18 replies to this topic

[Pjwned]

Aside from the obvious shekel sniffing tactics to get people to use MC instead, why am I forced to buy an engine (in addition to weapons that I likely already have) to buy a new mech? Especially with the way mech effiencies work in this game, it is in fact a huge benefit to have at least 3 variants of a given mech, but when c-bills are such a pain in the *** to grind out (which is another topic that I know has been covered extensively) it's really irritating that I have to dump such a large amount of in-game money into something I don't need at all and would only end up selling to partially recover my loss.

The obvious solution is to just let people buy the chassis without the engine, and ideally without the weapons too

Just as a little extra note, making it so the game is a pain in the *** unless I pay money makes me LESS likely to pay and a lot MORE likely to just quit and say screw this game, which is coming closer and closer with the more annoyed I get about how much I need to grind out c-bills in order to play around with new mechs.

[Sug]

*walks to Ford dealership*

Sug: Hi I'd like to buy a 2014 mustang with no engine or wheels please. I'm just going to use the parts off my 2004.

Salesman: Uhm......


But yeah, the economy needs a bit of adjusting.

[Angel of Annihilation]

I have to agree. 99% of the time I end up totally striping the mech down to just the bare chassis so it is kind of worthless to by engines, weapons and equipment I don't need and won't use. This is especialy so with the economy nerf making every C-bills spent a painful experience.

[Pjwned]

Quote

this real life situation is the same as this video game AHHURRRR HURR DURR

I kind of have an issue when I want to buy a new mech variant and I'm forced to buy it with an engine I already have and thus have no use for, even though it takes up a huge chunk of the c-bills required to buy just another VARIANT mech, one that I honestly don't even want to play with but have to if I want my preferred mech variant to be as good as it can be.

I would just join in on the other endless bitching threads about how much it sucks to grind out c-bills in this game and all that nonsense, but I felt this particular issue needed more attention than people seem to give it.

[627]

You buy a fully functional mech and that includes engine, weapons and everything else up to the mech's max tonnage.

You buy the 'stock' mech.

And you won't ever get it another way, doesn't make sense.

Sure, economics could be tweaked a bit these days and yes pgi tries to sell mc-mechs (which is good), but i'm against the possibility to buy an empty chassis.

And besides that all, everytime i buy a new mech, i run at least one match completely stock. Best way to learn the pros and cons.

[Kekrebos]

Normally I wouldn't respond to someone that is being so rude to other people in a discussion with them, but I think you need to understand some basic items you don't seam to grasp.

Free to play games aren't actually free. You have three options. Invest time, invest money, or invest both. If they make the grind too easy, then why spend money? They want money, they are a business. They have children and families to feed. As it stands they are making money. They seam to be pretty happy with that. Why would they make a serious change that would make them not get nearly as much money?

If your change was put in, no one would ever spend MC on a mech again. They'd throw maybe $20 on the game for a bunch of slots, and never a penny more unless a Hero mech caught their eye. You'd seriously cut the grind in more than half.

[Khobai]

Dont buy a mech if you dont like the engine it comes with?

[NoiseCrime]

Rallog, on 09 September 2013 - 03:28 AM, said:

If your change was put in, no one would ever spend MC on a mech again. They'd throw maybe $20 on the game for a bunch of slots, and never a penny more unless a Hero mech caught their eye. You'd seriously cut the grind in more than half.

If they are relying on grinding to make them money they are doing it wrong. I can't think of anything more likely to put me off playing a game. Sure a little grind, is fine, building up xp for incremental bonuses is a good reward structure and helps longevity of a game, but even here MWO seems to be doing it wrong. I've almost mastered 3 mechs of the same type, but in terms of c-bills i'm way off being able to afford anything new. This wouldn't be so bad if I could see some future in the game as I could then justifiably (to myself) purchase mc to cover the difference.

Honestly the grind in this game is not fun and the overall experience ends up getting repetitive. I can't help but feel they have focused completely on the wrong aspects to monetise and the grind simply devalues the experience.

