29 replies to this topic

[Oni Ralas]

So, I've been messing around with the Jenner as of late. Started with Sarah's mech, then I bought the other 2 just to have them. I'm not...doing well to say the least. I dig the speed, I can 180 with JJ's just fine - but I get nailed by *every* bit of fire out there. What's odd about this is that typically when I'm fighting lights, we've always got a harder time brining them down due to registration and/or just other goofiness. Most of it boils down to the pings - when fighting lights, the 'ol lag shield is still there (dispite the HSR claims).

I typically have a ping in the 40-60ms range. I'm eating way too much fire even at 140kph and maneuvering behind over. I don't brawl much and go for flank shots ala Dragon style. Are lower pings really playing into it, or is it all in my head? Don't have an issue with the spider (but truth be told, it's somewhat broken at the moment due to the small profile and hitbox - but in a good way I suppose).

[Bront]

Tips on not getting hit.

1) Never stand still.
2) Never run in a strait line.
3) Hit and run when you're alone. You can circle the slow assaults, but a good assault pilot only needs 1-2 shots to take out a leg or torso if they hit.
4) Chaos is your shield. Let the other mechs take your shots, and join in and harrass your opponents. If they target you, run and avoid the hits (and let larget mechs take them out with rear shots).
5) Cap stuff. In conquest, it's not unusual for a team to lose to a lone light mech who was wise about capping early and often.. In assault, a base cap can get you a sneaky win, or pull some of their mechs away from the fight.
6) Lights can swam, take advantage of it. Grouping up with 2-3 lights you can give you a huge advantage in tactical flexabilty.
7) There's no shame in the 0 damage game if you helped the team win. Ignore folks who whinge about capping. Without capping, there's no point in mechs under 60 tons most of the time.

Remember, you're in a light mech, not an assault mech. Adjust your expectations accordingly. For me, I find I rarely get kills in my Jenner other than the occasional light, mop up, lucky shot, or Atlas (I'd swear half my kills are Atlasses, it's probably closer to 20-25%), but it's rare I don't have at least 5 assists and 100 points of damage, and if I've done some capping, distracted some bigger mechs or kept the little ones off my team's heavier mechs, I've filled my role, and if our team (PUGS) isn't particularly incompitent or we're not up against a superiorly coordinated team, we tend to win.

Ultimately, have fun. If the Jenner play style doesn't suit you, well, you gave to charity and you gave it a try. Nothing wrong with that.

[Tynan]

Jenners aren't the easiest things to hit, but they do have massive CTs. Bront's suggestions are all solid.

Definitely travel in groups, when possible. One jenner is irritating, two in concert are deadly. Use seismic if you've got it to find larger mechs straying away from the back, or look for LRM boats that are too far from the main pack to get easy assistance. Jenners pack a LOT of firepower for their size, and people without good situational awareness can be made to pay for it.

Like with any other flanking mech, let others engage first. Pick a damaged target, jump in, hit, jump out. I've found I do best--and am most helpful to my team--when using my speed to wait for a damaged heavy or assault to try to retreat and picking him off when my own assaults can't (or shouldn't) follow. In most cases, if the enemy has larger, more threatening targets, you can get by with scratches. I've played many, many matches where I'll take some fire (sometimes serious fire) during the opening scouting action but still end up with over 400 damage and still alive simply by shadowing the larger mechs.

It takes some patience and getting used to, but properly run Jenners are wonderful. Good hunting!

[DegeneratePervert]

Utilize the Jump Jets, dude. Maximum speed and flying around the map, zigzagging in unpredictable patterns. As far as supporting your team, if you see bigger mechs in a fight, notice what part of the mech your ally is shooting at. Focus fire on that part (on the F, 6x Medium Lasers alpha'd can do serious damage), and help him win the battle. It is my philosophy that I'm not there to get kills, only assists, until I'm the last one left.

Also, in Light v. Light scenarios, the 6x MLs tear up enemy legs.

