26 replies to this topic

[Erghiez06]

I'm sure this is a dead-horse topic, but of the 3 Catapult variants here, which would be the most effective and least painful to operate.

I should note that at the moment I have a K2 with all of my basic skills unlocked and around 90k in skill xp. I plan to work down the mastery trees, but would very much like to do it as painlessly as possible.

I like specialized roles so I tend to find myself gravitating toward the A1 despite its hate. There is just something about cheesing with a full rack of srm6's that I cant seem to do with my K2.

Anyway, as always, opinions and suggestions do matter as they are very much appreciated. I am a noob so go easy =D

[Lynx7725]

K2 is a specialist amongst the Cats, being a direct fire platform.

A1 is a flexible platform, and is my current go-to Cat. I don't run Splat or Streak Cats though; I run LRM15x2 and Streaksx4 with Artemis and BAP support. Tune to your personal preference and it's a very strong build, flexible across multiple range bands, and not as vulnerable to lights as some missile boats.

C1 and C4 are very similar to each other, the key difference being able to take energy weapons in the side torso. This is more important than it seems, as it allows the C1 to take big energy weapons like PPCs and still carry some missile weapons, whereas the C4 is more likely to end up with bigger missile racks. Personally I started with a C1 and still have it, but I don't run it very often; in terms of LRM support my A1 build is better, and I never got a satisfactory Direct Fire build that I couldn't do better in a K2.

[Erghiez06]

Lynx7725, on 24 July 2013 - 08:39 AM, said:

K2 is a specialist amongst the Cats, being a direct fire platform.

A1 is a flexible platform, and is my current go-to Cat. I don't run Splat or Streak Cats though; I run LRM15x2 and Streaksx4 with Artemis and BAP support. Tune to your personal preference and it's a very strong build, flexible across multiple range bands, and not as vulnerable to lights as some missile boats.

C1 and C4 are very similar to each other, the key difference being able to take energy weapons in the side torso. This is more important than it seems, as it allows the C1 to take big energy weapons like PPCs and still carry some missile weapons, whereas the C4 is more likely to end up with bigger missile racks. Personally I started with a C1 and still have it, but I don't run it very often; in terms of LRM support my A1 build is better, and I never got a satisfactory Direct Fire build that I couldn't do better in a K2.

At the moment I am running a 2xLB10-XAC/ 4MLas CPLT K2 Build... So far I am enjoying this build MUCH more than any other I have previously tried, but I wouldnt mind sitting behind a mountain letting loose some death from above. =D

[Dalziel Hasek Davion]

The C1 and C4 are similar - but the C4 is a bit of a problem child. The two energy hardpoints are in the centre torso, which makes them tricky to use effectively. Until the recent SRM boost, the 20 tubes missile points were best paired with LRM20s. Even if you put 2xMPLs in the centre, it is insufficient deterrent to stop enemies swarming you.

The C1 is a much better balanced 'Mech. The best build I have found is 2xALRM15s, 3xMLs and TAG. That's a very potent brew. I found it considerably easier to level than the C4.

The A1 was lame before the SRM boost. The lack of ability to have your own TAG limited LRM deployments and the SRMs were insufficient for close defense work. I still don't like it for LRM work because of the lack of energy hardpoints.

I think the C1 is easier to level than the A1 followed by the C4 in last place.

[Lynx7725]

Do bear in mind that leveling a LRM boat can be quite frustrating, as good players have ways and means to reduce the effectiveness of LRM fire. You can end up winning games where you expend 4 or 5 tons of LRM ammo, only to do double-digit damage.

A C1 properly tricked out can end up decent speed, Artemis, BAP, AMS, TAG.. almost every whistle and bell you can cram on. Just remember, in any Cat, to keep twitching. Doesn't matter if you're goosing the throttle, or just twitching the torso twist. Doing that can prevent the dreaded Cat headshot. (I hadn't had a Cat headshot -- or any other chassis headshot -- for a long time. I twitch too much to get shot that way....)

[Voivode]

I built a C1 with 2xLRM20+A 3xML and a TAG. Run it with an XL engine and a decent amount of ammo and a couple jump jets. Does well in the fire support role, don't be afraid to push up a little either, LRMs become much deadlier if you hang around at 200-300 meters rather than tossing em from 600meters away.

