8 replies to this topic

[Seefer]

I bought a Jenner JR7-K but wasn't impressed with the default heat dissipation. Adding 2 standard heatsinks didn't improve things much. In exploring the loadout items I saw the Heatsink menu in the Upgrade section. Selecting the double heatsink and dragging it to my mech seemed to improved the heat efficiency nicely, though it did cost approx 1.5 million CB. This is the only change I made to the mech.

I then tried to go into Testing Grounds to see how things improved, only to get the following message:

Not enough heatsinks. Additional required: 1

Why am I getting this problem? Also I've just discovered that double heatsinks are also available in the Equipment section for only 12k CB. Why are heatsinks available in two areas? Why is the double heatsink upgrade 1.5 million in one section and 12k in another. Where have I gone wrong here? I've looked at quite a few Mechlab video tutorials and they didn't include anything that would have allowed me to spot and avoid this error. VERY frustrating start to this game.

The last thing a free to play game needs is to ******* off a new player during the early stages with a MechLab system that allows you to make subtle, unintuitive mistakes that result in your mech being unuseable. There should be warnings messages displayed during a loadout session that, before you commit to buy, let you know you won't be able to launch your mech

The devs need to think of it this way: Wouldn't the mechanic in the mech shop be knowledgeable enough to point out problems with a mech pilots decisions about the loadout he wants to run? So, implement this inherent mechanics knowledge by making the MechLab help new players avoid mistakes like this.

Any help appreciated.

Edited by Seefer, 24 July 2013 - 04:56 PM.

[Kay Oss]

When you convert to double heatsinks, your mech is stripped of all equipped heatsinks and you have to re-install some. Be advised that double heatsinks take up 3 slots each (but weigh the same 1 ton while providing 1.4 times the cooling ability). Engines have internal heatsinks as well and those are converted to double as well (which is why people are almost exclusively using double heatsinks)

Each mech must have a minimum of 10 heatsinks. Engines come with some or all of those 10 included. For every 25 engine size, the engine comes with 1 internal heatsink. So a 100 engine has 4 internal heatsinks which means you will have to add at least 6 more heatsinks to be able to use that mech. A 250 engine comes with 10 so you do not need to add any more to be able to use the mech unless you want more.

Once you get up to the 275 size the engine will have an extra free slot that can hold a heatsink internally without using up more slots on your mech. A 300 gets 2 of these slots, a 325 gets 3, and so on. Even though double heatsinks would normally take 3 slots anywhere else on your mech, they still only take 1 internal slot on the engine.

Edited by Kay Oss, 24 July 2013 - 04:58 PM.

[Kay Oss]

It costs 1.5 million to convert your mech to be able to use double heatsinks... You still have to buy the heatsinks afterwards. (Not counting the internal ones that come with the engine)

[King Arthur IV]

double doesnt mean you have two heat sink, each double counts as one individual heatsink. all mechs must have 10 heat sinks to operate, you currently have a engine that has less then 10

use this link to help build future mechs, it will tell you everything from price, efficiency and operational or not.
http://mwo.smurfy-net.de/mechlab

Edited by King Arthur IV, 24 July 2013 - 05:03 PM.

[TheArcher]

Seefer, on 24 July 2013 - 04:45 PM, said:

I bought a Jenner JR7-K but wasn't impressed with the default heat dissipation. Adding 2 standard heatsinks didn't improve things much. In exploring the loadout items I saw the Heatsink menu in the Upgrade section. Selecting the double heatsink and dragging it to my mech seemed to improved the heat efficiency nicely, though it did cost approx 1.5 million CB. This is the only change I made to the mech.

I then tried to go into Testing Grounds to see how things improved, only to get the following message:

Not enough heatsinks. Additional required: 1

Why am I getting this problem? Also I've just discovered that double heatsinks are also available in the Equipment section for only 12k CB. Why are heatsinks available in two areas? Why is the double heatsink upgrade 1.5 million in one section and 12k in another. Where have I gone wrong here?

The Double Heatsinks option on the Upgrade tab is used to make your mech compatible with double heatsinks (DHS). Your mech will no longer be compatible with single heatsinks (SHS). The DHS in the Equipment tab are the heatsinks you can place on your mech in addition to the ones in the engine.

Seefer, on 24 July 2013 - 04:45 PM, said:

I've looked at quite a few Mechlab video tutorials and they didn't include anything that would have allowed me to spot and avoid this error. VERY frustrating start to this game.

The last thing a free to play game needs is to ******* off a new player during the early stages with a MechLab system that allows you to make subtle, unintuitive mistakes that result in your mech being unuseable. There should be warnings messages displayed during a loadout session that, before you commit to buy, let you know you won't be able to launch your mech

The devs need to think of it this way: Wouldn't the mechanic in the mech shop be knowledgeable enough to point out problems with a mech pilots decisions about the loadout he wants to run? So, implement this inherent mechanics knowledge by making the MechLab help new players avoid mistakes like this.

