59 replies to this topic

[TheGreatNoNo]

I`m a medium, and I use seismic. I`m killing myself?

[Khobai]

Pinpoint alphas are the reason medium mechs suck. Taking 35-40 damage in one location is devastating to a medium mech.

[Tezcatli]

Or should you say that it's a bane for Lights? Because how can it be a bane for mediums if they're so under represented?

The only ones that get annoyed with it are lights. Because otherwise they can swarm in around their target with relative impunity.

[Steel Claws]

For something that is extinct - I sure see a lot of Centurians and Cicadas with quite a few Hunchies and Blackjacks in game. Personally I love running blackjacks.

[Erata]

Things like BAP and ECM being "modules" that weigh something and consume space in the mech is what I'd suggest Seismic get, and like AMS and ECM, restrict what kind of mechs it can be installed into.

I don't know which ones you'd want to restrict it to, but I suppose I'd start by letting no or very few assaults carry it, especially if they're already amazing, top-tier robots. Probably make it common on mediums and lights more than heavies since... heavies are already good enough.

It would be one way to help buff up some of the under-used mech-variants as well and make them more attractive to use, since, like everyone's said, Seismo's just over-buffing already great robits.

Give it to all the Awesomes at no weight as a mech quirk since they're easy-to-shoot barns.

Edited by Erata, 27 July 2013 - 07:03 PM.

[Xenon Codex]

Mediums aren't extinct. I just had this awesome "assault mode" game tonight, with my team of 3 mediums and 3 lights. I was the only assault in a Victor. We were short a man, but my team overcame the odds and prevailed against 3 assaults, 1 heavy, 2 mediums, and 2 lights,. I ended up being the last man standing, but all my teammates contributed significantly to the win, with a Treb coming in 2nd overall. It was a great match, wish I'd recorded it.

[Xandre Blackheart]

Wtf are you talking about? Broken *** centurions (with their invulnerable CT) are so thick you have to use seismic to plot all of them.

Mediums are the workhorse, not the spearpoint. Try not running up in an assault's face. Unless of course you are a centurion, then go ahead, because stickman can last forever.

[MaxStr]

There are a lot of reasons medium mechs are scarce, seismic sensor is not one of them.

[Khobai]

Eh I kill medium mechs in two or three alpha strikes with my 3 PPC/gauss atlas-RS. They are all super easy to hit with the exception of the Cicada. It is so freakin pathetic and completely indicative of the problem. I should not be able to do 45 points of damage to a single location on a medium mech.

[One Medic Army]

Khobai, on 28 July 2013 - 01:10 AM, said:

Eh I kill medium mechs in two or three alpha strikes with my 3 PPC/gauss atlas-RS. They are all super easy to hit with the exception of the Cicada. It is so freakin pathetic and completely indicative of the problem. I should not be able to do 45 points of damage to a single location on a medium mech.

Pretty much sums up one part of the problem.
Lights are hugely faster and much smaller than mediums, but right now mediums aren't really much tougher (excepting Centurion and their zombie mode/great hitboxes). The lights aren't even losing out on that much firepower.

[stjobe]

One Medic Army, on 28 July 2013 - 01:17 AM, said:

Pretty much sums up one part of the problem.
Lights are hugely faster and much smaller than mediums, but right now mediums aren't really much tougher (excepting Centurion and their zombie mode/great hitboxes). The lights aren't even losing out on that much firepower.

Please don't make this into a mediums vs lights discussion, where we have to nerf lights to make mediums better. Lights suffer just as much from the current game state as mediums. Instead, make it a discussion on the relative strengths of mediums vs heavies or mediums vs assaults, since it's the heavies and assaults who are over-represented in the game.

We need more mediums and lights, and less heavies and assaults. Therefore it would make sense to take from heavies and assaults and give to lights and mediums - not to take from lights and give to mediums.

[One Medic Army]

stjobe, on 28 July 2013 - 01:52 AM, said:

Please don't make this into a mediums vs lights discussion, where we have to nerf lights to make mediums better. Lights suffer just as much from the current game state as mediums. Instead, make it a discussion on the relative strengths of mediums vs heavies or mediums vs assaults, since it's the heavies and assaults who are over-represented in the game.

We need more mediums and lights, and less heavies and assaults. Therefore it would make sense to take from heavies and assaults and give to lights and mediums - not to take from lights and give to mediums.