[Kiiyor]

DegeneratePervert, on 28 July 2013 - 01:21 PM, said:

Utilize the Jump Jets, dude. Maximum speed and flying around the map, zigzagging in unpredictable patterns. As far as supporting your team, if you see bigger mechs in a fight, notice what part of the mech your ally is shooting at. Focus fire on that part (on the F, 6x Medium Lasers alpha'd can do serious damage), and help him win the battle. It is my philosophy that I'm not there to get kills, only assists, until I'm the last one left.

Also, in Light v. Light scenarios, the 6x MLs tear up enemy legs.

+1 for JJ usage. If you're taking fire, you can also lightly tap the space bar to create an old fashioned bond-style smoke screen that actually does help make you harder to hit. Just make sure you don't hold your taps too long or you'll become airborne and bleed speed, then whatever mechs bleed when you get annihilated.

The concept of cover doesn't just lend itself to hills and buildings either; even small depressions in the ground can cover your legs.

I find I survive longest if I give myself very strict break-off rules also. If I'm fighting more than 2 of anything in anything more protracted than a drive-by, I break off. If I'm far from my group and gain the attention of ANYTHING that outranges my mlas, I break off.

Also, you should always be moving perpendicular to the enemy. Zig zag. Straight lines are for wankers. Lights moving towards you are waaaaay easier to hit.

Your best bet is to scout a bit, and hang with other lights if you can. Then wait for your team to engage. Jenners can brawl with larger targets if they need to, but the role they excel at, where they are utterly DEVESTATING, is as an opportunist. You need to charge through the battle lines, shooting at backs, CTs, anything, keeping the enemy off balance. One drive-by or back shot on an LRM boat or sniper at the back of an enemy group can be enough to make them seek cover, or die if they ignore you. If there are no other enemies about you CAN slow and take that extra second or two to line up a good shot. In harier fights, don't brawl, ESPECIALLY if there are other enemies blasting away at you

There is no better armour for a Jenner than chaos.

All in all though, Jenners are an advanced platform. You die a lot piloting them. I dropped with PEEF and Ed a few times in the light tourney they smashed recently, and even they were one-two shot a few times.

[ShinVector]

Alot of good advice already said above.
It is always good hear feedback pilots that lights aren't as OP or hard to hit as stated to be. It is the light pilot's job to make that happen.

Just to add abit on the topic of situational aware. Yep. Multi v 1 is a bad idea and should be avoided unless you have a death wish or confident in your skills.
To go into more detail... You should always try to be aware what are the weapons your opponents are carrying.
All ballistics (PPCs, AC20, Gauss etc..) are much much more dangerous to light now in the hand of competent pilots.
Lasers are much less dangerous because they are damage over time.
Streaks used to be a major pain in the ***... but not since the nerf.
Just remember ERPPC, ERPPC, ERPPC, Gauss (maybe minus 1 ERPPC)... Is extremely deadly to lights and should be avoided in 1v1.

[Oni Ralas]

All the info given is good, but nothing new to me. I'm not off doing stupid **** in the mechs or anything. The only feedback I got from testing with others on comms was how easy it was to hit *ME* vs. another team mate, even in the same chassis and same speed. Difference? 30ms ping for me, 100ms for him. Meh, The Jenner is ok - I'll stick to my mediums for the most part. All the speed, none of the issues.

[Mindwipe]

Sorry Oni Ralas, but yeah, low ping means very little to no lag shield. My lights die quickly if I'm either careless, stupid or unlucky. All you can try to do is limit the first two and pray the last doesn't happen.

My ping is usually in the 40's to 60's as well although my buddy seems to sit at 10-12 ping and he's just finding out the joys of lights. The plus side is that you learn to play very well or die constantly and the constant netcode adjustments don't really bother you since you've never relied on the lag shield.

It's worth the effort in my view, I hate playing anything but lights now, tinfoil armour or not.

[slayerkdm]

Sarah was my first real venture into lights myself.

I was really terrible at first, and never sure of my role. I have settled into general strategy now that works for me.

