91 replies to this topic

[Trauglodyte]

We all know that weight limitations are coming and it is greatly needed. So, I got to thinking about it and I think that 675 tons about does it. If they do that and implemented the need for weight class "musts" and "restrictions", it would work to make the game more fluid. The "musts" include:

- 2 Lights
- 4 Mediums
- 2 Heavies
- 1 Assault

The restrictions could be:

- no more then 2 Assaults
- no more then 4 Lights

That would leave the MM/12v12 group creater with 3 mechs of which the weight classes would be of their choosing. And it would prevent the bastardization that would come with groups trying to go 50/50 on Assaults and Lights.

Under this guideline, you could go with:

1 Atlas
2 Orions
2 Locusts
7 Shadowhawks/Kintaros

1 Atlas
2 Orions
2 Ravens/Jenners
4 Shadowhawks/Kintaros
2 Cicadas
1 Hunchback/Centurion/Trebuchet

2 Atlases
2 Orions
2 Ravens/Jenners
1 Shadowhawk/Kintaro
5 Cicadas

2 Stalkers
3 Cataphracts
3 Spiders
1 Shadowhawk/Kintaro
3 Hunchbacks/Centurions/Trebuchets

Thoughts?

Edited by Trauglodyte, 07 August 2013 - 12:54 PM.

[Joseph Mallan]

And what about those of us who want to be an Assault Company???
<-------- Notice the Mailed Fist.

Edited by Joseph Mallan, 07 August 2013 - 12:58 PM.

[Bilbo]

Joseph Mallan, on 07 August 2013 - 12:57 PM, said:

And what about those of us who want to be an Assault Company???
<-------- Notice the Mailed Fist.

Wait until private matches are available?

[Joseph Mallan]

Bilbo, on 07 August 2013 - 12:59 PM, said:

Wait until private matches are available?

Why should I need to? Folks need to get ready to fight Assault forces as well as Light Cavalry, Learn now, so you are ready when the game is launched in Sept.

[Trauglodyte]

Joseph Mallan, on 07 August 2013 - 12:57 PM, said:

And what about those of us who want to be an Assault Company???
<-------- Notice the Mailed Fist.

Well, I'd first say that Katrina is a backstabbing psycho bi-tch and then say that I enjoy the Steiner scout lance as much as anyone. The question I'd come back with is this: Is the Assault Company healthy for the game?

That being said, I'm just spitballing on weight. But you know it is coming and soon. If 12v12 shows anything, its that games exceeding 900 tons isn't a good thing.

Edited by Trauglodyte, 07 August 2013 - 01:03 PM.

[Bilbo]

Joseph Mallan, on 07 August 2013 - 01:01 PM, said:

Why should I need to? Folks need to get ready to fight Assault forces as well as Light Cavalry, Learn now, so you are ready when the game is launched in Sept.

I'm pretty much done with learning to fight in assault heavy matches. Been doing it since CB and there is nothing else to learn in that regard. Same goes for light heavy matches. It's well past time for them to implement drop weight restrictions at both ends of the spectrum.

[Joseph Mallan]

Trauglodyte, on 07 August 2013 - 01:02 PM, said:

Well, I'd first say that Katrina is a backstabbing psycho bi-tch and then say that I enjoy the Steiner scout lance as much as anyone. The question I'd come back with is this: Is the Assault Company healthy for the game?

That being said, I'm just spitballing on weight. But you know it is coming and soon. If 12v12 shows anything, its that games exceeding 900 tons isn't a good thing.

Yes it is. There are plenty of them in Lore. I intend on getting into the 10th Lyran Guards

Quote

In 3025 their nickname was the "Thundering Elephants" because of their heavy 'Mech complement and unimaginative tactics.

I don't want to see this group being hamstrung because players don't want to fight a strong force.

Edited by Joseph Mallan, 07 August 2013 - 01:14 PM.

[AntiSqueaker]

Anyone who has played the game over the past....well, since Closed Beta has learned how to fight against Assault Companies.

I say bring on Drop Limits, the sooner the better. Anything around 600-725ish tons sounds good to me. I'm long tired of being one of 2-3 mechs under 65 tons on the field.

[AgroAlba]

Sounds good to me. I think Assaults should be limited to a max of 3, personally.

[Dan Nashe]

6 atlas and 6 locusts is 720. So I vote 720.
As much as mediums are the workhorse, 3/3/3/3 is probably better because people clearly like heavies and assaults.

6 50 tonners and 6 70 tonners also 720.
3-30, 3-50, 3-65, 3-90 is 705?
So yeah, 720 for 8 man's.

For lances, make it 300, for pug matches. 4 orions, or two atlai and two cents.
For pugs though, keep weight class matching, so you can still run a fast lance. And be roughly balanced.

