21 replies to this topic

[Tor Gungnir]

Everyone one just pelts their opponents to death with Missiles. I can't seem to counter it, I am dead well before I can close even half the distance to use my lasers and whatnot....

[Unnatural Growth]

You need to implement counter measures. Use AMS. Stand near other mechs on your team that also use AMS. Multiple AMS systems can work together to give a better umbrella of protection. Stay out of the open when moving to engage enemy so they can't get a lock on you. Don't just stand there. Take cover behind buildings, rock piles, hills. Shut down your mech for a minute once you duck out of sight to break the missile lock. Keep moving, the faster, the better.

Get the snipers on your team to engage the enemy missile boats at long range. Get your light mechs to run around to their backside and harass them and break their concentration. If you're being TAGged, get out of their line of sight. Or send some LRM's or PPC's back their way.

[Tor Gungnir]

But there are no other people with ASM; only Missile-users on either side.

[Liquid Leopard]

When missiles got buffed with the May 21st patch, everyone brought out missile boats for a while, but then most people got bored with them in a matter of hours. I haven't seen missile boats on that scale since then. What you're describing is probably temporary. If it's specific to a certain Elo bracket, you can keep working your way up, and it still amounts to a temporary situation.

Regardless, unless you're in a trial mech, you should be able to put AMS on your mech. The weapon & ammo are well worth the 1.5 tons of weight.
If you're using LRMs you want to fire 15 or more at a time, in case the enemy has AMS...and they probably do.

There are a few maps where LRMs aren't so great. Frozen city has a lot of buildings to use for cover. Alpine Peaks has large fields where the LRMs 1000m range starts to look short, and you're at a disadvantage if you don't have ER-PPCs or a Gauss rifle.

Edited by Liquid Leopard, 25 June 2013 - 06:52 PM.

[Aym]

I think this is an ELO banding issue because I don't often see that many missile boats. There's usually one or two around but with cover they're not very effective.

[Mazzyplz]

i think they are on the rise a bit once again.

but if you say theres people with long range missiles on your team then slap a tag on your build and go to town, and also if life gives you lemons, make lemonade.. or just learn to avoid the missiles

[Tor Gungnir]

I'm in Trial Mechs currently, unfortunately.

[LordBraxton]

Tor Gungnir, on 25 June 2013 - 07:08 PM, said:

I'm in Trial Mechs currently, unfortunately.

this is your problem

really you have to get used to each different chassis separately

once you have an idea of the mech's size, it is a lot easier to use cover

right now LRMs come down at a very high arc, your best defense is to never be caught in the open, ever...

even if you get to cover, if you dont break lock within a couple seconds of the missile launch they will track you behind half the cover in the game

so low Elo missile spam will teach you good habits

even though you are in a giant robot, cover is just as important in this game as a game of battlefield etc

[Mazzyplz]

yeah sorry to tell u its your own fault for being running trials; but every cadet must go through cadet hell before having a good chance at the game, idk why! don't look at me, i didn't make the game

[TheAtomiser]

Use ams. stick with other people using ams. stay in cover and avoid open spaces. snipe and harras boats. problem solved.

[Koniving]

Tor Gungnir, on 25 June 2013 - 07:08 PM, said:

I'm in Trial Mechs currently, unfortunately.

It's a good song to play any time you get into a match like this one.

Like Gauss/PPC and AC/20 mechs, you want to take out LRMs fast and early. The moment you identify an enemy LRM boat you should be working on a way to sneak up on it and kill it within its minimum range.

Once you do they can be this helpless -- a shortened version of going for 6 minutes begging for help from my team on both voice and in text only to be ignored.


Or this poor mech, who I circled around 3 times, spun in front of and then danced in front of two different times before minimizing the game, opening fraps, pulling the game back up, dancing, and finally finishing him.


Once you're inside an LRM boat's minimum range they are virtually helpless.

[Aym]

Koniving, on 25 June 2013 - 08:53 PM, said:

"Words and moving pictures"

TL;DR

[Koniving]

Aym, on 25 June 2013 - 09:21 PM, said:

TL;DR

Might be the shortest post I ever wrote.

Edited by Koniving, 25 June 2013 - 09:50 PM.

[RLBell]

Bad as LRM's are now, they used to be much worse. Look for Mack's videos on his missile boats from last year, before ECM, while LRM's did 1.7 points of damage each. He crows about doing over a thousand points of damage in a match. Missiles are a high risk/ high return weapon system. When they work, they work big. When they fail, they epic fail. I have fired ten tons (1800 missiles), and still done less than 300pts of damage (River City is a bad place to boat missiles). As a pug, do not load up on LRM's if you cannot kill a light mech with your other weapons. Between ECM and mutual AMS support, you can negate LRM fire. Look for cover. If LRM's are arcing towards you break line of sight with the spotter and try to run perpendicularly to the missile flight path to maximise separation. Canyon Network is bad for taking hits from LRM's, but you must still be spotted, so focus fire on spotters. UAV's do show up as enemy targets, so terminate them with extreme prejudice.