I know some things I have learned I never did before in my Mediums or Heavy's. I run now, alot! Out numbered, I run, Out gunned, I usually run. Badly damaged I run. As a medium player, I figured my job was to hit hard, take someone with me, flank if I could. I worked hard for kills. I dont really worry about kills in my Sarah. I always want to get some, but I wont focus on getting one, if its a tough situation. With my HBK 4G I would fight to the death, but it seems a waste in my Jenner, so I dont if the odds are against me. I know my team is relying on me for other things at times.

I find the Sarah very fun, and I think its my second favorite mech behind my Founders Hunchback.

I still struggle with load out, but have settled on the rather boring 4 Mlas build.

[Squash]

I might have read over someone else saying it, but when you fight other lights, go for the legs! I haven't had much of a problem with legging lights (I run a jenner-F, favorite mech!) as of late. They can't shield legs or distribute damage by torso twisting and nothing dies faster than a legged light (well nothing should in theory...). Most light pilots will disengage when their legs turn red.

As for surviving longer, always go the longer way around (keep in mind seismic is 180m); You have the speed. If you can sneak up and pester bigs by shooting their backs, even just a nice love tap, it's usually enough to get them to turn around and see who is back there. Then run off like a giggling ***** and find someone else to pester. Come back 15-20 seconds later and hit them again.

And lastly, pay attention to how fast a big is moving and their respective armament. If they're moving way too fast for how many weapons they're carrying, go for a ST, they probably have XL. You can take down XL mechs real fast with a couple ML alphas to a rear ST. Usually (emphasis on usually) jagers, cataphracts, and victors have XL. atlas/stalker are more rare.

Feel free to add me to your friends and I'll run with you. Good luck

[mailin]

My Jenner D is loaded with 2 streaks and a BAP. Despite the recent nerf to streaks, they are still deadly to lights. SRMs are pretty wicked too, as is an LB10X. If your enemy has any of those weapons, I suggest not taking them on one-on-one for now. Most of the previous advice is solid, to very solid, with the exception of the advice to cap. Capping is great if there is a strategy to it other than, "well I ran all the way to enemy base immediately so I'm gonna cap for the win". I have seen that too often and I will usually boo at it. Too many people don't understand, or fail to appreciate that there is a strategy to capping. Feel free to take the enemy cap down to as much as 90% once the main enemy force is engaged with friendlies. But, get off before winning. While you're there, notice how your team is doing. If the score is 5-0 in your favor, get off cap and engage. If it's the other way around, stay on cap and win it if you can. If enemies show up trying to retake the cap, notice their numbers. If it's more than 1, get out of there, rejoin your team, while typing in chat how many came back to base and what they were. Remember that the job of a light is to spot, harass and annoy the enemy. If you can do this and be alive at the end of the game, damage and kills don't matter.

[Khanublikhan]

MWO is a game of armour ablation. As a light pilot you obviously have less armour to protect yourself for the entire duration of a match. With that in mind, the opening minutes of a match are the most dangerous for a Jenner pilot. You can over-extend yourself positionally and tactically and get torn up.

• Wait, wait, wait for the moment to properly commit your Jenner.
  
• R target enemy mechs and look for those out of position or with armour punctured through to internals.
  
• Use your speed as a light strike mech against that wounded foe.

Thinking about it, this is not that different to how some Medium mechs works.

In short, don't overcommit - make the best use of your armour.

[Maximilian]

All good advice.

Another one is to try and time your opponent's shots (in case of one-on-one, but you can do it for more after some time).

Harrass them and make them chase you. Most of them WILL.

And dont worry about kills. SAVIOUR KILLS on the other hand dont need a registered kill to you and gives more xp/money!

