22 replies to this topic

[CancR]

All lasers really need a massive overhaul and here's how to do it:

Laser/cycle/damage/heat
small/1.75/3/2
SPL/1.5/4/3
Med/2/5/3
MPL/1.75/6/4
Large/3.25/8/7
LPL/3/9/8
ERLL/4/9/9

Tonnage for weapons, and range would stay the same, and only the core mechanics that need to be change'd would be. For the extra weight, pulse versions of the weapons will give you a much faster cycle time allowing you more shots fired in exchange for less firepower and more heat.

I'll come back and format this post later but this basic idea will make all the lasers in line with all the ballistics monsters PGI has spawned by nerfing the **** out all forms of lasers in cycle and damage and heat.

[xDeityx]

PGI doesn't have the skill to do it, but really all weapons should be standardized as much as possible so that 1 critical and 1 ton worth of missile weaponry is as effective as 1 crit and 1 ton of energy weaponry and the same for ballistics. As it stands right now if you were to break down the math for each weapon to find out how much range, damage per second, damage per heat, and alpha damage you get per critical and ton you would have wild fluctuations all over the place, with PPCs giving you crazy good efficiency for the amount of criticals and tonnage and something like an LBX10 giving you horrible efficiency per crit and ton.

Edit: and smaller weapons should be slightly more efficient than larger ones so that hardpoints retain value.

Edited by xDeityx, 30 July 2013 - 11:02 AM.

[Sprouticus]

Long cycle times for lasers would make them even more useless than they are.


Reducing the beam time on pulse lasers might be an option. Or raising the damage of lasers and pulse lasers but also raising the beam time on the std lasers.

[CancR]

xDeityx, on 30 July 2013 - 10:56 AM, said:

PGI doesn't have the skill to do it, but really all weapons should be standardized as much as possible so that 1 critical and 1 ton worth of missile weaponry is as effective as 1 crit and 1 ton of energy weaponry and the same for ballistics. As it stands right now if you were to break down the math for each weapon to find out how much range, damage per second, damage per heat, and alpha damage you get per critical and ton you would have wild fluctuations all over the place, with PPCs giving you crazy good efficiency for the amount of criticals and tonnage and something like an LBX10 giving you horrible efficiency per crit and ton.

Edit: and smaller weapons should be slightly more efficient than larger ones so that hardpoints retain value.

I have little faith in PGI but even they could do this fix. They just need to change a few lines in the code to do this. As far as your edit, that's what I hope to accomplish. Pulse version have a very slight damage and cycle time and damage, I looked to fix that by making the damage a whole number more, and rather a really minuscule fraction of the normal version to a visible shorter time.

[CancR]

Sprouticus, on 30 July 2013 - 11:16 AM, said:

Long cycle times for lasers would make them even more useless than they are.


Reducing the beam time on pulse lasers might be an option. Or raising the damage of lasers and pulse lasers but also raising the beam time on the std lasers.

My idea gives pulse lasers shorter cycle times then what they currently now, and make them noticeably faster then the normal laser counter parts rather then a barely fraction of a second they are now. from .75 of a second to .50 of a second is big.

Compared to the med in this model; as in when you would be able to fire again:
1st shot/2nd shot/3rd shot seconds
SPL1.5/3/4.5
Med: 2/4/6

Compared to what it is now, this is huge.

[Unbound Inferno]

CancR, on 30 July 2013 - 10:12 AM, said:

All lasers really need a massive overhaul and here's how to do it:

Laser/cycle/damage/heat
small/1.75/3/2
SPL/1.5/4/3
Med/2/5/3
MPL/1.75/6/4
Large/3.25/8/7
LPL/3/9/8
ERLL/4/9/9

Tonnage for weapons, and range would stay the same, and only the core mechanics that need to be change'd would be. For the extra weight, pulse versions of the weapons will give you a much faster cycle time allowing you more shots fired in exchange for less firepower and more heat.

I'll come back and format this post later but this basic idea will make all the lasers in line with all the ballistics monsters PGI has spawned by nerfing the **** out all forms of lasers in cycle and damage and heat.

No, no, no... oh hell no.

