45 replies to this topic

[Slash Beastleo]

I totally agree. Many mechs have this issue, they have too big CT hitboxes, making them really hard to play. I've even noticed that if you shoot an Atlas in it's ***, you can actually damage the frontal center torso. And this solution of making the pelvis area part of the legs, I think is great.
There is a general problem of poorly designed hitboxes on this game, PGI has to deal with this issue as soon as posible. Not to mention the issue with the lack of properly hit detection, many people have been bitching about it lately, but that problem is not new at all.

[Dimzi]

I wanted to add my frustrations to this thread. I have played about 8 games with the Golden Boy and I have yet to die to anything other than my CT destroyed. At this point, there is no reason NOT to run XL because even if they are aiming for RT or LT, they will likely hit the CT. Brawling is impossible, you explode if anyone looks at you. I have tried sacrificing rear armor to add front CT armor but it didn't seem to help at all. I'm hoping the Kintaro hitboxes are looked at because this Mech is unplayable as anything other than LRM boat.

[Carrioncrows]

I was hoping there would of been something in the Hot-fix, but NOPE.

I want to use my KTO so badly but it's nothing but a ball of frustration, I sincerely hope they other KTO's do not launch like this.

[General Taskeen]

The hitbox suggestions for splitting the leg hitboxes on Mechs in the groin/hip area should definitely be forwarded to PGI, if it hasn't already. At least then they could tell us if that is even possible at this point.

[Alaskan Nobody]

Started to read - stopped when I realized you were more yelling opinions than actually trying to make a point.

Sad part is - I agree with most of what you said.

Please: if you are going to post like this, PLEASE try to recognize the difference between an opinion and a fact.

IE - killing by legging - what is a mech going to do after you blow both legs off?
Answer - fall face first into the dirt and lie there (effectively out of the match) unless you have an Elite pilot in it
- and how few of us are going to qualify that way?

[Carrioncrows]

Shar Wolf, on 08 August 2013 - 06:40 PM, said:

Started to read - stopped when I realized you were more yelling opinions than actually trying to make a point.

Sad part is - I agree with most of what you said.

Please: if you are going to post like this, PLEASE try to recognize the difference between an opinion and a fact.

IE - killing by legging - what is a mech going to do after you blow both legs off?
Answer - fall face first into the dirt and lie there (effectively out of the match) unless you have an Elite pilot in it
- and how few of us are going to qualify that way?

I am passionate.

Posts are driven through that passion, either because I have a great Idea that i want to share, or i am so frustrated I want to punch kittens in the face.

This is a case of the latter.

To Clarify and repeat what I said to another player is in MWO you don't "BLOW" off the legs. You Blow off the arms sure, you can see them go flying. But you do not Blow off the legs, you just ruin them turning it into a peg leg.

So yes "Blowing" off both legs would cause the mech to be knocked down, but then the pilot would stand back up and his speed would be reduced permanently to 15%

This is more than reasonable compromise and PGI already has the in game assets to make it happen, they only have to activate them.

It's a solution that isn't any more or less realistic than anything else in MWO, but what it is; is a solution that would solve a lot of issues and alleviate a lot of stress. At least for me.

[Alaskan Nobody]

-passion has nothing to do with opinion-vs-fact.

Big difference between blowing the legs OFF, and crippling them my friend - hitting a commando or god forbid- flea/locust in the leg with dual-AC20 would BLOW THEM OFF - nothing to stand back up ON.

-and I say that as a dedicated commando pilot - no I do not like being legged any more than anyone else does - but it is as fair a kill method as anything else.

Edit: they do not actually remove the legs for the same reasons they did not in Mech4 - balance reasons.

Does not mean that that is not what we are supposed to understand to be happening.

Edited by Shar Wolf, 08 August 2013 - 07:36 PM.

[Carrioncrows]

Shar Wolf, on 08 August 2013 - 07:35 PM, said:

-passion has nothing to do with opinion-vs-fact.

Big difference between blowing the legs OFF, and crippling them my friend - hitting a commando or god forbid- flea/locust in the leg with dual-AC20 would BLOW THEM OFF - nothing to stand back up ON.

-and I say that as a dedicated commando pilot - no I do not like being legged any more than anyone else does - but it is as fair a kill method as anything else.

Edit: they do not actually remove the legs for the same reasons they did not in Mech4 - balance reasons.

Does not mean that that is not what we are supposed to understand to be happening.

Are we arguing over what's in Table top, what's in MWO, the Point I am making, my grammar or my choice in words.

You said you agree with me, at least in part.

So honestly what's the deal? It's a video game, I get that it's inspired by table top but they still have their own translation / version of what they believe happens when you make a turn based board game into a real time simulator.

The solution is less to deal with truth and more to deal with balance.

Don't let the facts of the fictional robot lore trip you up too much, if we did a lot more of us would be demanding Melee Combat.