The converse is also true. Just as mutual support reduces the effectiveness of missile boats, mutual support can enhance them. If a team mate has typed into chat 'have LRM's, please mark your targets', try to keep your targeting brackets around enemies with the arrows indicating inbound missiles. If you have voice chat, say if you found a target in the open and report if the missiles are hitting it.

Edited by RLBell, 25 June 2013 - 10:00 PM.

[scJazz]

Koniving, on 25 June 2013 - 09:50 PM, said:

Might be the shortest post I ever wrote.

No that was

Although the dance in front of the LRM Atlas before killing him always brings a smile to my face.

Edited by scJazz, 26 June 2013 - 04:52 AM.

[PPO Kuro]

Look at the reactions of:
OldOrgandonor
TheAtomiser
Koniving

That's what you can do against LRM. Not much more there is too it. Well maybe counter LRM, but then you need someone to spot. And when it's raining LRM most ppl don't want to risk that

[Dalziel Hasek Davion]

Movement and positioning are, alongside AMS, ECM and closing to inside minimum range, crucial to countering LRMs. Some maps (River city particularly) have arches, tunnels, bridges that you can shelter under. Others (Tourmaline) have tall cover you can shelter behind.

The first job is to break target lock. LRMs can only lock you if you are being targeted by an enemy 'Mech. If the enemy team has loads of LRM 'Mechs, then staying out of sight of all enemy 'Mechs is a good start. If you do move out of cover, make sure you look at where you are going, spot the cover you will be making use of to break the target lock, and make your way directly there. When you have broken lock - don't stand still - the missiles will continue to fly in a straight line and will still hit you if you don't turn and move away. Lateral movement away from the line of fire is required - like avoiding a tree falling on you - don't walk straight backwards.

Stick close to allied 'Mechs with ECM. That can help prevent enemies locking you. That cover can be negated by enemies using TAG - so watch out for little red laser beams playing over you.

If you can do so without becoming isolated - or lacking an escape plan, work out a path to get to the enemy missile boat without being seen. Your aim is to get inside 180m and stay there as you take it apart.

Fast 'Mechs can use their speed to missiles to a degree, but this is harder and still relies as much on breaking lock as it does out-running missiles. Light pilots need to plot their runs to interpose cover between them and the firing 'Mech. The Light 'Mechs job can also be LRM boat hunting. A small squad of lights can bypass the enemy firing line, disable the LRM boat and escape, particularly on the bigger maps.

LRMs are useless outside of 1,000m as well.

[Ragnar Darkmane]

Koniving, on 25 June 2013 - 08:53 PM, said:

"Words and moving pictures"

That's why any somewhat capable player runs back-up weapons on his LRM boat, even if it's just a couple of Small or Medium Lasers. Seriously, if your mech becomes useless within 180m (or when your ammo runs out) you are just dead weight for your team.

[Koniving]

Ragnar Darkmane, on 26 June 2013 - 08:17 AM, said:

That's why any somewhat capable player runs back-up weapons on his LRM boat, even if it's just a couple of Small or Medium Lasers. Seriously, if your mech becomes useless within 180m (or when your ammo runs out) you are just dead weight for your team.

If you're playing by yourself, yes. We just got out of several 8-man matches where we had excellent teamwork. If I called for help mechs would be sent back to assist me, as my sole job was to rain death on every enemy I saw. Then we went out in a 4 man and I was expecting the same teamwork, and I spent 6 minutes calling for help (I had 1 rear armor so maxed front armor, so long as I looked at him I lasted as long as I did).

Later on we redesigned it to practically two-shot Atlases less and spam more with 4 MPLs as backup.

The actual point of the video, though, is to point out how helpless they are if you get close. Seen the Atlas? That was last month. One laser. Most boats don't have a decent point blank defense.

They have escorts. It's the core factor of teamwork.

Edited by Koniving, 26 June 2013 - 09:54 AM.

[Aym]

Koniving, on 26 June 2013 - 09:53 AM, said:

If you're playing by yourself, yes. We just got out of several 8-man matches where we had excellent teamwork. If I called for help mechs would be sent back to assist me, as my sole job was to rain death on every enemy I saw. Then we went out in a 4 man and I was expecting the same teamwork, and I spent 6 minutes calling for help (I had 1 rear armor so maxed front armor, so long as I looked at him I lasted as long as I did).

Later on we redesigned it to practically two-shot Atlases less and spam more with 4 MPLs as backup.

The actual point of the video, though, is to point out how helpless they are if you get close. Seen the Atlas? That was last month. One laser. Most boats don't have a decent point blank defense.

They have escorts. It's the core factor of teamwork.

He quotes MY quote of you, amazing!