22 replies to this topic

[AllByAll]

Greetings MW:O players. This is my first post. I'd like to take some time to talk of my initial experiences as well as ask some lingering questions I haven't quite been able to answer to a satisfying degree with my searches (either due to limited information or discussion that is dated prior to numerous patches). I've divided my wall of text into sections so that the discerning reader can skip to the segment that interests him or her.

1) The beginning - the trial mechs:

I almost didn't play MW:O online beyond the first couple matches. My experience with trial mechs was awful and it was my impression that it would require an immediate cash investment to get a competitive platform. It took a friend's prodding and forum digging to discover the cbill bonuses for a player's first matches and some entry level builds to get me to stick it out. Once I was informed on the some of the basics of how the rewards are distributed I tended to queue with a light trial mech, charge the enemy, quickly explode, then disconnect and do the same thing with another trial. I realize, in retrospect, this style doesn't really benefit the rest of my team very much but the benefit of trying to make the most of the trial mechs wasn't particularly enticing.

The current catapult trial with 2 LRMs and 4 SRMs is the one trial I've managed to occasionally do decent end-match damage with though I question whether or not that means much since missile damage probably hit every section of every enemy mech I fired on, with that being the case 350-450 damage (after a match where i manage to not get noticed much and not get into a brawl) may not be that much. Experiences with the CPTL-A1© trial have led me to question ever investing in missile hardpoints and was the foundation for my understanding that ECM is one of the most impactful pieces of equipment a team can have. It seems that in public games (the only kind I play) I can be certain a team will lose if it doesn't have at least ECM that will cover the bulk of the team. Approaching a battle front without ECM against mechs surrounding an AS7-D-DC is roughly akin to the entire enemy team having wallhacks, while you do not, and getting completely lit up when rounding a corner or cresting a hill.

Looking back with some perspective I wonder why trial mechs have to be so terrible. It seems like it would be wise to give a new account a variety of optimized mechs to play with for their first 'X-number-of-matches' to give players a goal to work toward / invest toward after they do eventually get kicked down to trial-mech-slumming.

At present, I'm considering a moderate MC investment but am still somewhat on the fence due to the fact that my client does not preform that well (particularly if the map requires heat vision) and I tend to have some crashes or lockups at least once during any extended session of matches.

I now have two fully equipped mechs with a decent amount of swap parts in the bay when I happen to get bored with a certain build (which I do every few matches) and am indecisive as to what should be the next big investment.

2) Current builds. The highs, the lows, the whys:

My first chasis purchase was a Jagermech, JM6-S with the intention of pursuing an AC/20 build. This was purchased on the advice of the aforementioned friend who got me to play more than 3 matches. The stock load-out was not much better than the trial mechs. It sported low armor, low ammo, standard heat sinks, and a whole mess of unutilized slots. When I finally did upgrade to DHS, endo-steel, & AC/20s I still found my ammo & armor low and began a grind to purchase an XL-255 engine. Now my go-to build is this:

JM6-S || XL-255 with dual AC20 + dual M-Las:
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...35fe8c33b064945
The damage at optimal range is impressive, getting to that optimal range preferably with someone equipped to brawl taking the brunt, is difficult in a pick-up-game. In a nutshell, XL engines don't really belong in a Jagermech as far as I can tell. JM6 arms don't shield the torso. That being said: it's not really possible to fill up ballistic hardpoints / slots with large weaponry (and enough ammo last a full match) without an XL or some incredibly small standard engine. I've read that torso twist speed is related to engine rating. Even at the 250ish engine rating a Jager is a bit sluggish. I can't imagine running a model much smaller. Despite all these problems, I still consistently pull the highest damage numbers with 2xAC/20s in comparison to all my attempted alternatives.

The closest runner up:

JM6-S || XL-255 with dual LB 10-X AC, dual MG, quad M-Las:
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...1c335b680773cb0

LB 10s & Machine Guns seem to be identified as inconsequential joke weapons (MGs in particular) on the forums. It's plausible that the medium lasers are doing the bulk of the work and I'm deceived in the absence of a statistical breakdown of which weapons did what after a match ( A FEATURE THIS GAME INEXPLICABLY LACKS. Is it to keep the wide audience in the dark? ). But after punching through armor with a couple block fires from the quad M-Las while stagger firing the LB 10s, holding down the chain guns with max fire rate LB-10 shots and the occasional single laser seems to frequently result in component destruction and a lot of component destruction. Despite this build needing to act like a brawler and the fact XL engines make me not a brawler I've consistently pulled higher numbers with this load out than my mixes of AC/2s and 5s. Go figure.

