58 replies to this topic

[Petroshka]

Edited by Petroshka, 22 June 2013 - 01:56 PM.

[Hellen Wheels]

Must be tough to stomach that there have been how many Mechwarrior games prior to this effort?

Hmm, lets see...CHI, SNES, MW, MPBT/S/3025/, NetMech, MWIII, Pirates Moon, MW4, MechAssault i / ii, MechCommander I/II, I'm sure I've missed a few....

and this heap can't even come close to any of them? after 5mill+ has been dumped into it??

Its almost as if Eckman et al. have put their fingers in their ears and blindfolded themself, and sang LA LA LA all the way to the bank. In fact, I think that's exactly what they're doing.

[Raso]

i agree with the OP everything is fine as it is there is no reason why we should buff weapons no one uses because scrubs use them and scrums have low elo and shouldn't play the game because they suck so lets just leave the game the way it is and have only ppc and gauss be viable weapons and no one ever uses the lbx because it sucks and in competitive play you want that edge so you should learn to play and not use suck weapons because some weapons will just not be as good as other weapons and so you need to just get with the meta because if your elo is low than you should keep quiet in the corner and not say anything because at elo game play people only use certain builds because they are competitive because they give you that extra edge because those weapons are the best and we should not buff those other weapons because you are not supposed to use them because if every weapon was the same than this game would be like call of duty and mech warrior is a game where you think so people with low elo should stop making suggestions and just let the glorious high elo players dictate how everything should be and right now everything is perfect and so don't nerf ppc or gauss and remove jj shake and buff ecm because people always cry and complain in fact remove all weapons except the ppc and gauss and ac20 and ecm and remove all chassis variants that don't have ecm slots or room to boat ppc or ac20 so that players who suck at the game can learn to play right and stop using suck builds and then we can see who is leet and who is suck because my elo is very high and you just have to trust me but it is because i am so smart and good at the game and every one else who posts is wrong and stupid and does not know how to play the game because my elo is so high and yours is not

[Riptor]

Raso, on 22 June 2013 - 04:21 PM, said:

i agree with the OP everything is fine as it is there is no reason why we should buff weapons no one uses because scrubs use them and scrums have low elo and shouldn't play the game because they suck so lets just leave the game the way it is and have only ppc and gauss be viable weapons and no one ever uses the lbx because it sucks and in competitive play you want that edge so you should learn to play and not use suck weapons because some weapons will just not be as good as other weapons and so you need to just get with the meta because if your elo is low than you should keep quiet in the corner and not say anything because at elo game play people only use certain builds because they are competitive because they give you that extra edge because those weapons are the best and we should not buff those other weapons because you are not supposed to use them because if every weapon was the same than this game would be like call of duty and mech warrior is a game where you think so people with low elo should stop making suggestions and just let the glorious high elo players dictate how everything should be and right now everything is perfect and so don't nerf ppc or gauss and remove jj shake and buff ecm because people always cry and complain in fact remove all weapons except the ppc and gauss and ac20 and ecm and remove all chassis variants that don't have ecm slots or room to boat ppc or ac20 so that players who suck at the game can learn to play right and stop using suck builds and then we can see who is leet and who is suck because my elo is very high and you just have to trust me but it is because i am so smart and good at the game and every one else who posts is wrong and stupid and does not know how to play the game because my elo is so high and yours is not

The sarcasm is strong in this one...

[Gaan Cathal]

Riptor, on 22 June 2013 - 04:33 PM, said:

The sarcasm is strong in this one...

I need more like buttons.

[Sephlock]

Hellen Wheels, on 22 June 2013 - 04:06 PM, said:

Must be tough to stomach that there have been how many Mechwarrior games prior to this effort?

Hmm, lets see...CHI, SNES, MW, MPBT/S/3025/, NetMech, MWIII, Pirates Moon, MW4, MechAssault i / ii, MechCommander I/II, I'm sure I've missed a few....

and this heap can't even come close to any of them? after 5mill+ has been dumped into it??

Its almost as if Eckman et al. have put their fingers in their ears and blindfolded themself, and sang LA LA LA all the way to the bank. In fact, I think that's exactly what they're doing.

But its the 19th best shooter of all time!

In any event, he's got a point about the whiners- the LRM whiners got LRMs nerfed, they're getting SSRMs nerfed, ditto for seismic...

[TOGSolid]

Pater Mors, on 22 June 2013 - 12:50 PM, said:

My fiancee nearly broke up with me when BF3 came out... I don't know what we're going to do when BF4 arrives... Maybe I can get her into Commander Mode.

