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Why Is It That Pgi Doesn't Understand The Concept Of [Balance] ?


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#1 ragbasti

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 02:24 PM

Disclaimer: I am angry and I have a right to be!

Sorry guys but this Patch finally did it.
Out of the major changes over half of them just completely ****** the bame balance.

Saying that you are experimenting is fine by me but why don't you increment in small steps instead of completely wrecking the entire gamebalance by completely overdoing things...?

First of all the good things, praise where its due:

Thank you for fixing that bug with the Missiles shooting to many missiles when the built in weapon had more rockets than the hardpoint it was in!
Machineguns - great job, you turned them back just perfectly.

AC2s - fine as it is now, the heat penalty seems to be fixed. (ok I take that back as I've just been told it still is bugged)

Streaks... ok, 2.0 would have been enough imho and jumping to 2.5 seems a little extreme but it is still tolerable. I hope the damage does get a slight nerf later on (maybe 0.2-0.3) but it is at least not a gamebreaker.

Now to the juicy parts of this patch, and I'll save the best for last.

The UAC-5 is now almost out of this world, you can basically chainfire 2 UAC-5s and they MAYBE, just MAYBE, jam after 50 shots or so. I know you should shoot for the stars in life but not when balancing a game ! At least you could have made it 20% or so, that would have been reasonable at least.
I just did 4 test games on the testing ground and in one of them I was able to shoot all 175 without jamming even once, by just holding down the mouse button. In 2 games they jammed twice and in only one game they jammed more than 3 times.
Generally shooting more than 30 rounds by just using chainfire is absolutely no prblem and you would have to be really unlucky to jam.

The LBX has suddenly become a Sniper Rifle. Why ? The spread was fine as it was and certainly did not require you of almost half it. Maybe 2.00 or if you really want to buff it 1.8 but a spread of 1.3 is plain ludicrous!
If i shoot at a Catapult from that is 200 meters away roughly 70% of the pellets hit the center torso and from 100m away I can remore a Commando's side torso, only hitting the center with maybe 2-3 pellets/shot. This thing is a Shotgun-type weapon, now you've turned it into a medium range critseeker! In close combat it hits like a normal AC-10 with 10 times the crit chance. At 500m the spread does not exceed my torso recticle, which means I can hit almost all mechs (except a few mediums and the light mechs) with easily 80% of the pellets. THIS IS A SHOTGUN !

I fully realise that all these weapon values can still be changed but there is this ONE thing that is just inacceptable:


Quote

"Players will never be forced to use or play against other
players using 3rd Person". Quote by Bryan Ekman 21 March 2013

"Hey, we do not only implement 3PV, even though we promised not to to the early supporters of the game (but who cares about those, right ?) But now we FORCE the entire community to play 3PV" because you freaking disabled the promised hardcore mode.
And don't say "hey, you can just turn off the 3PV by pressing F4." You are still forcing us to play with people that are using it even though you said you would seperate the players!
Not only that but you implemented a ******* AIMBOT into the 3PV.
A few weeks ago you stated that new players have gotten significantly better with the implementation of 3PV on the testserver. Really ?!?! Maybe its because you barely have to aim into a mechs direction and the game automatically locks on!

You really put in a great effort in not giving the 3PV players any significant advantage over those that play the game as it was initially meant to be played (beware of the sarcasm).
You simply lied to your player base. First you said there wouldn't be 3PV and now it's there, I could see past this but now you FORCE me to play with 3PV players even though you stated that I would not have to, this is the thing the ticks me off above all else. Weapon values are subjected to change but bluntly refusing me the option to play without 3PV player from day 1 of the patch is just a betrayal of the last bit of trust that you had in the eyes of many members of this community.

I really regret that I am past the point where I can demand a refund on the 80 Dollars I payed for your Phoenix package and I am regretting to have supported you.

I've realised:

Quote

By the time we finally get the separate queues, many people will have gotten used to 3PV and therefore the 1PV-only queue will be completely underpopulated. Basically this is a calculated move by PGI to sanctify their own descisions and statements that lead to the introduction of 3PV.

Edited by ragbasti, 21 August 2013 - 06:12 AM.


#2 Alex Warden

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 02:29 PM

View Postragbasti, on 20 August 2013 - 02:24 PM, said:


Not only that but you implemented a ******* AIMBOT into the 3PV.
A few weeks ago you stated that new players have gotten significantly better with the implementation of 3PV on the testserver. Really ?!?! Maybe its because you barely have to aim into a mechs direction and the game automatically locks on!