It's not mediums vs lights, it's the fact that they can both be pretty much insta-gibbed by assaults, and nearly so by heavies playing the most powerful alpha-meta builds.

Nothing will change until it's either harder for assaults to put out that much firepower, or until its much harder to have it all hit the same spot. The devs currently seem to be favoring the latter.

[stjobe]

One Medic Army, on 28 July 2013 - 01:58 AM, said:

It's not mediums vs lights, it's the fact that they can both be pretty much insta-gibbed by assaults, and nearly so by heavies playing the most powerful alpha-meta builds.

That I can agree with. It just sounded like you wanted to create space for mediums by taking away space from the lights, when it's the heavies and assaults that have too much space.

I apologize for the misunderstanding.

One Medic Army, on 28 July 2013 - 01:58 AM, said:

Nothing will change until it's either harder for assaults to put out that much firepower, or until its much harder to have it all hit the same spot. The devs currently seem to be favoring the latter.

I think that in addition to that, increased rewards for doing stuff other than what heavies and assaults excel at may be a good incentive to get more lights and mediums on the field. It seems from the last few AtD's that the devs are actually thinking about those kind of incentives as well.

[thepartisan]

The weight at which mechs drop coupled with the fact that there are many heavier mechs that can easily kill mediums is what is making them scarce. Once they sort out the drop system and limit the amount of heavies and assaults that are dropped then mediums will have a resurgence again. There is nothing scarier than running a medium and walking into a enemy lance that is chock full of heavies and assaults.

[Cferre]

Jungle Rhino, on 27 July 2013 - 03:02 PM, said:

Seismic sensor.

The Seismic sensor turned MWO in a turn-based strategy game... like Pokemon.

It was however, like someone else said. The final nail.

[Chemie]

Actually the number one reason is engine limits. Why take a medium that goes the same speed as a heavy (which has more armor and DPS)? Why take a medium that goes way less speed than a light (before engine limits, mediums could hunt lights).

Mediums are stuck in no=mans land where they are too slow to scout and too weak vs heavies.

Only solution is drop weight limits.

[Cybermech]

If your looking for better game flow then you need to do somethings.
reduce torso twisting in general and put more speed between heavies - mediums and medium - light.
Assaults and Heavies do not have the "slow" weakness's that is needed for game play.

[Chemie]

Steel Claws, on 27 July 2013 - 06:33 PM, said:

For something that is extinct - I sure see a lot of Centurians and Cicadas with quite a few Hunchies and Blackjacks in game. Personally I love running blackjacks.

Cent is the exception because of the known damage transfer bug is highlighted with the Cent.
Spiders have Atlas armor (hitbox and HSR) while Cents have damage transfer bug that allows them to take close to 500 damage.

[Nicholas Carlyle]

stjobe, on 28 July 2013 - 02:13 AM, said:

That I can agree with. It just sounded like you wanted to create space for mediums by taking away space from the lights, when it's the heavies and assaults that have too much space.

I apologize for the misunderstanding.


I think that in addition to that, increased rewards for doing stuff other than what heavies and assaults excel at may be a good incentive to get more lights and mediums on the field. It seems from the last few AtD's that the devs are actually thinking about those kind of incentives as well.

Not that I don't like more incentives...one of the problems right now is I don't really have anything to buy.

One issue is that I refuse to buy MC right now so I'm limited a bit for mech bays.

But it's also that I just don't care for any of the mechs out there.

I was going to buy an Orion, but yeah...Quickdraw.

More to my point though is even without premium time, i have 22~mill C-bills, I bought and sold Ravens to elite them, and still have my 3x Highlander, 3x Centurion and Raven 3L.

More rewards wouldn't really do anything for me.

Maybe with CW? But CW sounds so convoluted at this point with it basically boiling down to fighting for Loyalty points and discounts on equipment, I don't think I care.

[Thorqemada]

Chemie, on 28 July 2013 - 06:41 AM, said:

Cent is the exception because of the known damage transfer bug is highlighted with the Cent.
Spiders have Atlas armor (hitbox and HSR) while Cents have damage transfer bug that allows them to take close to 500 damage.

Ask yourself why you shoot a location that is good to shield.
Ask yourself what location is not good shielded.
Kill it easy.