The ONLY way that kind of idea works is if the laser impacts with its full damage once, not the umpteenth times it "hits" during the duration.

You'd need like a special "targeting laser" that keeps it on a part or the mech for the entire time, the damage spread out like that makes it useless. Beyond useless really, its like an Atlas with a MG in the side torso, worse really.

[CancR]

Sure, if you want things to go back to MW4 where I can get behind you and hit you with 4 vollies of Direct hit 6X MLs and toast you before you can react, but that is only going to make you nerf skill buff handholding people cry even more.

[MaxStr]

Sorry the only energy weapons allowed to be good are PPCs.

[Goose]

Really? You Liked your own post?

Edited by Goose, 31 July 2013 - 12:54 PM.

[A banana in the tailpipe]

Real life pulse lasers are on their way. "If a laser puts out a pulse with modest energy, but the time is incredibly tiny, the power can be huge," according to Fischer. "During the duration of the laser pulse, it can be putting out more power than a large city needs, but the pulse only lasts for two-trillionths of a second."

[CancR]

Trolls and irl science aside, this is how lasers get fixed

[Volthorne]

CancR, on 31 July 2013 - 08:57 AM, said:

Trolls and irl science aside, this is how lasers get fixed

Snarkiness and "holier than thou" attitude aside, this is why people shouldn't be allowed to post "balancing fixes". They have no clue what the **** they're doing. I don't claim to know how to fix things myself, I can only offer advice from MY point of view, and I realize it's going to be heavily biased.

[DEHK]

You have that wrong OP.

Lasers are efficient by weight/space and inefficient by heat.
Ballistics are efficient by heat and inefficient by weight/space.
Missiles are in the middle.

This is rudimentary Battletech game design.

However, I do agree that PGI lacks the skill to edit existing XML data to "aggressively balance weapons".

[CancR]

DEHK, on 31 July 2013 - 09:37 AM, said:

You have that wrong OP.

Lasers are efficient by weight/space and inefficient by heat.
Ballistics are efficient by heat and inefficient by weight/space.
Missiles are in the middle.

This is rudimentary Battletech game design.

However, I do agree that PGI lacks the skill to edit existing XML data to "aggressively balance weapons".

MWO has none of these as lasers generate more heat then they should, ballistics don't generate enough heat, esp since you can take any tonnage you want and stick 2 Gauss, or at the least a Gauss with another weapon keeping heat much lower then any mech that relies on energy, and missiles are just short range ballistics, because if you can press m1 once and get a kill, the cry babies go nuts on the forums.

F- for facts, d- for effort.
And for the masses that babel about thing they don't know anything about,try playing battletech and other mechwarrior game or battle tech before mentioning them.

[CancR]

Volthorne, on 31 July 2013 - 09:29 AM, said:

Stupidity here.

All this blissful ignorance, and yet devs of competitive games for decades has looked to the most skilled in the community for balance. games you may of heard of like Quake, Star Craft, Team fortress 2, LoL, even MW:LL.
You can't accuse other people of not knowing how to balance a game just because you don't, that's just lazy and stupid.

Like..Blatantly ripping off gaming's favorite joke by removing one word and adding in two more..Oh I see...You are a PGI employee on a smurf account.

[Joseph Mallan]

Goose, on 30 July 2013 - 11:49 PM, said:

Really? You Liked your own post?

Sometimes... you just have to Sir.

[CancR]

I did it once, but only after there where about 90 other people who liked it before me.

[80sGlamRockSensation David Bowie]

Standard Beam Lasers are fine (except for that heat penalty on Larges, should be bumped to at least 3 instead of 2)


Pulse lasers need to be reworked entirely from scratch so they're actaully a unique weapon system instead of a shittier, heavier, shorter ranged, hotter version of normal beam lasers with zero upsides other than a negligible shorter burn time -- la de freaking da --

[Diablobo]

The OP's damage and heat numbers are straight from TT.

[CancR]

Diablobo, on 31 July 2013 - 05:37 PM, said:

The OP's damage and heat numbers are straight from TT.

Straight out of closed beta, and TT. Why where they changed from Closed beta? Because the PPC/LRM monsters cried when the gap was closed ad because of that we just stomped them. Skill Socialism at it's finest.