Any help appreciated.

This game is still in Beta, which usually means that both the game and its documentation are incomplete. If you only want to play completed games, you may want to pass for now and come back when the release has happened.

Edited by TheArcher, 24 July 2013 - 05:05 PM.

[Wintersdark]

All mechs require 10 heat sinks to enter a match. There is one included free in your engine for every 25 points of rating, so with a 250 engine you have 10 heat sinks included free.

The upgrade entry for Double Heat Sinks you purchased changes all the heat sinks on your mech to Doubles. The entry in the equipment section allows you to purchase additional heat sinks and equip them - the upgrade, which allows DHS use - is very expensive, but the sinks themselves are cheap.

What happened to you is that you have a 225-245 rated engine, which requires an additional heat sink outside your engine to meet the 10 heat sinks minimum. When you change from single heat sinks to double sinks, the game automatically removes any single heat sinks equipped (you can only use one or the other).

So, just buy a DHS from the tab and equip it on your mech, and all will be good.

This is unfortunately a limitation of the current mechlab. Fortunately, a full overhaul is in the works that will address these confusing points - you can read about it in the command chair section under "UI 2.0"

Finally, don't worry, you haven't screwed yourself or wasted money. DHS are about the single best upgrade you can make on almost any mech, and are never a bad choice.

[Seefer]

Thanks for all the replies. I have to ask though how all you fine people came about this knowledge about engine heatsinks because it's not entirely clear from the documentation and video guides I've seen so far. Are you all hardened BattleTech board game experts that know things like this from the rule books on which this MWO is inspired?

The devs really need to nail the quality and thoroughness of the game's documentation and any in-game tutorials they have planned. The effort will be worth it as the payoff will be capturing a larger portion of the less hardcore crowd who will be frustrated at poorly discoverable information like this.

Oh well, back to running with the trial mechs to get more CBs to sort my mess out

Edited by Seefer, 24 July 2013 - 05:38 PM.

[Seefer]

Wintersdark, on 24 July 2013 - 05:04 PM, said:

All mechs require 10 heat sinks to enter a match. There is one included free in your engine for every 25 points of rating, so with a 250 engine you have 10 heat sinks included free.

The upgrade entry for Double Heat Sinks you purchased changes all the heat sinks on your mech to Doubles. The entry in the equipment section allows you to purchase additional heat sinks and equip them - the upgrade, which allows DHS use - is very expensive, but the sinks themselves are cheap.

What happened to you is that you have a 225-245 rated engine, which requires an additional heat sink outside your engine to meet the 10 heat sinks minimum. When you change from single heat sinks to double sinks, the game automatically removes any single heat sinks equipped (you can only use one or the other).

So, just buy a DHS from the tab and equip it on your mech, and all will be good.

This is unfortunately a limitation of the current mechlab. Fortunately, a full overhaul is in the works that will address these confusing points - you can read about it in the command chair section under "UI 2.0"

Finally, don't worry, you haven't screwed yourself or wasted money. DHS are about the single best upgrade you can make on almost any mech, and are never a bad choice.

I figured DHS's were thew way to go when I was instantly annoyed at the heat efficiency I was seeing in Testing Grounds with the default loadout for the JR7-K. That's why I stripped off two jump jets to free up enough tonnage to add what I thought was one DHS. This hints at another possible feature for the devs to implement in the MechLab, the ability to test drive your loadout before commiting to spending the CBs for your chosen loadout. It's all very well looking at numbers in the equipment list but this is too abstract a way to determine the improvements of upgrades. We need to see the damn thing in action to get a better idea

Edited by Seefer, 24 July 2013 - 05:37 PM.

[King Arthur IV]

Seefer, on 24 July 2013 - 05:22 PM, said:

Thanks for all the replies. I have to ask though how all you fine people came about this knowledge about engine heatsinks because it's not entirely clear from the documentation and video guides I've seen so far. Are you all hardened BattleTech board game experts that know things like this from the rule books on which this MWO is inspired?

The devs really need to nail the quality and thoroughness of the game's documentation and any in-game tutorials they have planned. The effort will be worth it as the payoff will be capturing a larger portion of the less hardcore crowd who will be frustrated at poorly discoverable information like this.

Oh well, back to running with the trial mechs to get more CBs to sort my mess out

i was lost like you for a long time. the only reason i found anything out was because of my love for big stompy robots. if not for that persistence i would of left this **** *** game along time ago. understanding crit slots and minimum heat sinks and heat blah blah blah blah was such a chore. if your looking for some good help, join a team speak server and ask people or join a mercorp (clan) loads of friendly people willing to show you the ropes.