"Ok honey, we're playing Battlefield 4, you can be the commander this time. The safe word is Tango Down."


Koreanease is correct that the majority of whiners are FOTM scrubs that don't know **** about **** and if they're the vocal majority then even more problems will arise if PGI listens to them. Yes, most of them need to shut the **** up and go learn to play instead of being a pathetic forum warrior. However, there are smart guys around here who basically have no choice but to be forum warriors just in the vain attempt to drown out the derpy ******* and hope that PGI finally listens to them and unfucks certain aspects of the game.

It's a vicious circle really. The smart guys have to yell louder which causes the dipshits that don't know anything to collectively yell louder as well.

EDIT:

Quote

ditto for seismic.

If you honestly think Seismic isn't overpowered then you are definitely part of the problem around here.

Edited by TOGSolid, 22 June 2013 - 05:06 PM.

[Nicholas Carlyle]

Sephlock, on 22 June 2013 - 04:51 PM, said:

But its the 19th best shooter of all time!

In any event, he's got a point about the whiners- the LRM whiners got LRMs nerfed, they're getting SSRMs nerfed, ditto for seismic...

While I hate whiners, which there a lot. If the players had that much pull on the game, 3PV wouldn't be coming and ECM never would've come in how they did.

Splash damage in a sense was bugged, so yes LRM's and SRM's needed to be looked at. The problem is, PGI fudged it up. And not just a little. A lot.

LRM's are still broken in about 5 separate ways, SRM's are borderline useless, etc.

The onus to fix things and balance weapon is not on the players. If we whine about MG's sucking, and PGI buffs them to be overpowered, that's not our fault.

If we whine about PPC's being overpowered and PGIs nerfs them too much, once again not our fault.

If we whine about something that is fine, PGI should be coming in and saying "Hey, listen, here is our data showing you guys are wrong, we aren't changing it".

But PGI is ALWAYS at fault, not the players. It's their communication issues and bad decision making messing this game up.

Edited by Nicholas Carlyle, 22 June 2013 - 05:32 PM.

[Stoicblitzer]

Nicholas Carlyle, on 22 June 2013 - 05:31 PM, said:

While I hate whiners, which there a lot. If the players had that much pull on the game, 3PV wouldn't be coming and ECM never would've come in how they did.

Splash damage in a sense was bugged, so yes LRM's and SRM's needed to be looked at. The problem is, PGI fudged it up. And not just a little. A lot.

LRM's are still broken in about 5 separate ways, SRM's are borderline useless, etc.

The onus to fix things and balance weapon is not on the players. If we whine about MG's sucking, and PGI buffs them to be overpowered, that's not our fault.

If we whine about PPC's being overpowered and PGIs nerfs them too much, once again not our fault.

If we whine about something that is fine, PGI should be coming in and saying "Hey, listen, here is our data showing you guys are wrong, we aren't changing it".

But PGI is ALWAYS at fault, not the players. It's their communication issues and bad decision making messing this game up.

and you used the word onus.

[Nicholas Carlyle]

Stoicblitzer, on 22 June 2013 - 05:38 PM, said:

and you used the word onus.

Switch the O with an A and that's how I feel about PGI right now.

[Maxx Blue]

Meh, go play non-stompy-robot-game 4 or whatever. My elo is so terrible I never ran into you in game anyway. Imma go pug some more and watch my teammates run, full speed, out of bounds and kill themselves. Weapon balance doesn't matter when your aim is terrible as mine anyway so as long as I don't get one-shot all the time I'm happy!

[Nicholas Carlyle]

I'm really not much of a shooter fan. I played the original BF1942 or whatever it was. And the last FPS (non Mechwarrior) I played was Borderlands 1 and 2.

I don't play Mechwarrior because it's a shooter. I play it because it's Mechwarrior. Which is why I'm sad.

[Duncan Fisher]

Koreanese, on 22 June 2013 - 12:06 PM, said:

Before bf4 comes out and I loose interest in this ******** community, ill say what needs to be said.

Look at all these posts about game balaces. Buff this, nerf that. This is fine etc. This is perfectly fine, except majority of people complaining are not competant players. Lets just face it. There are people better then you. Yes, he just shot you down with X. What do people do? "Omg X is op!" Along with very well thought and written essay. Then comes along with "l2p nub" and debating essays how I am right and you are wrong. Then pgi decides to listen these fools and make the game even more ******** then it already is. From what I see, this seem to happen throughout the entire time I played the game. Solution? Just stop complaining on the foru ms with your scholar like debates. Play the game, get better, and move your way up.

