26 replies to this topic

[Lefty Lucy]

The dev statement that putting SRMs to 2.5 per missile turned the game into "SRMpocalypse" is just pure bullstuff. Assuming no bugs are present (which is not always a safe assumption), a 25% damage increase doesn't drastically decrease time to kill with SRMs. Right now they still hit like a stale pound cake (slightly better than the fresh wonderbread they used to be), and they spread damage making them inherently inferior to pin-point damage weapons.

The reason why PPCs are still so popular isn't because they're particularly powerful, but because the other game play options (e.g. brawling over sniping) are too weak.

Here is a list of brawling fixes that would help bring balance to the forces:

1. SRM damage to 2.2 per missile
2. ML heat to 3.5
3. Further pulse laser duration reduction: make pulse lasers the "pin point" brawling weapon
4. Increase LB10X damage to 1.2 per pellet, reduce crit bonus proportionately.
5. Increase LL/ERLL/LPL max alpha to 3.

[3rdworld]

If SRMs registered half the time they would be better weapons.

HSR = Hits Sometimes Register.

[627]

SRMs are fine, they don't have to be OP. Even with those hitreg issues they make lots of damage.

[Taemien]

To get close range weapons to be better, they don't need to be buffed (they do tons of damage already) The DPS of longer range weapons needs to be decreased. Basically increase the cooldowns of (ER)PPCs, Gauss, and (ER)Large Lasers so they deal less DPS. Meaning they can't compete within 270m with short range weapons.

I would not touch AC5s or AC2s since they need their rates of fire to even be competitive. And LRMs are already rather tricky to use and are punished enough at close range.

[ciller]

627, on 29 August 2013 - 07:22 AM, said:

SRMs are fine, they don't have to be OP. Even with those hitreg issues they make lots of damage.

B.S., srms are NOT fine. They are a secondary weapon at best with {Scrap} damage, poor hit detection, massive damage spread, and more difficult to hit with then other weapons. They need some help still.

[John MatriX82]

Lefty Lucy, on 29 August 2013 - 06:36 AM, said:

1. SRM damage to 2.2 per missile

2.5 dmg per missile imho it's fine. Provided they have sorted out the infamous splash damage bug. BUT, I'd prefer to get the old flight pattern back. It was that that made SRMs so effective, since you could learn the ranges where you could get the best concentration on the target or it made them OP (as they should be) when you got up in the teeth of your enemies. Now shooting them at 270m or point blank makes no difference, damage is spread all over which is maybe closer to TT but it's not there yet in terms of gameplay imho.

Lefty Lucy, on 29 August 2013 - 06:36 AM, said:

2. ML heat to 3.5

ML's are fine where they are. You already slap them everywhere!

Lefty Lucy, on 29 August 2013 - 06:36 AM, said:

3. Further pulse laser duration reduction: make pulse lasers the "pin point" brawling weapon

What pulse lasers need is a weight reduction to make them more appealing (and to allow to get some more cooling for the lowered weight). 1.5 tons for MPLs, 0,75t for smpl and 6 tons for LPLs. They would require less weight to employ them, leaving heat duration and range stay with similar numbers to those we have now. At the moment their range + their weight (and as a consequence the lack of DHSs you can use due to their immense weight) is what prevents them to be more employed and enjoyable. Imho of course.

Lefty Lucy, on 29 August 2013 - 06:36 AM, said:

4. Increase LB10X damage to 1.2 per pellet, reduce crit bonus proportionately.

I'd prefer the solid shot, but yes, dmg per pellet should be raised, since the solid shot would eat throught the AC 10 itself.

Lefty Lucy, on 29 August 2013 - 06:36 AM, said:

5. Increase LL/ERLL/LPL max alpha to 3.

Also this could be useful, increasing a lot the heat dmg multiplier to avoid 4-5 LL barrage.

[Mister Blastman]

OP: That's a start, but I'd go so far to increase SRM damage to 2.5 and reduce ML heat to 3.0.

[Captain Katawa]

For SRM to be proficient one thing is needed - good platform with four six-tubed launchers and also some laser hardpoints so you could slap on 4 MLs.

It could be Quickdraw but they blew it by giving it 4 tube launchers badly positioned on body and not enough arm mounted laser hardpoints. you can't be proficient with two mediums so you have to slap two larges. But if you could mout 4 MLs it'd do.

[Lefty Lucy]

Mister Blastman, on 29 August 2013 - 07:39 AM, said:

OP: That's a start, but I'd go so far to increase SRM damage to 2.5 and reduce ML heat to 3.0.

I think both of those would be reasonable, but I also think incremental changes are more likely, and smarter.

[Donnie Silveray]

Fix HSR, then we'll see.

[Artgathan]

John MatriX82, on 29 August 2013 - 07:35 AM, said:

2.5 dmg per missile imho it's fine. Provided they have sorted out the infamous splash damage bug. BUT, I'd prefer to get the old flight pattern back. It was that that made SRMs so effective, since you could learn the ranges where you could get the best concentration on the target or it made them OP (as they should be) when you got up in the teeth of your enemies. Now shooting them at 270m or point blank makes no difference, damage is spread all over which is maybe closer to TT but it's not there yet in terms of gameplay imho.

I miss the old patterns. More effective and more aesthetically pleasing. It was fun to watch the missiles spiral out in a huge barrage. It looked awesome. (It also rewarded skill with the weapon).

John MatriX82, on 29 August 2013 - 07:35 AM, said:

ML's are fine where they are. You already slap them everywhere!

Agreed.

