376 replies to this topic

[Aym]

The Patch Notes say SRM 4's and 6's will share the same characteristics when calculating whether or not to apply ghost heat, yet they have different max Alpha's. How will this be resolved, will firing 1 SRM 6 and 3 SRM 4's be penalized or not?

[Bilbo]

SirLagsalot, on 30 July 2013 - 08:18 AM, said:

Ok, I'm confused. This is not the same as the lumping PPCs together because the PPCs all share the same max alpha limit.
SRM6 max alpha limit is 3, SRM4 max alpha limit is 4. If I have 3x SRM4 and 1x SRM6 and alpha, do I incur the heat penalty or not?
They share the max alpha limit now, so does it count as me firing 4x SRM4 and no heat penalty or does it count as me firing 4x SRM6 and incurring the wrath of the heat gods?

As I read it, you can fire 4 SRM4's without penalty. If you use 3 SRM4's and 1 SRM6, your alpha limit is now 3 because SRM6 have higher base heat. If you carry an SRM6, your max alpha will be 3 in any combination of SRM6 and SRM4.

[gwarm]

LL, ERLL, LPL will now share their max alpha limit.

Seriously? Really?

Who thought of this? Who decided it made any sense or was a good idea? What exactly are you trying to accomplish by doing this? Is there a single person who fires an ERLL and LPL at the same time?

Meanwhile my 2x ERPPC 1x Gauss build remains unaffected and as powerful as it was in February.

[Khobai]

Quote

This heat scale system is an unintuitive mess and it keeps on getting worse.

Agreed. The heat scale system punishes weapons that werent a problem while all the problem weapons remain unhindered. In other words it did absolutely nothing but make the problem even worse. Because now that LL, SRMs, and LRMs are nerfed all thats left for us to use is PPC/Gauss.

I am really excited about the new map. Unfortunately I know that excitement will be short lived with all of the PPC/Gauss flinging that will be going on. But on the bright side, at least the scourge that was mixed LL and LPL will no longer dominate the game.

Edited by Khobai, 30 July 2013 - 08:49 AM.

[Druidika]

#2PPC1Gauss remains unaffected.

Still greatly looking forward to a mech capable of fielding #2PPC2Gauss (#Devastator)

At least they dropped the hashtag crap from last time...

Edited by Druidika, 30 July 2013 - 08:47 AM.

[xZaOx]

PGI clearly doesn't have a clue on balance. Who is "boating/alpha striking" LPL/ERL/LL. They are extremely hot to begin with.

Just like the last random LPL nerf. A nerf to a weapon NO ONE BARELY used. Yes, that really promotes build diversity.

As many stated LL should be 4, or at least 3. I guess they are nerfing everything into the ground, so stock mechs become viable.

[Belorion]

gwarm, on 30 July 2013 - 08:43 AM, said:

LL, ERLL, LPL will now share their max alpha limit.

Seriously? Really?

Who thought of this? Who decided it made any sense or was a good idea? What exactly are you trying to accomplish by doing this? Is there a single person who fires an ERLL and LPL at the same time?

Meanwhile my 2x ERPPC 1x Gauss build remains unaffected and as powerful as it was in February.

Yes there were people running that.

You can also now run 4xML and 2xLPLs for a 41+ alpha.

[Dexter Herbivore]

gwarm, on 30 July 2013 - 08:43 AM, said:

LL, ERLL, LPL will now share their max alpha limit.

Seriously? Really?

Who thought of this? Who decided it made any sense or was a good idea? What exactly are you trying to accomplish by doing this? Is there a single person who fires an ERLL and LPL at the same time?

LL Stalker boats could carry a mix between LPL and LL, OR ERLL and LL. I've seen people experimenting with both recently (I'm assuming in anticipation of boating heat changes).

[jozkhan]

Caligulan Game Design strikes back!

Is it just me or are we now only 1 step away from:

On Wednesdays, Fridays and Sundays LL, ERLL and LPL will have higher heat thresholds

and on Tuesdays and Thursdays PPC, SRM and LRM will run hotter.

seriously where the f is this all going?

[Middcore]

Belorion, on 30 July 2013 - 08:48 AM, said:

Yes there were people running that.

You can also now run 4xML and 2xLPLs for a 41+ alpha.

Why would I run 2xLPLs in that build instead of 2xPPC?

Why would I EVER use a LPL on ANY build instead of a PPC, as things stand?

[20k]

Druidika, on 30 July 2013 - 08:45 AM, said:

#2PPC1Gauss remains unaffected.

Still greatly looking forward to a mech capable of fielding #2PPC2Gauss (#Devastator)

At least they dropped the hashtag crap from last time...

You can already run this in an Ilya. Its pretty much self defeating as the gauss rifles are ridiculously likely to explode when shot off

[Suri Curume]

SirLagsalot, on 30 July 2013 - 08:18 AM, said:

Ok, I'm confused. This is not the same as the lumping PPCs together because the PPCs all share the same max alpha limit.
SRM6 max alpha limit is 3, SRM4 max alpha limit is 4. If I have 3x SRM4 and 1x SRM6 and alpha, do I incur the heat penalty or not?
They share the max alpha limit now, so does it count as me firing 4x SRM4 and no heat penalty or does it count as me firing 4x SRM6 and incurring the wrath of the heat gods?

The way it would make the most sense to me is if it's set up with you only get the penalty after 3 launchers if there at least 3 SRM6s, otherwise, the penalty kicks in after 4 launchers.