The build I want to work but doesn't:

JM6-S || XL-255 with quad AC/2, quad M-Las:
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...04c9dc51a26d301

Public, pick-up, games seem to revolve a lot more around long range stand-offs than they necessarily should. There are a whole mess of Atlas, cataphracts, hunchbacks, and what not - that just won't get into the crunch. And, why should they? Chances are if a small group brilliantly flanks, the rest of the friendly team is still going to cower behind their ridge taking pot shots without realizing the enemy is fractured and distracted. More often than not among the non-light mechs, no one wants to charge and consequently long range & sniping weapons platforms are popular. That said the quad AC/2s should be able to pepper long range enemies and have something to do during the first half of the game's long range stalemate. Unfortunately, a lot of AC/2s generate more heat than they should. Apparently there's are additional heat penalties for rapid fire which means, consequently your dps remains embarrassingly low at all times.

the build I may turn to:
JM6-S (stock STD-260 engine) with dual AC/5 + quad M-LAS + 2x MG:
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...5ef5260fe74c821

I have tried AC/5s, sure. I actually ran 4 with energy hardpoints empty for a while and found it overheating as well without punching through enemy sections fast enough. But maybe I haven't given them a fair shake. My friend that I play with uses something similar: JM6-S, STD-260, dual UAC/5, dual MG, dual MP-Las and seems to do consistently decent numbers, though I've usually accomplished more with my first two builds.

my alternate mech:
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...47001963aa7be1f

With the aforementioned necessity of ECM on a team I decided to pick up a relatively easy to acquire ECM platform. Also there was the desire to jump jet around like a clown but that's another matter. Interestingly while I tend to do less damage overall (average 225) with the spider I also tend to avoid dying early in the round and seldom ever find myself doing less than 200 in a match. I have not really tried any variations on this build. I suppose I could drop the to pulse lasers for standard lasers but after reading this thread:

http://mwomercs.com/...-melt-properly/

it seems like the pulse lasers are the way to go particularly since my aim is a bit twitchy and I frequently find myself in a duel with another light mech. Anecdotal reference to my light mech duels make me believe my pulse lasers are doing the trick but having not tried the alternatives I dont really know. As fun as the spider is I don't, at present, have plans for any continued investment in light mechs.

3) Pondering the next big buy:

With my previously mentioned friend saving up for the ECM carrying Atlas I'm hoping to move into a brawler or long-range platform next but have more questions than answers on how to go about it. In my recent experience the Stalker platforms appear to receive more enemy fire while continuing to function than any other mech I've perceived - though this may be my imagination. The stalker series, however, has a lot of missile hard-points and my experience with trial LRMs and Streaks has resulted in modest success to complete utter uselessness at the hands of enemies traveling under ECM. I see there are modifications available for missile systems, artemis, BAP, TAG, and NARC but don't really know which one or combination of accessories will make missile hard-points worth having as well as deal with the most common enemy status effect that nullifies all tracking missiles: ECM. All that being said - I'm attracted to the idea of a missile platform but, as previously mentioned, they don't appear to work very well.

Furthermore with my cursory searches on stalkers have indicated variations to which I would be otherwise unaware. There are differences in maximum torso twist, number of missile tubes per hard-point, and perhaps other qualities that aren't at all indicated in the game-launcher specifications. What is the best resource to get a full description of relevant data for each mech variant?

Finally: how relevant are elite pilot efficiencies? I could also just buy other Jager variations and more weapons to screw around with while pursuing such a goal.

Edited by AllByAll, 19 August 2013 - 10:50 PM.

[Koniving]

(Holy crap; I have a twin! ...Wait, no screens or youtube vids. Phew. I'm safe. No evil twin out to get me.)

[TheCaptainJZ]

AllByAll, on 19 August 2013 - 10:40 PM, said:

1) The beginning - the trial mechs:

Trial mechs are stock loadouts from the table top game. Those do not translate well into a real-time simulation/shooter. Apparently, the whole trial mech system is going to be removed and replaced with a new player tutorial that will end with the player owning their first mech. Sorry, I don't have the link to that.

AllByAll, on 19 August 2013 - 10:40 PM, said:

2) Current builds. The highs, the lows, the whys:

I'm not going to say much here since I'm not a mech loadout guru, but I felt that the jaggermech was very sluggish at first as well, but after unlocking the basic efficiencies and putting in a better engine, I came to like it. It still has it's weaknesses, but it has a good variety and placement of hardpoints.