[Kaox Veed]

CPLT-C1

That is how I run mine. You have good LRM support, an ERLLas to reach out and touch things that are untargetable or just add more long range damage, and 2 MLas for light defense. The JJs help your mobility enough to navigate or pop up to get your missiles over a building or whatever. You could switch in a Tag really easy too.

[BP Raven]

The C1 is the most vesatile of all the catapaults imo, it can do LRMs almost as well as the A1/C4 (good luck fitting much more than LRM40 on any cat with a sensible engine/ammo load) and makes for a better balanced brawler than the C4/A1 as it can mount large lasers. Before the heat nerf i ran 3LL/2SRM 6 and xl315, since swapped to 2LL & 2ML and maxed out the armour with the spare tonnage, although i'm still 1.3 tons light. Could even do PPC/LRM if that's your thing...

[MeiSooHaityu]

I recommend the C1 as being one of your variants. A good PUG build below...
2LLasers, 2MLasers, 2SRM6+Art, DHS, XL295, standard armor and structure.

It's fast, has good heat effiecency, and deals good damage. LLasers give it some reach, and the SRMs make people wish they didn't get that close. I don't run LRMs only because PUGing can make it difficult to get consistent good locks.

Next I went the A1. I have either gone Splatcat (6SRM4+Art) or have gone 6LRM5s. Again, LRMs are tricky as a PUG, but 6 LRM5s definently have a chuckle factor when somone gets caught out in the open and just rained upon.

[El Bandito]

Erghiez06, on 24 July 2013 - 08:43 AM, said:

At the moment I am running a 2xLB10-XAC/ 4MLas CPLT K2 Build... So far I am enjoying this build MUCH more than any other I have previously tried, but I wouldnt mind sitting behind a mountain letting loose some death from above. =D

The moment he realizes LB10X is garbage...

If you like close ranged work like your K2 build, then get SRM boating A1. Beats the snot out of anything it faces...in 270 range.

Edited by El Bandito, 24 July 2013 - 10:00 AM.

[MeiSooHaityu]

El Bandito, on 24 July 2013 - 09:57 AM, said:

The moment he realizes LB10X is garbage...

I am running 2 LBXs in the Cat K2 for now (with 4MLasers). I like that, since they are lighter than A/C10s, I can now run at 86kph (vs. 71kph) LOL.

With the increased speed the LBXs have afforded me, and still having 4MLasers, it is actually rather fun to play.

Although I definenltly believe the A/C10s are superior, I have had descent luck with the dual LBXs. I will be hipster (or stupid depending on your definition) and stay with them for now because I am having fun with them.

[Erghiez06]

El Bandito, on 24 July 2013 - 09:57 AM, said:

The moment he realizes LB10X is garbage...

If you like close ranged work like your K2 build, then get SRM boating A1. Beats the snot out of anything it faces...in 270 range.

So what is it about the LB10x thats so terrible? I hear alot of hate for this, but since I've picked it up Ive been doing tremendously better than using any of the other builds I've tried.

[MeiSooHaityu]

Erghiez06, on 24 July 2013 - 10:05 AM, said:

So what is it about the LB10x thats so terrible? I hear alot of hate for this, but since I've picked it up Ive been doing tremendously better than using any of the other builds I've tried.

Pinpoint damage of the A/C10 is more effective in general than the spread out damage of an LBX. People like doing 10points of damage to a part rather than 3points to one part, 2 points to another, and 5 points to another as an example. Plus the spread at range is rather brutal. Definently a close in weapon.

[El Bandito]

MeiSooHaityu, on 24 July 2013 - 10:05 AM, said:

I am running 2 LBXs in the Cat K2 for now (with 4MLasers). I like that, since they are lighter than A/C10s, I can now run at 86kph (vs. 71kph) LOL. With the increased speed the LBXs have afforded me, and still having 4MLasers, it is actually rather fun to play. Although I definenltly believe the A/C10s are superior, I have had descent luck with the dual LBXs. I will be hipster (or stupid depending on your definition) and stay with them for now because I am having fun with them.

Well that definitely is hip. The difference between hip and stupidity lies in the ability to make the build/mech work (such as my Streakcat during ECM heydays in February). Clearly you have such ability.

Edited by El Bandito, 24 July 2013 - 10:15 AM.

[Barantor]

Voivode, on 24 July 2013 - 08:58 AM, said:

I built a C1 with 2xLRM20+A 3xML and a TAG. Run it with an XL engine and a decent amount of ammo and a couple jump jets. Does well in the fire support role, don't be afraid to push up a little either, LRMs become much deadlier if you hang around at 200-300 meters rather than tossing em from 600meters away.