To illustrate:

• 3x SRM6 = no penalty
  
• 4x SRM6 = penalty (using SRM6 bonus heat multiplier)
  
• 4x SRM4 = no penalty
  
• 5x SRM4 = penalty (using SRM4 bonus heat multiplier)
  
• 2x SRM4, 2x SRM6 = no penalty
  
• 3x SRM4, 2x SRM6 = penalty (using SRM6 bonus heat multiplier)

I think that your suggested setup of 3xSRM4 + 1xSRM6 shouldn't be penalized, since it's still under 4 launchers. The whole thing is ridiculously unintuitive.


Although, I could see them setting it up so that as soon as an SRM6 is involved at all, that the penalty applies after 3 launchers (in which case your 3xSRM4 + 1xSRM6 incurs a penalty). This would be a HUGE nerf to SRMs in general, and I really hope that is not the case.

Bilbo, on 30 July 2013 - 08:43 AM, said:

As I read it, you can fire 4 SRM4's without penalty. If you use 3 SRM4's and 1 SRM6, your alpha limit is now 3 because SRM6 have higher base heat. If you carry an SRM6, your max alpha will be 3 in any combination of SRM6 and SRM4.

I really don't want that to be true...

Edited by Suri Curume, 30 July 2013 - 08:56 AM.

[Khobai]

Quote

PGI clearly doesn't have a clue on balance. Who is "boating/alpha striking" LPL/ERL/LL. They are extremely hot to begin with.

Exactly. LL do crap damage by themselves and are only viable when you have 3-4 linked together. LLs are ONLY effective if boated, so by adding boating penalties, you make them completely worthless.

[Cycleboy]

Bilbo, on 30 July 2013 - 08:43 AM, said:

As I read it, you can fire 4 SRM4's without penalty. If you use 3 SRM4's and 1 SRM6, your alpha limit is now 3 because SRM6 have higher base heat. If you carry an SRM6, your max alpha will be 3 in any combination of SRM6 and SRM4.

I'm hoping this is it too. The worst literal translation is that they dropped the alpha of SRM4 to 3xshot, and forgot to change the other page to reflect that.

[WaddeHaddeDudeda]

Will I still be able to buy the lump of coal from the last year?
And will the next patch increase it's performance?

[Reno Blade]

AndyHill, on 30 July 2013 - 08:14 AM, said:

Actually they don't have a fix for pretty much anything. Furthermore, the weird heat mumbo jumbo isn't even supposed to be a fix to boating, but to massive pinpoint alphas - which is a real issue and would require a real solution instead of this facepalm-inducing mess.

There is your mistake. It's just there to reduce boating. Side effect = less pin point alphas shot, because most of them were boats.

Janus Wealth, on 30 July 2013 - 08:17 AM, said:

Can someone explain to me, why this will be implemented?

Why? Because you should be hitting your two 3xSRM weapongroups instead of your 6xSRM weapongroup.

SirLagsalot, on 30 July 2013 - 08:18 AM, said:

Ok, I'm confused. This is not the same as the lumping PPCs together because the PPCs all share the same max alpha limit.
SRM6 max alpha limit is 3, SRM4 max alpha limit is 4. If I have 3x SRM4 and 1x SRM6 and alpha, do I incur the heat penalty or not?
They share the max alpha limit now, so does it count as me firing 4x SRM4 and no heat penalty or does it count as me firing 4x SRM6 and incurring the wrath of the heat gods?

The highest weapon is used.
This means for SRM6+SRM4 combos its counted the same as only SRM6s.
Limit is 3 before penalty and SRM6 values (heat and penaltie).
Result= Splatcats with 3xSRM6 and 3xSRM4 will be "forced" to groupfire 3 launchers and wait 0.5 sec before shooting the second group, or else get more heat.

Gaslight, on 30 July 2013 - 08:29 AM, said:

...
The only thing that needs to be changed with LRMs is to FINALLY MAKE THEM STOP PREFERENTIALLY DOING DAMAGE TO THE CENTER TORSO. I am sick and tired of getting cored by LRM fire with the rest of my 'mech barely at yellow armor.

..

If you DON'T have TAG+ARTEMIS your LRMs are spread all over and even an Atlas will only be hit by about 90% of a volley!

Quote

Two weeks of SRMs being halfway decent again and you've already started to nerf them into the ground step by step once more?

Ha! It was announced before and it's not to counter-nerf the buff.

Quote

[*]
Artillery Will remain useless, nobody cares.

It's pretty nasty if you get hit by these and it will be a bit more now. Try it out before complaining!

Quote

Could this be more vague? What is the point of patch notes like this? Let's start with: which missiles?
...
OK, again: inaccurate how? Too short or too long?

None of your business.

Quote

Good, but the revised movement mechanics are going to remain a frustrating mixed bag until you take into account the height of the 'mech versus the height of the obstacle. I should be able to step over something that only comes up to my 'mechs shins regardless of its "slope." Implement a check which measures the height of the obstacle as a percentage of the 'mech height, and if it's under a certain percentage, the 'mech steps over automatically. Problem solved.

Your are crying before seeing how it even works out now?
Grow some back and learn to fight with the environmental handycap as everyone else on the battlefield!

[Stoicblitzer]

i'm so glad i didn't buy a phoenix package. i'm such a smarty pants.

[JohnnyWayne]

And I'm glad I did.

[Damocles69]

Wtf is this? Can we have the real patch notes now? These must be a joke because bumping PPC year litteraly takes 15 seconds in XML

[AlexEss]

I like to point out (again) that not everything the devs does end up in our hands. (mostly because it is a very slow way of getting feedback with a very high noise ratio) So just because we do not see any aggressive weapons changes, the devs could have been working their arses off testing different things. In fact seeing how this community reacts to.. anything it is most likley for the best that we only see a select part of the process.

The patch looks good, personally i have had very little problem with performance but if this fix some of the problem people are seeing it is good. New maps looks good and i might even dig out my old YLW with a gauss to keep the heat down.