AllByAll, on 19 August 2013 - 10:40 PM, said:

What is the best resource to get a full description of relevant data for each mech variant?

Finally: how relevant are elite pilot efficiencies? I could also just buy other Jager variations and more weapons to screw around with while pursuing such a goal.

Stats: http://mwo.smurfy-net.de/


Efficiencies are tremedously helpful. Some more than others. Once a mech has all the elites unlocked, it gets it's basic efficiencies doubled. That's worth going through the elites for sure.

[Nauht]

Check out http://mwo.smurfy-net.de/ for all the stats you need.

RE: pilot efficiencies, IMO, they're a definite must. At least get the elite to get the 2x bonus to basics and speed tweak. The bigger mechs need that extra agility.

[AllByAll]

Wow. Doubling basic efficiencies is a HUGE deal. I wouldn't have known it from merely looking at the information on the launcher. It sort of looks like I'm going to be hardcore Jager'ing until i get more mech bays.

[travelbug]

regarding your jager builds:

if you want to use xl engines, then you have to be fast. id say the engine you chose is the bare minumum for support builds. id be more comfortable with a faster engine if you want a short range jag like your lb10x build.
i would strongly recommend eliting your jager as doing so will make it feel like moving from a beetle to a porsche. you will need to get all basics for two other jager variants to elite a mach. you will also need speedtweak for the speed boost. also unlocking all elites for a particular variant will double all basic effects.
mg's are good but you have to have 4 or more to be effective.
on your ac40 build, i would personally drop ams or a ton of ammo to put in more ct armor.
also, try a triple uac5 jag. imho, more versatile than an ac40 jag; ive got some of my best damage with this build

good luck

[Pat Kell]

Gonna skip point 1 cuz i guess i don't have much to say other than yea, the initial grind can be rough.

On point 2, jaegars can be good mechs but alot of them have XL's and everyone knows it so people usually aim for a L/R torso for the quick kill. If you can find an assault to buddy up with and let him take the lead, they can be brutal. Still need to pop in front from time to time to soak up a little damage whenever possible. Is always a good idea to unlock the elite if only for speed tweek which gives you that extra bump in speed without spending the tonnage for it.

On point 3 I would like to point out that if you want to take a missile boat, all you really need is TAG. Artemis is very nice but requires line of sight in order to work, although still worth it, in my opinion. BAP and some modules like target decay and advanced sensor range once you have the XP to buy them. Granted, missile damage does tend to spread all around but its the shake and fear factor that the real benefit lies in. If you can make an enemy run for cover from your missiles, most likely he is not shooting at you or your buddies and if he tries to ride out the storm, the shake from missiles can be quite distracting. Now if your going to choose an assault, I think most would say highlander or victor because of the jump jet ability but I am a big fan of stalkers. Can work well in any role. Brawler, sniper, lrm boat and the high arm weapons allow you to fire while just barely cresting a hill. The Atlas DDC is the only ECM capable assault and I would advise against buying a mech just because of ECM. While it's powerful in some ways, there are currently several good, easy ways to negate it. It can be very fun but it has very low weapons on it's torso and arms forcing you to reveal at least half of your mech before safely firing.

So in short, if you like jump sniping or just jumping at all, go for the Highlander or victor. For a very versatile mech, the stalker is hard to beat. If you want to walk around under the cover of ECM or just have a ton of armor, then the Atlas is your bag. Awesomes just suck. Some people do well with them but their CT is so big even I can hit it most of the time.

Oh and yes, the stalkers have some widely varying quirks like torso twist. The 3F has the best at around 75-80% turn while the others are much lower at around 35-40 % i think. The others have their bonises but I really like the 3F.

Good luck and welcome to the game, hope to see you around some time.

[Finletter]

"I tended to queue with a light trial mech, charge the enemy, quickly explode, then disconnect and do the same thing with another trial."

The *objective* behind the light mech is to charge in and *not* explode Your job is to spot incoming enemy mechs so that the main, slower force knows how to respond. Your job is also to keep target locks for the missile boats on the team, if there are any.

You actually weren't too far off from the intended role - which is expected to teach you how to use terrain to survive.

"2) Current builds. The highs, the lows, the whys:"

Brawlers should, in general, avoid XL engines. Light mechs - who rely on not getting hit to survive - and snipers/missile boats have the luxury of using XL engines, but if you plan on being up close and personal, you can't have any torso destruction be the end of you.