So thats pretty much it. You can flame me all you like. I have nothing to loose

O yes, only reason why I visit this forum is becaus...... well its funny to read all the stupidity. Pure comedy

While I'm sure a lot of the complaints are unfounded, the issue isn't just that bad players are being consistently beaten down by good players. It's that good players who don't conform to high-alpha pinpoint builds and PPC-peekaboo are consistently being beaten down by equally good players who do take those builds.

I suppose plenty of people must thoroughly enjoy playing PPC-peekaboo warrior Online, but I think those who complain do not, and many people are simply not having fun with the current state of the game, where even the heaviest armored mechs are quickly brought down by a few hits if they do not wait patiently in cover for minutes on end. Yes I'm sure there are also plenty of war heros out there who can revel me with stories of how their superior skill and tactics allowed their team of laser-srm brawlers to conquer a team of 8 PPC boats, but despite what they might think, this only happens when the PPC boats truly mess up, or are just incompetent to begin with, and once you hit the relatively low point where the skill curve begins to flatten out, you either pick up the PPC/gauss/AC20, or get killed by the equally-skilled (or sometimes even less skilled) pilots who do.


TLDR: Video games are generally (believe it or not!) meant to be fun, and no amount of "getting better and moving your way up" can turn PPC peekaboo into a fun experience.

[Blackadder]

Inhibition, on 22 June 2013 - 01:21 PM, said:

I agree with Koreanese.

We see ppc's on all classes of mechs. We also see medium lasers and lrm's on all classes of mechs.
So medium lasers and lrm's are a problem because they are on all classes of mechs?

There will always be a superior weapon and there will always be an inferior weapon.
People will tend to use the superior weapon.

its up to the developer to come up with a system that avoids the superior weapon and inferior weapon issues, or at least offer enough alternatives to create variety in the game. while its impossible to create perfect game balance, and it should never exist because they means everyone is identical, they should strive to create enough diversity through having weapons systems be different but equal within the respective confines of what they are designed to do.

PGI seems to be stuck though, they seem to be unwilling to change certain aspects of the weapons and mechs they copied from tabletop, while throwing out or completely ignoring other aspects at random. while i agree with you and koreanese that the individual nerf this buff that , posts really do nothing for the overall health of the game the fact remains that PGI has never been able to obtain something stable for long periods of time, and the game would be in a much better place if they could do that, rather then making short sighted fixes or quick fixes to things like jumpjets, or reblancing pulse lasers in a way that makes minimal sense, while stating we will look at them again later for more balancing.

[LordBraxton]

Koreanese, on 22 June 2013 - 12:06 PM, said:

Before bf4 comes out and I loose interest in this ******** community, ill say what needs to be said.

Look at all these posts about game balaces. Buff this, nerf that. This is fine etc. This is perfectly fine, except majority of people complaining are not competant players. Lets just face it. There are people better then you. Yes, he just shot you down with X. What do people do? "Omg X is op!" Along with very well thought and written essay. Then comes along with "l2p nub" and debating essays how I am right and you are wrong. Then pgi decides to listen these fools and make the game even more ******** then it already is. From what I see, this seem to happen throughout the entire time I played the game. Solution? Just stop complaining on the foru ms with your scholar like debates. Play the game, get better, and move your way up.

So thats pretty much it. You can flame me all you like. I have nothing to loose

O yes, only reason why I visit this forum is becaus...... well its funny to read all the stupidity. Pure comedy

man I have played with you on TS before, and this just does not sound like the same person

honestly they really haven't listened to the community enough for the debates on here to have any real effect

and also... the balance has gotten worse progressively, this I can agree with

but people have been clamoring for changes such as

PPC nerf
SRM buff
Pulse buff
LBX buff


etc

for ages, and PGI does NOTHING... they even NERFED LPLs

clearly forum discussion effects development less than you think

otherwise 3PV would not be on the way, and PPCs would have been bumped to 10 heat ages ago

Nicholas Carlyle, on 22 June 2013 - 05:31 PM, said:

While I hate whiners, which there a lot. If the players had that much pull on the game, 3PV wouldn't be coming and ECM never would've come in how they did.

Splash damage in a sense was bugged, so yes LRM's and SRM's needed to be looked at. The problem is, PGI fudged it up. And not just a little. A lot.

LRM's are still broken in about 5 separate ways, SRM's are borderline useless, etc.

The onus to fix things and balance weapon is not on the players. If we whine about MG's sucking, and PGI buffs them to be overpowered, that's not our fault.

