21 replies to this topic

[Zordicron]

HansBlix WMD, on 03 July 2013 - 10:01 PM, said:

I'll tell you how hit detection works right now.

Bang, your dead.

Any questions?

You are only correct for PPC, gauss, AC20. The high dmg single source dmg weapons work all or nothing. Hitscan(lasers, MG) or multihit(missiles) also suffer hit detection issues, but because a laser has what, 10? Hits per shot, they will do some dmg every shot, but not all the dmg.

So we have an AC40 jager. And we have a mech with 4LL. AC40 is 40 dmg, 4 LL is 36. Lasers have:
better range
way less tonnage
no ammo
way less slot requirements
available on way more chassis then AC40
Better cooldown time

So then, why is the meta all about PPC, gauss, and AC40, when running 4 LL has a massive advantage in ease of use and loadout flexability? because, 40 dmg most of the time is better then doing 18(plus or minus a bit) all the time. When dmg doesnt register, you still get all the heat. When you expose yourself to fire that shot off, if only half the dmg is being done you have to do it twice as many times for the same effect. SRMS suck right? well if 1/3 of the missiles dont do anyrthing when they hit, they are going to suck. Sure, the AC40 or PPC's will also have a detectioin miss sometimes, and do zero dmg. Next shot will work fine.

Huge dmg most of the time is WAY better then mediocre dmg all the time. That is the current meta, because of hit detection errors.


LRM are in the boat too, when you can dump 60 LRM on a mech and only turn its armor yellow because half the missiles didnt detect, well, its going to be hard to give objective feedback isnt it. LRM60 is 66 dmg. It should core a lot of smaller mechs, or at least totally cripple them in one salvo. 2 Salvos is enough to make an Awesome go to red internals. BUT THAT ISNT WHATS HAPPENING. a percent of every salvo misses detection. This percent can be anything from 0-100%.
When detection is fixed, the forum is going to flood in a river of QQ about missiles.

When hit detection is fixed, the meta will change. Not until then, because of the reliability of dmg delivery of big dmg numbers from a single source like PPC and AC20 vs unreliable delivery by missiles and lasers.

Fix the HSR netcode, fix the wonky packetloss issue within the HSR netcode, fix the hit detection. Then start over on weapon balance when it all suddenly changes.

[HansBlix WMD]

Eldagore, on 04 July 2013 - 09:04 AM, said:

You are only correct for PPC, gauss, AC20. The high dmg single source dmg weapons work all or nothing. Hitscan(lasers, MG) or multihit(missiles) also suffer hit detection issues, but because a laser has what, 10? Hits per shot, they will do some dmg every shot, but not all the dmg.

So we have an AC40 jager. And we have a mech with 4LL. AC40 is 40 dmg, 4 LL is 36. Lasers have:
better range
way less tonnage
no ammo
way less slot requirements
available on way more chassis then AC40
Better cooldown time

So then, why is the meta all about PPC, gauss, and AC40, when running 4 LL has a massive advantage in ease of use and loadout flexability? because, 40 dmg most of the time is better then doing 18(plus or minus a bit) all the time. When dmg doesnt register, you still get all the heat. When you expose yourself to fire that shot off, if only half the dmg is being done you have to do it twice as many times for the same effect. SRMS suck right? well if 1/3 of the missiles dont do anyrthing when they hit, they are going to suck. Sure, the AC40 or PPC's will also have a detectioin miss sometimes, and do zero dmg. Next shot will work fine.

Huge dmg most of the time is WAY better then mediocre dmg all the time. That is the current meta, because of hit detection errors.


LRM are in the boat too, when you can dump 60 LRM on a mech and only turn its armor yellow because half the missiles didnt detect, well, its going to be hard to give objective feedback isnt it. LRM60 is 66 dmg. It should core a lot of smaller mechs, or at least totally cripple them in one salvo. 2 Salvos is enough to make an Awesome go to red internals. BUT THAT ISNT WHATS HAPPENING. a percent of every salvo misses detection. This percent can be anything from 0-100%.
When detection is fixed, the forum is going to flood in a river of QQ about missiles.

When hit detection is fixed, the meta will change. Not until then, because of the reliability of dmg delivery of big dmg numbers from a single source like PPC and AC20 vs unreliable delivery by missiles and lasers.

Fix the HSR netcode, fix the wonky packetloss issue within the HSR netcode, fix the hit detection. Then start over on weapon balance when it all suddenly changes.

The HSR being fixed is what caused the high alpha problem in the first place. 20-30% hit rate on large ballistics was transformed into ~100%.