21 replies to this topic

[Tennex]

The round shoulder joint, on the centurion still counts as attached arm hitbox, even if the arms are destroyed.
meaning it will also reduce damage.

A centurion's
center torso takes
70 points of damage (tested using 14ML shots)

When shooting through the side torso it takes
155 damage to CT the centurion (only 50% of damage goes to the CT)

When shooting through the side torso's shoulder joint (ghost arm hitbox shown in red box) it takes
275 damage to kill the CT of the centurion (only 25% goes to CT)


Meaning if you shot a zombie Cent at just the right angle with an AC20. you do 5 damage.

Edited by Tennex, 30 July 2013 - 10:23 PM.

[stjobe]

Working as intended. It works the same on every other 'mech as well, only their "arm debris" is smaller than the Cent's.

[Tennex]

stjobe, on 30 July 2013 - 10:19 PM, said:

Working as intended. It works the same on every other 'mech as well, only their "arm debris" is smaller than the Cent's.

nope i tried it with a couple of other mechs and it didn't have that

tried shooting through arm debris with the commando, the cicada, the catapult. it only took 2x as many shots. to get CT through the arm debris. meaning only 50% reduction.

though for the atlas shooting through arm debris gave a 20% reduction.



there are definitely some inconsistencies going on here. i would love to know what the devs' intentions are with this mechanic.

Edited by Tennex, 30 July 2013 - 10:45 PM.

[Chemie]

working as intended....Cent is the only viable medium mech as a result. Goes with the bugged spider as the best light option. Without a bugged hitbox (spider) and bugged damage transfer (applies to all mechs but Cent has build geometry which makes it most evident), we would have no role warfare.

[Ngamok]

Here is a better screenshot of how big that area is. Notice how big the arm debris is? Hint, it's the non red section.

http://cloud-2.steam...DB809488AD37D7/

[N a p e s]

And that is why I basically never bother to aim for a Cent's torso unless its already been stripped and I'm confident I can get a kill shot. Coming up against a fresh Cent I go straight for the legs. They are big easy targets which rarely have the full armor rating of 48 and once one leg is gone the thing is a sitting duck.

[DaZur]

When a section is destroyed, doesn't damage received by that location then pass it to it's adjacent hierarchical section?

i.e... Since the vestigial shoulder bit is at "zero" would not the full amount of damage simply be passed to the RT or LT?

Edited by DaZur, 31 July 2013 - 06:39 AM.

[Tennex]

DaZur, on 31 July 2013 - 06:38 AM, said:

When a section is destroyed, doesn't damage received by that location then pass it to it's adjacent hierarchical section?

i.e... Since the vestigial shoulder bit is at "zero" would not the full amount of damage simply be passed to the RT or LT?

However it seems like this occurs with only a minoity of mechs so it is not clear if this is an intended mechanic or a bug(remnant of the overdamage passing mechanic)

Edited by Tennex, 31 July 2013 - 09:20 AM.

[Braggart]

actually, it is not working as intended. PGI said this is a low priority fix, a long time ago.

Other mechs lose entire arms, and do not has this problem, and 100% of the damage goes to the side torso.

Edited by Braggart, 31 July 2013 - 07:15 AM.

[Mister Blastman]

That is a very interesting find. I wonder what else is goofy on the Cent. They sure manage to take more of a pounding than almost anything else out there... pound for pound.

[Trauglodyte]

It isn't so much a bug in damage transferrence but rather an art bug with how much residual arm/torso is left after you blow it off. As was said, if you see a fresh Cent rolling around, ignore the torsos and go straight for the legs.

[Roland]

There's really no way that this can be considered "working as intended".

Once the arm is blown off, then it should be gone. Honestly, I'm generally of the opinion that damage transfer should be 100%, or that it should at least bypass armor and transfer to internals.

Back in MW4, damage transfer was 100%, AND went directly to internals.

[Tennex]

Chemie, on 31 July 2013 - 03:53 AM, said:

working as intended....Cent is the only viable medium mech as a result. Goes with the bugged spider as the best light option. Without a bugged hitbox (spider) and bugged damage transfer (applies to all mechs but Cent has build geometry which makes it most evident), we would have no role warfare.

clearly its not working as intended if only a few select mechs have the advantage of 75% damage reduction

[Braggart]

Mister Blastman, on 31 July 2013 - 07:16 AM, said:

That is a very interesting find. I wonder what else is goofy on the Cent. They sure manage to take more of a pounding than almost anything else out there... pound for pound.

it is several things. First the arms bug which is noted here, then it has an extremely small CT hitbox, which means most shots hit the side torsos, and when the side torsos are gone, only part of the damage hitting the side torsos gets transfered to the CT. This also the reason why the Stalker is so durable compared to the atlas.