John MatriX82, on 29 August 2013 - 07:35 AM, said:

What pulse lasers need is a weight reduction to make them more appealing (and to allow to get some more cooling for the lowered weight). 1.5 tons for MPLs, 0,75t for smpl and 6 tons for LPLs. They would require less weight to employ them, leaving heat duration and range stay with similar numbers to those we have now. At the moment their range + their weight (and as a consequence the lack of DHSs you can use due to their immense weight) is what prevents them to be more employed and enjoyable. Imho of course.

The devs have stated that they won't be changing the weight or crit slots for any weapons. Given that, I think they should receive damage buffs, heat decreases and duration buffs to make them worth their weight.

John MatriX82, on 29 August 2013 - 07:35 AM, said:

I'd prefer the solid shot, but yes, dmg per pellet should be raised, since the solid shot would eat throught the AC 10 itself.

The problem with introducing solid shot on the LBX is that it will just obsolete the AC/10. I think a little bit more damage per pellet (or an increase in the crit-ability of the pellets) would be the right touch for the "crit seeking weapon".

John MatriX82, on 29 August 2013 - 07:35 AM, said:

Also this could be useful, increasing a lot the heat dmg multiplier to avoid 4-5 LL barrage.

Perhaps. I was not sad to see the LL barrages go, but their current absence on the battlefield is disheartening.

[AntiCitizenJuan]

No. They dont. We need better hit detection because all of their damage isnt registering.
People dont use PPCs because other systems are weak, they use them because theyre powerful at all ranges.

The last thing we need is more stupid ******** crying that X needs a buff when we already have numerous overpowered weapons that could easily be nerfed to restore balance.

PGI doubled armor values because they wanted fights to last longer.
This logic basically negates the whole reason they did that and turns the game into another fast paced insta death FPS.

God you people are dumb.

INSTEAD OF NERFING MY PRECIOUS PPC GAUSS, LETS BUFF EVERY OTHER WEAPON IN THE GAME AND RUIN THE FEEL OF BEING IN A GIGANTIC POWERFUL MECH THAT LIVES LONGER THAN 20 SECONDS IN A 1v1 HURR DURR

Edited by AntiCitizenJuan, 29 August 2013 - 09:18 AM.

[Almond Brown]

ciller, on 29 August 2013 - 07:34 AM, said:

B.S., srms are NOT fine. They are a secondary weapon at best with {Scrap} damage, poor hit detection, massive damage spread, and more difficult to hit with then other weapons. They need some help still.

And here is the help you seek. 6 x 6 x 2.5 = 90. Welcome to SplatCat hell as obviously you missed the first round.

[DocBach]

Increasing PPC levels back to 10 and ER PPC's up to 15 would really help limit the amount of PPC spam on the battlefield. That coupled with the gauss charge up should make both of them much less capable for brawling, added points if they lowered medium lasers back down to 3 heat.

[Lefty Lucy]

Almond Brown, on 29 August 2013 - 10:56 AM, said:

And here is the help you seek. 6 x 6 x 2.5 = 90. Welcome to SplatCat hell as obviously you missed the first round.

With the current SRM firing pattern, and lack of splash damage artificially multiplying damage done to CT, a 90-damage alpha that is spread all over the target mech is actually pretty damned acceptable.

Splat cats were only good because of broken non-damage mechanics.

[aniviron]

Lefty Lucy, on 29 August 2013 - 06:36 AM, said:

The dev statement that putting SRMs to 2.5 per missile turned the game into "SRMpocalypse" is just pure bullstuff. Assuming no bugs are present (which is not always a safe assumption), a 25% damage increase doesn't drastically decrease time to kill with SRMs. Right now they still hit like a stale pound cake (slightly better than the fresh wonderbread they used to be), and they spread damage making them inherently inferior to pin-point damage weapons.

The reason why PPCs are still so popular isn't because they're particularly powerful, but because the other game play options (e.g. brawling over sniping) are too weak.

Here is a list of brawling fixes that would help bring balance to the forces:

1. SRM damage to 2.2 per missile
2. ML heat to 3.5
3. Further pulse laser duration reduction: make pulse lasers the "pin point" brawling weapon
4. Increase LB10X damage to 1.2 per pellet, reduce crit bonus proportionately.
5. Increase LL/ERLL/LPL max alpha to 3.

I may have given you sass earlier today in-game, but if your suggestions were implemented, it would fix soooooooo much about the way the game plays vis a vis sniping vs brawling. Would like post again A+++++++++++

p.s. I see I am too late to stop the bawling about how splatcats will make a huge comeback and how we will all regret this etc etc. You know what? When SRMs were getting buffed from 1.5 -> I heard the exact same thing. You know how many splatcats I've seen since then? Three. And they all died terrible deaths, because back when the splatcat was king:

1) The biggest map was caustic valley. Close range was king.
2) PPCs were terrible, and not very many mechs could mount more than one gauss. Closing to SRM range was easy.
3) SRMs were actually dealing up to 18 damge/missile in some rare cases, but almost always more than the 2.5 they were supposed to do. Now that the runaway splash damage has been fixed, the alpha is not nearly as scary now as it was then.
4) SRMs now have heat penalties if you have more than three. The splatcat always ran hot, but it's ******* nuclear with ghost heat.

In short: I don't want to hear any more whining about how one build that was good once but isn't anymore is a valid reason to keep SRMs terrible.

[XFactor777]

It's threads like this that make me glad PGI doesn't listen to us.

[Lefty Lucy]

XFactor777, on 29 August 2013 - 11:55 AM, said:

It's threads like this that make me glad PGI doesn't listen to us.

Very constructive.

[TexAce]

It's nonsense to argue about ANY weapon's damage until hit registration issues have been resolved.
Even PGI doesn't seem to understand that.

[PEEFsmash]

These are all good suggestions by OP.

Edited by PEEFsmash, 29 August 2013 - 12:16 PM.