I actually like using tonnage to balance 12s, and weight class to balance pugs, with pugs having max tonnage of 300 per 4 man group queing. It helps with variety.
300 also lso prevents 4 assault mechs, but allows pretty heavy lances.
But 320 is doable. ( 4 awesomes)

[Joseph Mallan]

Panzies.

[Trauglodyte]

Quote

In 3025 their nickname was the "Thundering Elephants" because of their heavy 'Mech complement and unimaginative tactics.

But aren't Elephants supposed to be frightened of mice? My Locusts/Cicadas will trounce all of them as they turn tail and run

Truth be told, I'm ok with a heavier weight allowance. But, the MM either needs a hard limit with restrictions or the MM needs to be based on a combination of ELO, weight, and weight class matching (from the old days). Allowing games to go on when you're out gunned by 150+ tons in 8v8 was bad and will be worse with 12v12. I just want balanced games where being in something less then 60 tons doesn't mean that you're obliterated in one alpha by one mech.

DanNashe, on 07 August 2013 - 01:15 PM, said:

6 atlas and 6 locusts is 720. So I vote 720.
As much as mediums are the workhorse, 3/3/3/3 is probably better because people clearly like heavies and assaults.

My thinking was based on the generic layouts for usual lance makeups. In lore, a lot of lances were 1 Light, 2 Mediums, and 1 Heavy. A heavy lance was usually 2 Mediums, 1 Heavy, and 1 Assault. Steiner considered 4 Victors to be a light lance - silly Steiners. Under 2 normal lances and heavy lance, even taking into account average weights per class (with unreleased mechs allowed), you get about 675 tons. PGI is going to need to be clever - I know, I know - to keep organized 12 man groups from geeking the system. Even at 700 tons, you could do 6 Stalkers and a 6 Spiders/Jenners/Ravens which would equate to complete chaos.

Edited by Trauglodyte, 07 August 2013 - 01:25 PM.

[Dan Nashe]

Alternatively, I highly support changing the weight limit monthly. Mix it up.

[CG Oglethorpe Kerensky]

You heard wrong.

Weight balancing is NOT coming.
Weight minimums are coming, a team must be ->THIS<- Heavy to get a match.
The real sad part, what just breaks my heart, is that I couldn't make this up to troll the community. What is actually happening is far worse than anything I would have imagined.

From a balance standpoint it works. Everyone is in assaults so only a few mechs to balance, speed cap is off the table, and the current meta lives on.

[Ralgas]

Probably should be a separate game mode, same as 1pv/3pv. I'd say 280 ton per lance involved (2 assults/2 lights or any mix in between)

[Dimento Graven]

Not interested in weight limitations. Only interested in weight balance when setting up drops.

Two totally completely different things, only slightly related though:

A weight limitation, puts limits on what types of 'mechs you can drop with.

Weight balance makes sure that no one side has an extreme advantage by bringing 12 assaults when the other team only brought 4...

[Ralgas]

CG Oglethorpe Kerensky, on 07 August 2013 - 01:27 PM, said:

You heard wrong.

Weight balancing is NOT coming.
Weight minimums are coming, a team must be ->THIS<- Heavy to get a match.
The real sad part, what just breaks my heart, is that I couldn't make this up to troll the community. What is actually happening is far worse than anything I would have imagined.

From a balance standpoint it works. Everyone is in assaults so only a few mechs to balance, speed cap is off the table, and the current meta lives on.

source?

[AntiSqueaker]

CG Oglethorpe Kerensky, on 07 August 2013 - 01:27 PM, said:

You heard wrong.

Weight balancing is NOT coming.
Weight minimums are coming, a team must be ->THIS<- Heavy to get a match.
The real sad part, what just breaks my heart, is that I couldn't make this up to troll the community. What is actually happening is far worse than anything I would have imagined.

From a balance standpoint it works. Everyone is in assaults so only a few mechs to balance, speed cap is off the table, and the current meta lives on.

I'd be interested to see a source for this, because it states in the patch notes that the 5-11 premade queues "will be addressed when we get tonnage limits into the game".

Nowhere have I seen or heard of anything like what you're saying.

(ninja edited for a bit of clarity)

Edited by AntiSqueaker, 07 August 2013 - 01:33 PM.

[Tezcatli]

I really don't think they'll be that restrictive. Which is fine. As long as the team that decides to drop with four Assaults is balanced out by either lighter mechs or even less mechs entirely. I'm especially eager to see the latter.

[keith]

the thing i would love for pgi to do, is weekly tonnage limits. maybe 1 week it would be more lights. next week more heavy to assaults. this is turn would make ppl buy more bays or mechs. depending on their cash flow. maybe on wednesday or thursday, assume every friday they could change limit, announce the new limit.