361 replies to this topic

[TKG]

Ian, on 12 June 2012 - 09:52 PM, said:

But all of these are irrelevant to random having fun battles. Statistics such as these are only important to units choosing people for important battles (such as the battle for a planet).

If I recall right BTU an old MW4 vegeance planetary league did something like this and it was very effective.

[Homadais]

I agree with the mojority here. Stats should only be available to you and you alone, unless you choose to devolge it to others. It is a horage thing in WoT. In my own clan in WoT it has caused internal striff cause of our clan stat mongers. So even your team having access to your stats can cause problems. Pluse the stats do not tell the whole story on how a person plays the game. They could play really well and just have really bad luck with bad teams. Happens all of the time on WoT. Just plain and simple wory about your self and stop worring about how everyone else does. Just my two sense.

Edited by Homadais, 12 June 2012 - 10:46 PM.

[Heldar1]

I'm ok with stats. To an extent. Stats for me to see, great! Lets me know what I need to improve on. Stats for everyone to see? No, I don't need some ****** that pads stats/plays a certain style (BF3 anyone?) just to get good KDR or win rates. Stats for the match maker to use to put me in an even and fair match, HELL YES! That is the extent stats should be, in my book.

[Parnage Winters]

I'll put it to you like this, Stats will be tracked. One way or another. If it's not in the game people will go outside the game to try and track it. For no other reason because they want to know for themselves.(Even League has a few sites and programs to track elo even at normals a very silly thing but people want to see it)

In the end, these stat's don't hurt you. They are information and data to be used how you see fit. If it's not in game people will find another way even if it's so simple as screen capturing the victory screen/break downs at the end of a match.

I never understood the idea of people disliking information. What you mean to say I think is you don't want this information readily open to everyone and anyone which is a more worthwhile topic.

Perhaps some sort of option to allow or disallow others from looking at ones personal stats.

[Homadais]

Its not that the information may not be good for you. Your stats can benifit you yes. Its an unfortunet that others would use that information to pre-judge others and even in extreem cases harass others just for their disillusioned beilef that the stats makes the player.

P.S. Anyone know how to turn on spell check in this dambed fourm.

[Turbo]

How about just showing average xp earned in battles, that would be a much more individual indication of skill rather than win rate or KDR. As a player of WOT and several mech games, i understand how kdr is negated by how many times ive knocked people down to 10% health or less only to have somebody get the kill shot. As previously stated win rate is too dependant on your team to be considered an individual stat.

[jbev]

Stats and stat tracking allow leaders to evaluate potential talent. The same people claim that Stats Don't Matter as go apoplectic when they are mentioned.

The only constant is you in all of the games and the more games you play, the more accurate Win Rate determines your broad ability to aid your team in winning.

[SpiralRazor]

KDA isnt as important in this game...if your lights and mediums are out there spotting, drawing fire and sowing discord-- and not killing---then they are doing there jobs and are positively an asset to your lance.

If your Atlas pilot however has a crap KDA...you may want to offer training or advice.

[jbev]

being able to look at stats of other players gives you intel about which ones should be destroyed first as they represent the most danger

Want to improve your W/L ratio? Know who you are fighting. I feel that some sort of efficiency rating/win rates/total battles fought is very helpful to this end.

[WalkingDeathBot]

jbev, on 13 June 2012 - 12:27 AM, said:

being able to look at stats of other players gives you intel about which ones should be destroyed first as they represent the most danger

Want to improve your W/L ratio? Know who you are fighting. I feel that some sort of efficiency rating/win rates/total battles fought is very helpful to this end.

very helpful but often maddening and fun sapping......especially if anything more than for personal use i.e. public stats

[Freyar]

The bottom line is that while people say "It's easy to ignore them", communities don't. They need to be private and stay that way.

[Antaumus]

That's a hard one, have all the stats for personal use but as for which ones are public... Win/loss means nothing you could be the best mech pilot in the world and get matched with worse team mates and have your score lowered. Kill/death? Assaults will wipe the floor, so also useless. I think the only way to be fair in a game like this is a score based system score/games. Then that just makes another problem how to score a game? Whats a kill worth? what's a scout worth? What's assist/helping do damage worth? But as far as I see score/games is the only way to rank a mech pilot. But yes leave in w/l and k/d, just make them private.

[GHQCommander]

Are you saying you don't want other players to know if your rubbish at the game and let you play with them despite being a weak link on a team? Is anyone that bad at games that their ratio should be far below average. It is a PvP game, it is all about human to human competition. I can't think of any better reason to have scores, ratios and percentages within competition.

