4SP: Stock engine 200 - Speed 64.8 kph. Max engine 260 - Speed 84.2 kph.
Quickdraw 4H: Stock engine 300 - Speed 81 kph. Max engine 360 - Speed 97.2 kph.

Try looking up some facts before spouting nonsense.

The Quickdraw is just as fast and maneuverable as a Dragon even more so with the jump jets. They even use the same max engine size.

[VikingN1nja]

I thought this was about a quickdraw? can you open a new post for the stalker and catapult!

[VikingN1nja]

KrazedOmega, on 19 June 2013 - 09:03 PM, said:

You're comparing a medium mech to a heavy. They hardly are the same speed with stock engines.

Hunchback 4SP: Stock engine 200 - Speed 64.8 kph. Max engine 260 - Speed 84.2 kph.
Quickdraw 4H: Stock engine 300 - Speed 81 kph. Max engine 360 - Speed 97.2 kph.

Try looking up some facts before spouting nonsense.

The Quickdraw is just as fast and maneuverable as a Dragon even more so with the jump jets. They even use the same max engine size.

I'm not talking about stock, a hunch with 250 does 90, its firepower is between 30 & 40 and moves better! with maximum armor. To have a decent arsenal in the QKD you can't really put largest engine in 300-330 maybe and armor will be reduced from full to 350-370.
I'm just saying if you want a heavy killer beside an atlas jager/cataphhract. If you want a medium that can help lights centurion/hunchie are fast enough and more durable than the quickdraw with better hardpoints.

It's really how the WITHDRAW moves is my gripe so sluggish to maneuver my assaults have more feedback and handle better.

Edited by omegaorgun, 20 June 2013 - 04:11 AM.

[MuonNeutrino]

KrazedOmega, on 19 June 2013 - 09:03 PM, said:

You're comparing a medium mech to a heavy. They hardly are the same speed with stock engines.

Um, pretty sure he wasn't referring to the stock engine - "you can *get* the same speed standard engine". And it's true, sadly enough. A hunchback with a 250 standard (81 kph), endo, and 320 points of armor (near-max) has 19 tons left for other stuff, while a quickdraw with a 300 standard (81 kph), endo, and 384 points of armor (near-max) has 20 tons left. The only major advantage you're really getting is the option to get some (really heavy) jets

Edited by MuonNeutrino, 20 June 2013 - 04:18 AM.

[VikingN1nja]

True that I'm gonna stick it out and elite it see what happens, I remember I hated the highlander & It is now one of my favorite mechs.

Edited by omegaorgun, 20 June 2013 - 04:53 AM.

[Tennex]

Thontor, on 19 June 2013 - 06:04 PM, said:

I'm not convinced. Measuring a complex 3d shape is not as simple as measuring how many pixels are in the top front and side silhouettes.

Is there a way to slice the models up into equal thickness slices and then measure the area of each slice? If so, then multiply that area of each slice by the thickness of each slice then add those volumes together...

even if you don't agree with the estimated volume. i think we can all appreciate that the catapult has a larger area from the front. As well as from the top. and is only slightly smaller than the stalker from the side.

just by looking at these images and how many pixels are in them.

Edited by Tennex, 20 June 2013 - 05:25 AM.

[Violent Tendencies]

I haven't bought a QD yet, but have been very surprised by the lack of QDs in matches so far. Is it me or does adoption seem to be very low compared to the last couple new mechs?

[Karazyr]

im piloting a 5k variant atm, likeing it quite abit, i have 2 LL and 2 ML in the torso, and 2 spl on the arms....i had the tons and why not i like the sound they make

nothing will ever replace my spider though

[JackPoint]

Violent Tendencies, on 20 June 2013 - 05:53 AM, said:

I haven't bought a QD yet, but have been very surprised by the lack of QDs in matches so far. Is it me or does adoption seem to be very low compared to the last couple new mechs?

Probably because of the Blackjack, a lot of players didn't like it and the quickdraw is its big brother from another mother. The QD is just another mech with low armour fat legs and weak overall performance.

"Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, shame on me"

[Angel of Annihilation]

I am rapidly finding my QD to be one of my most effective mechs. Last night I soloed a Altas and a Stalker just by being more manuverable and using JJs creatively. Also my damage is fairly consistantly in the 350-450 range per match which is good for me and comparable or better than all the mechs I have used excluding my Heavy Metal.

The QD isn't perfect, it is semi tall, has thick legs that draw alot of fire and is very hard to outfit since 60 tons is an inefficient weight to outfit a mech (heavy engine and heavy JJs leaving little room for weapons) but it gets the job done.

[Shae Starfyre]

Max Engine, Max Jump Jets, Max Armor, 4 ML, 3 Streaks, BAP, and XL Engine, makes for a nice strike and light determent mech; you have to manage heat though. I find that my side torso is the last to go, as well.

I find it to be nimble, torso twist is awesome with the high engines, and it can soak damage. Someone above said it, you will find your self in the high 20% to low 30% armor left at the end of the match.

I have had a lot of success with it when the team is working together. I have come to not fear any light or medium in it, and have even danced around some heavies.

I have been averaging 300-400 damage with, 1-2 kills and 3-7 assists. I purely pug, and the only times I see an issue, is when a well coordinated 4 man drops on the enemy side, or the other side has a good commander.

Aside from the size of the mech, I find it fun, and challenging to use; beats loading it with a bunch of PPC and standing there.