"That said the quad AC/2s should be able to pepper long range enemies and have something to do during the first half of the game's long range stalemate."

AC/2s suffer from the same issue you've already noticed with missiles - they tend to spread damage. At 2 points of damage per shot, they don't exactly pile it on. On a moving target, it's far more preferable (and much harder) to strip a single location's armor than dent the whole mech. Have you tried Gauss rifles? If you like the penetration of the AC/20, it's the closest thing you're going to get in a longe-ranged weapon.

Try this:

JM-6S: 255 XL, 2x Gauss Rifle (25 ammo each), 1 ML. ES Internal, 10 DBL HS.

It has a 2.0 heat efficiency (it will never shut down from overheating, on any match), it deals 30 points of alpha damage (75% of a dual-AC/20 hit), and does it at an effective range of 660. The ML is an emergency back-up weapon, for when you lose your main guns or run out of ammo.

With the extended range of the Gauss (they'll still do significant damage out to around 1k), you can try and snipe from the "pocket" that hopefully contains some ECM DDCs.

"The stalker series, however, has a lot of missile hard-points and my experience with trial LRMs and Streaks has resulted in modest success to complete utter uselessness at the hands of enemies traveling under ECM."

The Stalkers have boatloads of missile and energy hardpoints - they're just lacking in ballistic hardpoints. They're also very slow and cumbersome to move about with - which is exacerbated by their torso-locked arms. The bane of any Stalker pilot is a fast, light mech. I wouldn't recommend them as a first choice for a brawler, but they're good solid mechs overall. Very survivable.

"I see there are modifications available for missile systems, artemis, BAP, TAG, and NARC but don't really know which one or combination of accessories will make missile hard-points worth having as well as deal with the most common enemy status effect that nullifies all tracking missiles: ECM."

Artemis is well-worth it for a large missile system, where you're essentially trading a ton of ammunition for the weapon for increased accuracy with the weapon.

TAG I've found useful, as it will directly negate ECM while the mech is 'tagged. If you can keep it in-target, it's an invitation for every boat on your team to blast it to bits. Neither BAP nor NARCs have much appeal to me, the NARCs primarily because they seem really hard to hit with from any real range.

"I'm attracted to the idea of a missile platform but, as previously mentioned, they don't appear to work very well."

Missile platforms often don't work well because it's a pickup game, and no one is thinking about the grand strategy. I've found that saying something to the effect of "60 tubes, keep locks please." at the beginning of a match gets me a lot of cooperation, but in matches where I don't say it, I frequently have a hard time as a missile boater. It makes playing the brawling/scouting mechs a lot more visceral.

"Furthermore with my cursory searches on stalkers have indicated variations to which I would be otherwise unaware. There are differences in maximum torso twist, number of missile tubes per hard-point, and perhaps other qualities that aren't at all indicated in the game-launcher specifications. What is the best resource to get a full description of relevant data for each mech variant?"

http://mwo.smurfy-net.de/ has all of that information.

[Pat Kell]

Oh and it may seem like stalkers take more damage but that is only because they have a smaller CT and the damage they do recieve tends to get spread around more then most mechs. Some of it may be that the pilots you have witnessed either twisted a lot in their stalkers to help spread the damage or if they were in say an Atlas, they may not have twisted much, choosing rather to stay on target. This can help with aim a bit if your new but will definantly get you killed faster.

[Johnny Marek Summers]

Just remember you have 4 mech bays and you need three different variants of the Jager with all basics unlocked for each one to unlock the elite tier. Since you have the Spider with ECM, you are going to have to choose 2 more Jagers, eventually.

Edited by Johnny Marek Summers, 20 August 2013 - 12:50 AM.

[Itsalrightwithme]

AllByAll, on 19 August 2013 - 10:40 PM, said:

Finally: how relevant are elite pilot efficiencies? I could also just buy other Jager variations and more weapons to screw around with while pursuing such a goal.

Great post, by the way!

Elite Pilot Efficiencies are game changing. Especially speed tweak and convergence bonuses. So much so that nowadays I convert tons of XP to GXP whenever they have a "double XP-GXP conversion weekend", and when I get into a new mech I buy all the basic and elite skills from my pot of GXP pretty much immediately.

So I highly suggest sticking with Jagers for the time being. The nice thing is, many of your builds can be put into any chassis.

[Bront]

AllByAll, on 19 August 2013 - 10:40 PM, said:

1) The beginning - the trial mechs:

...