Stats encourages players to try and not be lazy or throw games or test new builds without a care to mission objectives or team work or whatever other reason players don't enter a match to co-operate

[Freyar]

GHQCommander, on 13 June 2012 - 01:11 AM, said:

Are you saying you don't want other players to know if your rubbish at the game and let you play with them despite being a weak link on a team? Is anyone that bad at games that their ratio should be far below average. It is a PvP game, it is all about human to human competition. I can't think of any better reason to have scores, ratios and percentages within competition.

Stats encourages players to try and not be lazy or throw games or test new builds without a care to mission objectives or team work or whatever other reason players don't enter a match to co-operate

I'm saying that stats, with the way they are generated, are not a good way to properly collect information and display how "good" a player is, moreso when a random element such as matchmaking is involved. This is even more of an issue in team-oriented games (unlike Call of Duty) when someone else can really screw you over.

Stats, while a way to help you improve, have shifted towards being a marker to bar people from playing and to bar people from getting a chance to improve. It's the same reason why theorycrafting is such a tiring practice as well.

[jbev]

Freyar, on 13 June 2012 - 01:17 AM, said:

I'm saying that stats, with the way they are generated, are not a good way to properly collect information and display how "good" a player is, moreso when a random element such as matchmaking is involved. This is even more of an issue in team-oriented games (unlike Call of Duty) when someone else can really screw you over.

Please understand that statistically, all 'Random Elements' stop mattering given enough iterations (matches) and the only variable held true is the pilot. Please also understand that the previous sentence is an abject and irrefutable fact.

Edited by jbev, 13 June 2012 - 01:28 AM.

[oohawkoo]

well it would be a useful tool if it give hit rate with different weapons and such especialy since they are putting convergance into the game play =X (since it could help you with weapon load outs for ur mech... thats assumeing an over all effectiveness ratio,,, kill/death accuracy etc) but it really should be private no need for it to be public at all =3

[Freyar]

jbev, on 13 June 2012 - 01:27 AM, said:

Please understand that statistically, all 'Random Elements' stop mattering given enough iterations (matches) and the only variable held true is the pilot. Please also understand that the previous sentence is an abject and irrefutable fact.

We (or at least I) have no idea what influences there will be on matchmaking. Will it be based on rating? Will it be truly random? I've had a number of games where I've done fairly well, yet still lost. My stats are then penalized for the loss despite my better work, and then people have the gall to use those stats in an effort to try and determine the outcome of a match before it's even played.

APBR has a huge problem with morale. Players get lined up, you see it's 4:5, you see Three high-ranking (character level) players with "gold" (highest) threat ("skill rating") and one that's "Gold" but middle-rank, versus five high-ranking "bronze" (low "skill rating") characters. End result, five bronze players win, gold players lose. This is not just about the whole idea of using a ranking system for matchmaking (as the bronze guys deliberately lost to skew their results), but how these kinds of elements screw up stats to begin with.

People look at these stats and they assume that those stats will determine the outcome, not playing the match.

Edited by Freyar, 13 June 2012 - 01:34 AM.

[Insidious Johnson]

Publish all stats. Near as I can tell, the problem of having to smurf or change names daily to get games is dead. People want to defend their planets or they don't. Either way, I'm going into Real Estate.

[Graf Blutwurst]

I personally think that stats are hard to make sense of. Is someone a good player if he has a high KDR but doesn't contribute to to the team? Is someone who has a low win-percentage because he doesn't quit games and hasn't a fix group necessarily a bad player?

Assessing someones skill with just a set of numbers is really hard in a game like this.

[Tobruk]

Antaumus, on 13 June 2012 - 12:55 AM, said:

Win/loss means nothing you could be the best mech pilot in the world and get matched with worse team mates and have your score lowered.

Absolutely correct! Perfect example is my Win/Loss for my Tiger II and T-34 in World of tanks which is hovering around 45% for both tanks (My overall Win/loss is about 52%) If the stats are to be believed then Im a poor player on those vehicles. Catch is Ive earned the "Ace Tanker" mastery badge for both these tanks which means my average scores put me in the top 1% of people playing them.

Win/loss stats (at least for public games) are not an indicator of how good you are but how lucky you are. Lost quite a few public matches in World of Tanks because teammates decided to start a flame war with each other regarding stats right in the middle of a battle... sooo pointless.

Hopefully MWO will keep stats private so people can concentrate on having fun instead.

Edited by Tobruk, 13 June 2012 - 01:39 AM.