You really put in a great effort in not giving the 3PV players any significant advantage over those that play the game as it was initially meant to be played (beware of the sarcasm).
You simply lied to your player base.
I really regret that I am past the point where I can demand a refund on the 80 Dollars I payed for your Phoenix package and I am regretting to have supported you.


i liked the patch over all, and i could live with the castrated 3pv...until i found out about the f+++ing aimbot... seriously...idon´tknow how to express how much i hate it. and not just me... if we don´t get a proper feedback on that THING within 24hours,me and most of my unit who purchased the phoenix pack will step back and demand a refund... take that thing out, or you finally broke any hope and good wishes for the game for me...

/steamvent close

Edited by Alex Warden, 20 August 2013 - 02:32 PM.


#3 DeadlyNerd

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 02:40 PM

View PostAlex Warden, on 20 August 2013 - 02:29 PM, said:


i liked the patch over all, and i could live with the castrated 3pv...until i found out about the f+++ing aimbot... seriously...idon´tknow how to express how much i hate it. and not just me... if we don´t get a proper feedback on that THING within 24hours,me and most of my unit who purchased the phoenix pack will step back and demand a refund... take that thing out, or you finally broke any hope and good wishes for the game for me...

/steamvent close

It's not an aimbot, it's "aim aid" because it moves the crosshair onto the model you're aiming at. Apparently it's to compensate for screwed up perception from 3PV.
I'm still completely against the current implementation of 3PV, but I can't agree that that's an aimbot.

Edited by DeadlyNerd, 20 August 2013 - 02:41 PM.


#4 Alex Warden

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 02:42 PM

View PostDeadlyNerd, on 20 August 2013 - 02:40 PM, said:

It's not an aimbot, it's "aim aid" because it moves the crosshair onto the model you're aiming at. Apparently it's to compensate for screwed up perception from 3PV.
I'm still completely against the current implementation of 3PV, but I can't agree that that's an aimbot.

than you didn´t try it properly...

i´m currently working on a video, i won´t say much more about that aimbot. hopefully it will be removed before the video is done

Edited by Alex Warden, 20 August 2013 - 02:43 PM.


#5 ragbasti

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 02:53 PM

View PostDeadlyNerd, on 20 August 2013 - 02:40 PM, said:

It's not an aimbot, it's "aim aid" because it moves the crosshair onto the model you're aiming at. Apparently it's to compensate for screwed up perception from 3PV.
I'm still completely against the current implementation of 3PV, but I can't agree that that's an aimbot.


Well thanks for that, as if jump snipers weren't bad enough already, now they even get a free shot when using 3PV. I know the aimbot has limited range but that doesn't matter if you can still hide behind a building, jumping out every now and then, getting free hits without having to aim properly

#6 Alex Warden

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 03:06 PM

View Postragbasti, on 20 August 2013 - 02:53 PM, said:

Well thanks for that, as if jump snipers weren't bad enough already, now they even get a free shot when using 3PV. I know the aimbot has limited range but that doesn't matter if you can still hide behind a building, jumping out every now and then, getting free hits without having to aim properly

not only that, you can preaim at the edge of a cover/hill what ever, and if someone only slightly comes atop, you have a perfect shot, something that uses at least a little effort in 1st... many other examples, as i said, video to follow soon

#7 HJoker

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 03:08 PM

i don´t understand what PGI planned with this 3.PV
They said official that everybody can choose if someone play with players who use it or not. The second lie from PGI was the statemant, that the 3.PV none significant advantages will have...
1. Statement no queue to choose to play with or without 3.PV is ingame
2. Statement: The Aimbot in 3.PV is the biggest advantage ever, when iam can do headshots.blindly

I hope PGI will erase this aimbot quickly in 3.PV, because i and the most other players in my unit considering, to recall the Overlord Phoenix package and end our history of this game.

Also i hope, that PGI give an official statement with apoligy, but thats are wishes...My trust in PGI and mechwarrior online are lost, but who knows...

Edited by Rylena, 20 August 2013 - 03:31 PM.


#8 Corvus Antaka

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 03:37 PM

Maybe PGI should just remove the crosshair from third person :P

I too would have prefferred seperate 1pv and 3pv right off the bat, but its in the ui already, no doubt itll be linked up soon. dont forget pgi is working on a new ui too.

#9 ragbasti

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 03:46 PM

imho, working on a new UI is not an excuse for me to remove the option to not play 3PV.

#10 Donkehote

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 04:22 PM

i agree wholeheartedly, and have stopped playing for this reason. i even had a thread like this one that was moved to the goons section (i am not a goon)
You spent more time than i did voicing my opinion, and did so much more eloquently. Thanks.
I wont be playing until 3pv is separated. i may try for a bit when the game launches for real, and i hope things are different then, but i doubt it.