This.

Don't hide behind the hills and just rely on Pugs to give you locks. Make your own locks with tag and let em have all the tubes. Even assaults don't like getting a face full of missiles.

Best bet is to wait until you know there is a big furball going on and get at an angle that lets you engage some of the assaults while still having an escape route in case you get too much attention or if you need to run off some lights. Lights will be your bane, you will be all set up laying the smack down and then start getting cored out from the rear by a jenner. Be sure to use your jump jets when this happens so you can change directions a lot to throw those lights off your tail. Run back to the group and hope a pug has enough sense to shoot off the lights or at least help you do it.

Then go back to laying the missiles down on the assaults and heavies .

[Voivode]

When fighting lights in an LRM boat, don't stop lobbing LRMs at the other players on the enemy team while you maneuver away from the lights and shoot at them with your support weapons. That's important, or harassing lights will mess up your ability to do anything in a match.

[Lynx7725]

Erghiez06, on 24 July 2013 - 10:05 AM, said:

So what is it about the LB10x thats so terrible? I hear alot of hate for this, but since I've picked it up Ive been doing tremendously better than using any of the other builds I've tried.

Twin AC10s on a Cat can do a nice number using precision burst, easily up to 500m out. Being able to quickly apply damage or drop a torso from range is a big deal in games, since one less torso can mean one less enemy mech -- at the very least, it's going to reduce that mech's effectiveness.

LB10X are nice, the key thing is that you need to get in a lot closer. Within 150m, there's not going to be much difference between a AC10 and a LB10X -- the cluster rounds is not spread out enough to matter. Outside of that, it becomes a sandpaper. Effective at neutering enemy mechs if you have a team that has help to strip armour. It's not bad, it's just that it takes too long (and leaves you exposed that long) to kill something.

[Erghiez06]

I uno.. Maybe I am just terrible with AC10s because I do terrible with a pair of those on. I at one point tried compromising and throwing an ac10 and an lb10x and that just wasnt doing it. Maybe the gun is a terrible gun, but whatever the case, its making me not feel like I suck so much XD. I actually get to kill things now.

[orcrist86]

I run a k2 with dual uac/5 and get modest results. The c4 was my go to platform for varied fire support. I could run lots of srms or a combo of lrm and srm. It was weakest up close. The C1(f) of mine is best when able to hang back and get consistent lock ons from lance mates. these days hes gathering dust because ecm has forced him to fight snipers and close range battles too much. However he can be specced to do ok at close range. I recommend the K2 and the c1 as good placed so start. They function very differently and will prepare you for trying the c4. Start with K2, direct fire is easier to comprehend, with the C1 next. Playing fire support is rewarding, but tricky.... being the last alive or first down is also a reality you'll confront alot when playing a C1.

[Shadey99]

I run A1, C1, and K2 builds. In fact I have more time in Cats then anything else I own and while I don't like them quite as much as my Cicadas I can handle them well.

I also owned a C4, but I didn't keep it... Only mech I've ever sold. The 2M (RA/LA) & 2E (CT) hard points are just too rough, if it was 4M+2E it would be much better off. It can't run a TAG without striping it's lasers down to a single ML or MPL, which makes it feel like a bigger missile version of a 5K spider (1 ML+2MG style).

My Firestorm CPLT-A1 is easily my best K/D ratio mech and I regularly eat Atlas' and pretty much anything 1v1. It could run a BAP or AMS by pulling some leg armor off (more than 40 is usually a waste on this build) & removing a ton or LRM ammo. You could also bump up the engine to a 300XL, but I find ammo to light if I up the speed. Some would remove a pair of JJs, but with 4 I can usually do a Spider and jump over a mech and do a 360 to land a pack of SRMs on an enemy while they are turning to match me.

My Sunfire CPLT-C1 or Sunfire alt 1 CPLT-C1 is not quite as good a design. But I got tired of running this Longshot CPLT-C1. 2 ER LL just didn't have quite the kick that the three have and I found myself having to stay fairly up close anyways. May as well run the SRMs. The sunfire designs both make acceptable 'brawlers' for what they can run.

My K2 is a super light energy using design that is currently 5 tons lighter than normal as I ran out of slots.to stuff mroe stuff in.

Edited by Shadey99, 24 July 2013 - 01:45 PM.