The current catapult trial with 2 LRMs and 4 SRMs is the one trial I've managed to occasionally do decent end-match damage with though I question whether or not that means much since missile damage probably hit every section of every enemy mech I fired on, with that being the case 350-450 damage (after a match where i manage to not get noticed much and not get into a brawl) may not be that much. Experiences with the CPTL-A1© trial have led me to question ever investing in missile hardpoints and was the foundation for my understanding that ECM is one of the most impactful pieces of equipment a team can have. It seems that in public games (the only kind I play) I can be certain a team will lose if it doesn't have at least ECM that will cover the bulk of the team. Approaching a battle front without ECM against mechs surrounding an AS7-D-DC is roughly akin to the entire enemy team having wallhacks, while you do not, and getting completely lit up when rounding a corner or cresting a hill.

Just to comment on this a bit as a somewhat experienced player (Been playing a month and a half, have owned 15 mechs)

The current A1 Champion Catapult is far from a perfect mech, but it can be very effective, even in PUGs, with a good pilot. You can waive off 350-400 damage, but even if it was unfocused, any damage you did is less damage a teammate had to to do get to the center of the opposing mech, and learning how to use LRMs IS a skill (holding targets and locks, making sure you're not hitting obsticals, keeping your distance while getting a clear shot), and the SSRMs weren't really bad unless you were getting light swarmed or facing ECM.

I used that mech rather than customizing my own A1 cat to level up my skills in that mech. Assuming I had a team of any competence (ones that held targets on occasion, and didn't all hang back waiting for some other mech to lead the charge), I regularly dished out 300-500 damage, and usually 1-2 kills and 7-10 assists. I was able to grind out all Basics and Elites in 36 matches (I had premium time) PUGing almost the entire time. Sure, it's not a super optimized build, but knowing how to work it it could be generally effective.

That said, I prefer the C4 for missile boating. Bringing your own TAG is highly useful. And yes, many of the trial mechs really are that pathetic, as very few use any of the advanced upgrades (DHS, XL Engines, Endo, etc) or have maxed armor. It's a problem.

Also, Efficiencies are game changers. 15% heat reduction and 20% bonus to heat capacity? Yes please. That's the other "problem" with trials, is you can't buy them, and they don't work even if you have them.

Edited by Bront, 20 August 2013 - 07:04 AM.

[Koniving]

AllByAll, on 19 August 2013 - 10:40 PM, said:

1) The beginning - the trial mechs:

TheCaptainJZ, on 19 August 2013 - 11:23 PM, said:

Trial mechs are stock loadouts from the table top game. Those do not translate well into a real-time simulation/shooter. Apparently, the whole trial mech system is going to be removed and replaced with a new player tutorial that will end with the player owning their first mech. Sorry, I don't have the link to that.

Tabletop stock loadouts could translate much better given a specific condition.

Spoiler

Koniving, on 18 August 2013 - 04:47 PM, said:

It's not so much what you can put in to your mech that is a problem.

It's our heat capacity system. MW2, you had 40. MW3, you had 30. MW4, the most poorly balanced MW game to ever exist before MWO, had 60 before MekTek then according to a wiki I found it's based on your chassis after Mektek.

What do we have? First some definitions.
Capacity is the limit until shutdown. A threshold. Hit it, you shut down.
Dissipation, this is your cooling rate.

MWO's system. 10 Standard heatsinks. (Average trial mech)

Capacity: 30 base + (10*1) = 40.
Dissipation: 40-30 base = 10 per 10 seconds / 10 = 1/sec.

Not bad, is it?

MWO's system. 10 double engine-mounted heatsinks.

Capacity: 30 base + (10*2) = 50.
Dissipation: 50-30 base = 20 per 10 seconds / 10 = 2/sec.

Wait. It just doubled in cooling power + an extra 10 heat threshold? Already stock mechs are screwed.

SHS is at a disadvantage in both cooldown speed, and capacity, due to a rising capacity system. For the whole store click the Arrow next to my name on the quote.

I agree with the OP, and actually there is something like that in the works. With a new user interface there's a tutorial system being made. At the end of the tutorial you'd get 8 million or so cbills.

Beyond this is speculation, hope, and lots of petitioning: a game mode that only allows stock mechs of all varieties as a "try before you buy" type game mode against other players who are also trying things. Stock against stock is actually quite fair and would let you 'sample' a mech before you buy and trick it out with the latest in rims and shiney gold plated truck nuts.

-------------

Part 2..

Here's my performance with some similar builds. Videos. Some from my perspective. Some from a following camera commando.