To the game devs, So long, and thanks for all the fish.

I will still poke around on the forums, but i will not be playing. If there is no fix, I will have to ask for a refund for my purchases (of which there have been many. Being from Canada, I know I am protected by the government. The promise to founders of no 3pv has been violated according to the competition act. I am not going there right away, but it is an option for those who would like a refund. The following is a government of canada webpage detailing the parts of the act i am talking about.
http://www.competiti.../eng/03133.html

For those who would say i am rage quitting, I am not. I will play again, and have enjoyed the game thouroughly in the past. im just fed up with broken promises and false advertising. The latter is a criminal act in Canada (idk bout where you live, but it is probably criminal there too) and by breaking the law they can face not only fines but up to a year in jail.

Please PGI, don't be so crazy.


To the people who would/will delete this thread, I have it saved, and will repost if I have to. I am providing feedback to the patch you released. players have the right to know the laws their purchases are protected by. Thanks for your understanding.

Edited by Donkehote, 20 August 2013 - 11:42 PM.


#11 ragbasti

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 05:19 PM

I wouldn't go as far as threatening with legal repercussions, however, a break of trust will damage PGI in the long run.
Too bad they already have my money, I can only hope that this will have a severe impact on the money that PGI is making with the game because in the end money talks.

#12 Timto

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Posted 20 August 2013 - 09:41 PM

3pv+aimbot=no significant advantage.... PGI, IGP where are you from? Don't mistreat us like this. Take it away!

#13 ragbasti

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Posted 21 August 2013 - 05:30 AM

By the time we finally get the separate queues, many people will have gotten used to 3PV and therefore the 1PV-only queue will be completely underpopulated. Basically this is a calculated move by PGI to sanctify their own descisions and statements that lead to the introduction of 3PV.


Until I get my 1PV this game is dead to me, this betrayal of trust killed all the fun I had up til now.

#14 Kurshuk

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Posted 21 August 2013 - 06:31 AM

View PostDeadlyNerd, on 20 August 2013 - 02:40 PM, said:


It's not an aimbot, it's "aim aid" because it moves the crosshair onto the model you're aiming at. Apparently it's to compensate for screwed up perception from 3PV.
I'm still completely against the current implementation of 3PV, but I can't agree that that's an aimbot.


Well, call it what you will, it snaps the cursor to mech when you get close. Not ok.

Edited by Kurshuk, 21 August 2013 - 06:32 AM.


#15 DeadlyNerd

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Posted 21 August 2013 - 06:50 AM

View PostKurshuk, on 21 August 2013 - 06:31 AM, said:

[size=4]

Well, call it what you will, it snaps the cursor to mech when you get close. Not ok.

It snaps the cursor onto any model when you attempt to put your crosshari on it.
Granted, it's allowing players in 3PV to easily see when their aim is on the enemy, but it's far less of a deal than seeing what's behind your cover without actually going out from cover.

Edited by DeadlyNerd, 21 August 2013 - 06:51 AM.


#16 ragbasti

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Posted 21 August 2013 - 06:58 AM

It is far more of a deal than that.
Jump Snipers can now just sit behind cover, wait for someone to coem within 600m and after they release their jump jets the game pretty much aims for them. So basically making the least skillful playstyle even more of a piece of cake

Edited by ragbasti, 21 August 2013 - 07:01 AM.


#17 Thomas McRiley

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Posted 21 August 2013 - 07:25 AM

I have to admit that the way 3 PV is implemented into the game, is the end of fun for me.

Being forced to play a gamestyle that has nothing in common with the previous gameplay, I share my opinion with Ragbasti. The aimbot mechanism is a pure joke; not more not less. If your aiming for a group of players that like Farmville or have brains like cheetahs, than congratulations. You did it.

For my part, I stop playing this game as long as there is no pure 1PV mode.

A disappointed customer......

#18 Dr Rodney McKay

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Posted 21 August 2013 - 09:21 AM

I dont want to say all the things again, i just put my self behind my comrades and friends. I share their thoughts about the new "perfect" features ......

Why put you an AIM BOT in this game ?

Im really disappointed see you after the next patch

#19 FenrisWard

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Posted 21 August 2013 - 09:26 AM

Just the same that Rodney said.

I pause until next patch maybe change Things for the better.

#20 Thikron

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Posted 21 August 2013 - 09:39 AM

Ok, I know sometimes mistakes happen and I will not ragequit by now. But an "aimbot" is not bearable.

But I will quit if it will stay after the next patch. That is not cool.





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