[Darwins Dog]

The jenner is the ideal striker or hit-and-run mech imo. You have a pretty good punch and the ability to get out of a bad situation. Stick near the flanks of the main group. Try to stay out of sight of the enemy team if you can. When the fighting starts, find a good position, fire a couple of volleys then back off to cool down and reposition. Never fire from the same place twice if you can help it. Also remember to have an escape route in mind when you engage. Usually when I die in a Jenner it's because I engage when I have no path of escape, or I chose one that had enemies in it.

[Hammerhai]

well, thank you for at least trying life as a light pilot. Have fun.

[Silentium]

I think plenty of folks said it better. Truly, timing is everything, and that can be difficult to get used to; I think the best advice so far is waiting until your team has engaged, and then quickly evening the odds for outnumbered drop mates where you are needed most.

I would add this though: you may feel tempted to hunt other lights, but try to avoid this unless they are capping or backstabbing your mates. Many of the veteran light pilots out there will just drag you back to their heavies, or else waste your time while the rest of your team is getting owned.

[k0sh]

Bront, on 28 July 2013 - 08:14 AM, said:

Tips on not getting hit.

1) Never stand still.
2) Never run in a strait line.
3) Hit and run when you're alone. You can circle the slow assaults, but a good assault pilot only needs 1-2 shots to take out a leg or torso if they hit.
4) Chaos is your shield. Let the other mechs take your shots, and join in and harrass your opponents. If they target you, run and avoid the hits (and let larget mechs take them out with rear shots).
5) Cap stuff. In conquest, it's not unusual for a team to lose to a lone light mech who was wise about capping early and often.. In assault, a base cap can get you a sneaky win, or pull some of their mechs away from the fight.
6) Lights can swam, take advantage of it. Grouping up with 2-3 lights you can give you a huge advantage in tactical flexabilty.
7) There's no shame in the 0 damage game if you helped the team win. Ignore folks who whinge about capping. Without capping, there's no point in mechs under 60 tons most of the time.

Remember, you're in a light mech, not an assault mech. Adjust your expectations accordingly. For me, I find I rarely get kills in my Jenner other than the occasional light, mop up, lucky shot, or Atlas (I'd swear half my kills are Atlasses, it's probably closer to 20-25%), but it's rare I don't have at least 5 assists and 100 points of damage, and if I've done some capping, distracted some bigger mechs or kept the little ones off my team's heavier mechs, I've filled my role, and if our team (PUGS) isn't particularly incompitent or we're not up against a superiorly coordinated team, we tend to win.

Ultimately, have fun. If the Jenner play style doesn't suit you, well, you gave to charity and you gave it a try. Nothing wrong with that.

Pretty much this.
I'm playing this game for 3 weeks so far and I love Jenner and I don't think I'll ever play any other mechs unless I get bored.
Look at the picture

[Maximilian]

k0sh, on 03 August 2013 - 10:46 PM, said:

I'm playing this game for 3 weeks so far and I love Jenner and I don't think I'll ever play any other mechs unless I get bored.

Truth is that you don't get bored playing with Jenner!

[Bront]

Maximilian, on 04 August 2013 - 07:15 AM, said:

Truth is that you don't get bored playing with Jenner!

Yeah, it's likely to get bored with you and run off first.

[Artgathan]

I often see light pilots use their JJ as often as possible / to execute fancy maneuvers (such as the 180 turn). THIS IS A MISTAKE.

Your JJ, when used for long flights, make you extremely vulnerable as you travel in a set path at a set speed. Essentially while you're executing a 180, you're a 35-ton clay pigeon. They also decrease your speed on landing, giving you a fraction of a second when you are standing still (and thus an easy target).

Jump Jets should be used to:

• Clear Obstacles (including enemy mechs) or Escape over Ridges
  
• Dodge (by tapping them quickly you can throw off an enemy's aim and cause a miss)

I will repeat: fancy jump jet maneuvers are awful when engaging anything heavier than another light mech. They leave you extremely vulnerable. Before HSR started getting messed up every time I saw a Spider jump jetting into the sky all I could think was "fireworks" as I put an AC/20 into it's CT.

Be careful with your JJs. They can help a lot, but they can also hurt a lot.