Spoiler

2 AC/2s + 2 AC/5s


4 Flamer, 2 MG, LB-10x. Chase cam. JM6-S not DD.


Very recent. 2 flamers, 2 LB-10x, 1 UAC/5 Muromets. Chase cam.

Part 3: Assault mechs.
Again more performance but as an Atlas. More vids than you'll ever watch in one sitting.

Spoiler

Early open beta Atlas versus Atlas combat -- when repair and rearm prevented fast builds and everything relied heavily on being cost effective.


Exterior chase cam view: Founder's Atlas D. Basic unlocks only. Joke weapons (AC/2 + AC/5 + SRM-6 + LRM-10 + 1 ton ammo each + 4 ML).


Atlas RS stock; solo.


Atlas RS stock; group (serious)

Bonus -- hilarious RS Stock on the comms with tech support and no weapons; group


Atlas K stock. Tech support and window wipers.


Atlas team. Rightfully so this build is considered cheese and heats you up more now than it did then.


Atlas D, basics only. This was before Armlock and instant pinpoint damage where convergence of some weapons took up to 1 second to achieve. Notice my excessive use of the arm weapons as a result?


I apologize for the wind, I left my cockpit open because it was hot on Canyon.


Another with cheese.

[Koniving]

Some edits I can't fit in because it removes the videos.

In the first spoiler, add at the end: "I cut the quote off early but it gets really in depth with examples demonstrating how easy it is to reach 70, 80, even 90. Compared to the poorly balanced 60 and the fact that the system rises with each heatsink you put in, there are some clear cut problems with this design that I'm trying to change."

"I agree with the OP about the trial mech selection, and actually there is something like that in the works." Add in "With a new user interface there's a tutorial system being made. At the end of the tutorial you'd get 8 million or so cbills. The trial mech system would get removed entirely."

[Bront]

Yeah, simply putting DHS into trial mechs would be nice, though I understand it wouldn't make sense.

[Koniving]

Bront, on 20 August 2013 - 12:15 PM, said:

Yeah, simply putting DHS into trial mechs would be nice, though I understand it wouldn't make sense.

Better, remove the rising capacity so that trial mechs can alpha strike just as much as bought mechs and only cool half as fast. At least that's lore friendly.

[Corvus Antaka]

Koniving, on 20 August 2013 - 01:48 PM, said:

Better, remove the rising capacity so that trial mechs can alpha strike just as much as bought mechs and only cool half as fast. At least that's lore friendly.

imho SHS could stand 25% more dissapation, it wouldnt be near gamebreaking, DHS would still be better, but SHS might actually be useful again and at least newbies would get "some" dissapation.

Cadet bonus is plenty to get your first ppersonal mech for free. beyond that imho it's just entitilement generation wanting more free stuff for nothing.

[Bront]

Colonel Pada Vinson, on 20 August 2013 - 07:57 PM, said:

imho SHS could stand 25% more dissapation, it wouldnt be near gamebreaking, DHS would still be better, but SHS might actually be useful again and at least newbies would get "some" dissapation.

Cadet bonus is plenty to get your first ppersonal mech for free. beyond that imho it's just entitilement generation wanting more free stuff for nothing.

With 25% more heat disapation, the DHS advantage would be 15% after the engine heatsinks, so it would be possible for some SHS builds to actually be better at heat dissipation.

The current heat system is a huge departure from TT, and that's part of the issue, as TT SHS ended up not being nearly this bad (though even in TT, there was rarely a reason to go SHS)

[scJazz]

Colonel Pada Vinson, on 20 August 2013 - 07:57 PM, said:

imho SHS could stand 25% more dissapation, it wouldnt be near gamebreaking, DHS would still be better, but SHS might actually be useful again and at least newbies would get "some" dissapation.

Cadet bonus is plenty to get your first ppersonal mech for free. beyond that imho it's just entitilement generation wanting more free stuff for nothing.

Our problem isn't that SHS suck but that our guns fire too damn fast

[Corvus Antaka]

Bront, on 21 August 2013 - 11:23 AM, said:

With 25% more heat disapation, the DHS advantage would be 15% after the engine heatsinks, so it would be possible for some SHS builds to actually be better at heat dissipation.

The current heat system is a huge departure from TT, and that's part of the issue, as TT SHS ended up not being nearly this bad (though even in TT, there was rarely a reason to go SHS)

Yeah, no doubt. Maybe people would have an actual choice between the 2 types sometimes then. most DHS builds rely on the engine HS anyhow, stacking lots beyond that isnt a massive boost really.