[Murphy7]

Tennex, on 31 July 2013 - 07:07 AM, said:

In TT you can still roll a hit on a destroyed component. Wjen that happens 50% damage is passed to the next closest component going towards CT. For example destroyed arm100%->50%desroyed side torso->25%CT.So what is happening with the centurion is kind of TT rules.

Damage transfer in TT was 100%.. Location is destroyed, damage transfers first to the armor of the next location in and then to internals.

The exception was with torso Front/Rear armor... if you go through one side and the internals, the entire torso is gone (ie, you DO NOT shoot off the back armor from the front side before damage transfer) and damage transfers to the center.

The damage reduction you cite is something entirely of MWO. Now with respect to the Centurion, because the left torso retains the missile bay doors, is there greater damage reduction on that side than from the right side? That missile door nonsense could be creating a wierdly Centurion-based synergy with the bad damage transfer mechanic.

[Tennex]

Murphy7, on 31 July 2013 - 09:01 AM, said:

Damage transfer in TT was 100%.. Location is destroyed, damage transfers first to the armor of the next location in and then to internals.

The exception was with torso Front/Rear armor... if you go through one side and the internals, the entire torso is gone (ie, you DO NOT shoot off the back armor from the front side before damage transfer) and damage transfers to the center.

The damage reduction you cite is something entirely of MWO. Now with respect to the Centurion, because the left torso retains the missile bay doors, is there greater damage reduction on that side than from the right side? That missile door nonsense could be creating a wierdly Centurion-based synergy with the bad damage transfer mechanic.

Ah okay. Edited for correctness. So now this occurrence has even less basis for "working as intended"

[GODzillaGSPB]

If this is really working as intended I'd like that for all mechs. On the one hand it makes sense that there is still some protection left. And on the other hand...everything that makes battles last longer --> good for this game. As this is just a small thing I'd say make it happen / fix it for all the mechs.

[Chemie]

Tennex, on 31 July 2013 - 07:18 AM, said:

clearly its not working as intended if only a few select mechs have the advantage of 75% damage reduction

You clearly do not understand how PGI designs things.

[Murzao]

GODzillaGSPB, on 31 July 2013 - 09:47 AM, said:

If this is really working as intended I'd like that for all mechs. On the one hand it makes sense that there is still some protection left. And on the other hand...everything that makes battles last longer --> good for this game. As this is just a small thing I'd say make it happen / fix it for all the mechs.

I tested this in the Testing grounds and shot a Jenner through the arm and it took forever to core....as well as the Awesome. So it's not just mechs with big arms (tho the Cent has the best shield arm in the game it covers the head all the way down)........so ya......it's working as intended. I'm sure all mechs have it....just that other mechs like to facetank things whereas the Centurion pilot knows to keep his arm in front at all times.
My Wang has a big....'arm'.............ah Wang jokes they never get old. <3

Edited by Murzao, 31 July 2013 - 01:59 PM.

[stjobe]

GODzillaGSPB, on 31 July 2013 - 09:47 AM, said:

If this is really working as intended I'd like that for all mechs. On the one hand it makes sense that there is still some protection left. And on the other hand...everything that makes battles last longer --> good for this game. As this is just a small thing I'd say make it happen / fix it for all the mechs.

It is working like this for all 'mechs.

A shot-off arm leaves some debris on all 'mechs - it just happens to be fairly big on the Centurion. If your shot hits that debris, only 50% of the damage gets transfered to the side torso.

If the side torso is destroyed, all of it stays on the 'mech, and any further shots that hit there transfer only 50% of the damage to the CT.

Which means, that on all 'mechs with a shot-out side torso (and therefore arm), any shot that hits the arm debris will only do 25% damage to the CT.

It is working as intended, and it works the same for all 'mechs. However, the Centurion has very favourable hitboxes for this mechanic; a very narrow, hard to hit CT, very large and easy to hit side torsos, and very large arm debris - meaning it's far more likely that you'll hit either the arm debris or the side torso than the CT, and your shots will only do 25-50% of the damage.

Again, this is working as intended, and works the same across all 'mechs. Until someone digs up a dev quote stating otherwise, it's not a bug.