[Alaskan Nobody]

My problem being the way you phrased it - I apologize:

I was venting at you for what I feel is a stupid amount of opinionization in the forums - 'I feel this way so this way it SHOULD be'

I should not have done that.

However: my point still stands - I did not finish what you wrote BECAUSE of the way you wrote it - you phrasing was opinion, yet you demanded it be as you want - and that is not the way to get what you want, esp if part of what you want is to be treated as an adult.

On the other hand - your responses have been FAR more mature than your initial post - hence my apology.

....Still not finishing your initial post though.

[Bjorn Fjord]

I have to say the Golden Boy seems like a huge waste of money. If it were possible I would return it or trade it for another Mech. In every battle I have tried it it has been cored incredibly fast. In one encounter it was dead within 2-3 seconds of contact with the ememy. We saw eachother, fired and then the core was gone.
In looking at imaged out for the Hitbox it apears the shoulders are the only thing considered to be left or right torso. I may be able to strip out some weapons and ammo to give me room to boost the armor in the CT but with a hit box that big and everybody knowing it It would likely only buy me a few more seconds.
For now all I can do is keep her in the bay and hope it gets fixed.

[Training Instructor]

Can't say I didn't predict this when I saw the video of the mech.

How soon we forget that PGI's test team appears to specialize in eliminating movement bugs, which is why you almost never get stuck on maps, even new ones. For this we can thank them. What they do not specialize in though is actual mech combat using competitive loadouts. And most PGI employees are the same, even the designers. They don't play enough at a high enough level to understand what a horrible, horrible idea that Kintaro's hitboxes are.

I'm a middle of the road player, and I can blow a golden boy away pretty freaking quick because the CT is very difficult to miss, and he's not all that fast, even with an XL. I'm guessing that their sales of this mech are along the lines of the Fang and The Death's Knell....aka super disappointing. Veteran players saw their video and immediately recognized the flaw in the design.

[Braggart]

This needs to be at the top of this forum at all times.

PGI has to see the horrible horrible errors they make.

[Carrioncrows]

Then again this whole thread could just of been wrote off as "Noise"

I am honestly surprised it hasn't been hot fixed, at least the hit boxes.

[Braggart]

noise eventually gets noticed though.

It just takes a long time for PGI to realize their failures, and then maybe a stupid fix that doesnt fix the problem. So atleast we can give somewhat of a fix.

[Apoc1138]

the hitbox split itself is bad, but the bigger problem is the fact that this mech is much bigger than other mechs which are heavier than it, which makes no sense, it is in fact bigger than pretty much all of the heavy mechs, which just makes it a big fat easy target

[Menetius]

In previous titles, destroying one leg would completely immobilize you (MW2), if not permanently reduce you to a meager limp similar to the movement in MWO when your leg is initially destroyed (Mechcommander/Mechwarrior 3). Why would the definition of "destroyed" in the paper doll damage display change for just the legs?

When a leg is destroyed, it is destroyed. All actuators, myomers, and components experience catastrophic failure. The leg is dead weight; it cannot move, it simply serves as a second point of contact with the ground to keep you from falling over. If both legs are destroyed, the mech cannot get back up, because all of its leg-myomers have failed.

[Carrioncrows]

Here is my policy when it comes to hit boxes.


If I torso twist and turn away from my attacker and you can still hit my CT, then it's a bad design.

The whole point of rolling your torso and physically having your mech turn away from the attack is to protect your damaged locations.

If the hit boxes are so big you can not do that, then it's a bad design.

This more so than anything else is why the pelvis / hip area needs remapped.

Edited by Carrioncrows, 10 August 2013 - 03:04 PM.

[aniviron]

Tennex, on 07 August 2013 - 12:30 PM, said:

Jagermech is a horrible example of how hitbox should be.

its impossible to run XL on because of how big the R/L torso is. and once you lose the R/Ltorso you lose half your weapons since most of its armaments are loaded on the arms.

It's funny to see how sad having big side torsos to you. When running a Jenner or Awesome, I would kill to have hitboxes like that. Oh boo-hoo, you lost half your weapons. It's a darn sight better than losing them all because all the incoming fire hits your massive CT. You don't get to have a small CT and small side torsi, you have to choose one or the other. The stalker has gigantic side torsos and you don't see stalker pilots sad about this. Know why the stalker is considered to be one of the best mechs? Because its CT is so tiny, it lasts forever

[FupDup]

Tennex, on 07 August 2013 - 12:30 PM, said:

Jagermech is a horrible example of how hitbox should be.

its impossible to run XL on because of how big the R/L torso is. and once you lose the R/Ltorso you lose half your weapons since most of its armaments are loaded on the arms.

Well, the Stalker certainly seems to be enjoying its very large side torsos despite also losing half of its weapons when a side is blown off...

Edited by FupDup, 10 August 2013 - 07:26 PM.

[Menetius]

Carrion, I agree with your hitbox philosophy.

However, I strongly disagree with your proposal on leg damage.