If we whine about PPC's being overpowered and PGIs nerfs them too much, once again not our fault.

If we whine about something that is fine, PGI should be coming in and saying "Hey, listen, here is our data showing you guys are wrong, we aren't changing it".

But PGI is ALWAYS at fault, not the players. It's their communication issues and bad decision making messing this game up.

this
thisthisthisthis

THISTHIS

THIIIISSSSSS^^^^

Edited by LordBraxton, 22 June 2013 - 08:20 PM.

[InRev]

Raso, on 22 June 2013 - 04:21 PM, said:

i agree with the OP everything is fine as it is there is no reason why we should buff weapons no one uses because scrubs use them and scrums have low elo and shouldn't play the game because they suck so lets just leave the game the way it is and have only ppc and gauss be viable weapons and no one ever uses the lbx because it sucks and in competitive play you want that edge so you should learn to play and not use suck weapons because some weapons will just not be as good as other weapons and so you need to just get with the meta because if your elo is low than you should keep quiet in the corner and not say anything because at elo game play people only use certain builds because they are competitive because they give you that extra edge because those weapons are the best and we should not buff those other weapons because you are not supposed to use them because if every weapon was the same than this game would be like call of duty and mech warrior is a game where you think so people with low elo should stop making suggestions and just let the glorious high elo players dictate how everything should be and right now everything is perfect and so don't nerf ppc or gauss and remove jj shake and buff ecm because people always cry and complain in fact remove all weapons except the ppc and gauss and ac20 and ecm and remove all chassis variants that don't have ecm slots or room to boat ppc or ac20 so that players who suck at the game can learn to play right and stop using suck builds and then we can see who is leet and who is suck because my elo is very high and you just have to trust me but it is because i am so smart and good at the game and every one else who posts is wrong and stupid and does not know how to play the game because my elo is so high and yours is not

GOOOOLAAAAAAZOOOO!

PS: Paging public Elo crowd . . .

[Dagada]

MustrumRidcully, on 22 June 2013 - 01:11 PM, said:

I am waiting for Shadowrun Returns.

dont have long to wait, comes out tuesday unless something crazy happens.

hope it's good myself

[PEEFsmash]

InRev, on 22 June 2013 - 08:26 PM, said:

PS: Paging public Elo crowd . . .

*ring ring*

Yes?

*mumblemumble*

Have you learned to aim yet? Have you learned to position yourself properly?

*mum...............ble.......*

Do that first before you say what is balanced and what isn't. Your perceived balance problems are usually problems with your own play. *click*

PS: Top competitive players DO think that PPCs/sniping is overpowered, and brawling is underpowered. We just have different (and better) solutions than randomizing convergence via CoF or implementing awkward and arbitrary boating penalties.

Edited by PEEFsmash, 22 June 2013 - 08:34 PM.

[Raso]

PEEFsmash, on 22 June 2013 - 08:33 PM, said:

*ring ring*

Yes?

*mumblemumble*

Have you learned to aim yet? Have you learned to position yourself properly?

*mum.....ble.......*

Do that first before you say what is balanced and what isn't. Your perceived balance problems are usually problems with your own play. *click*

PS: Top competitive players DO think that PPCs/sniping is overpowered, and brawling is underpowered. We just have different (and better) solutions than randomizing convergence via CoF or implementing awkward and arbitrary boating penalties.

Ah! The true mark of a high Elo player! Assuming you suck horribly at the game before sort of admitting that the game is unbalanced. That's how you can tell the top tiers from the lower tiers, you see. Lower tiers are just all like "This is my well thought idea on how to make things better" while top tier players are all like "You probably suck at the game. Your ideas are wrong so learn to play before you comment on things. I probably have a higher Elo than you so my idea has more merit than yours."

Behold, the gods walk among us!

Edited by Raso, 22 June 2013 - 08:40 PM.

[Gaan Cathal]

Raso, on 22 June 2013 - 08:37 PM, said:

That's how you can tell the top tiers from the lower tiers, you see. Lower tiers are just all like "This is my well thought idea on how to make things better" while top tier players are all like "You probably suck at the game. Your ideas are wrong so learn to play before you comment on things. I probably have a higher Elo than you so my idea has more merit than yours."

So...much...********...

Plenty of the well thought out ideas come from good players, and there are too many "WHAAA YOUS MUST MAKE DER TING DO LIKE DER ODER TING IN DA TING ANDS IT WULL BE FINE" threads kicking about for anyone to take the proposition that lower tier players are in a kind of universal game design nirvana.