However decoupling the engine and other equipment would unbalance the cost of mechs (as they currently stand), the engine often being the most expensive part. Perhaps a better experience would be enabling players to spec out the engine, or maybe leave it off entirely but it wouldn't be as cost effective, say it saves you 75% of the cost of the stock engine, therefore not as much as getting the mech without an engine, but a little more saved than buying the mech and then selling the engine at 50% cost.

[DaZur]

Okay... PGI provides you access to "boutique mechs"... i.e. Roll-your-own.

You however have to pay rack-rate for your upgrade parts and receive used "blue book" discount for stock parts stripped.

Long and short... you buy what you want but you're going to pay more for it... That's how boutique mechs roll.

Edited by DaZur, 09 September 2013 - 07:24 AM.

[Pjwned]

Rallog, on 09 September 2013 - 03:28 AM, said:

Normally I wouldn't respond to someone that is being so rude to other people in a discussion with them, but I think you need to understand some basic items you don't seam to grasp.

Free to play games aren't actually free. You have three options. Invest time, invest money, or invest both. If they make the grind too easy, then why spend money? They want money, they are a business. They have children and families to feed. As it stands they are making money. They seam to be pretty happy with that. Why would they make a serious change that would make them not get nearly as much money?

If your change was put in, no one would ever spend MC on a mech again. They'd throw maybe $20 on the game for a bunch of slots, and never a penny more unless a Hero mech caught their eye. You'd seriously cut the grind in more than half.

I guess if you're a sheep with no standards then you throw hundreds of dollars at games to alleviate the worthless grind just so you can rationalize having fun with a game's core feature, but when I play a free game I spend money on it because I already enjoy pretty much everything else about it, not to line some company's pockets with shekels because of massive greed. If a game has enough sheep then it's successful enough though, so have fun I guess, I'll be over here not spending any money or recommending the game to anybody else.

Khobai, on 09 September 2013 - 05:40 AM, said:

Dont buy a mech if you dont like the engine it comes with?

Fantastic, I'll just NEVER unlock elite profiencies with any of my favored mech(s) then!

[REDACTED]

DaZur, on 09 September 2013 - 07:22 AM, said:

Okay... PGI provides you access to "boutique mechs"... i.e. Roll-your-own.

You however have to pay rack-rate for your upgrade parts and receive used "blue book" discount for stock parts stripped.

Long and short... you buy what you want but you're going to pay more for it... That's how boutique mechs roll.

You act like customizing your mechs from the crappy stock loadout is ridiculous yet it's supposed to be a big part of the game, why make it so annoying to utilize such a prominent feature other than greed?

Edited by Destined, 13 December 2013 - 07:47 AM.
insults

[IceLom]

Pjwned I agree with your original post that we should be able to purchase barebone mechs.... however i disagree with how much of a jerk you are being so i am torn.... long story short don't be an *** if you want people to take you seriously.

Does no one parent there children anymore?

[Pjwned]

NoiseCrime, on 09 September 2013 - 06:32 AM, said:

However decoupling the engine and other equipment would unbalance the cost of mechs (as they currently stand), the engine often being the most expensive part. Perhaps a better experience would be enabling players to spec out the engine, or maybe leave it off entirely but it wouldn't be as cost effective, say it saves you 75% of the cost of the stock engine, therefore not as much as getting the mech without an engine, but a little more saved than buying the mech and then selling the engine at 50% cost.

I guess I wouldn't mind as much about losing some money (over something that I think is stupid) if I didn't have to pay all of the money up front just to get a new mech chassis. For example, say I want another mech variant but don't need the engine at all, the cost of the mech could be reduced by 50% of the engine's value (ideally more, 75% and preferably 100% but clearly this is an unrealistic expectation) so that I can get to piloting my new mech sooner rather than buying a new mech and immediately selling the most expensive component because I have zero use for it.

IceLom, on 09 September 2013 - 05:01 PM, said:

Pjwned I agree with your original post that we should be able to purchase barebone mechs.... however i disagree with how much of a jerk you are being so i am torn.... long story short don't be an *** if you want people to take you seriously.

Does no one parent there children anymore?

I don't see how "MUH FEELINGS" is contributing anything worthwhile to any discussion ever, but I guess it's good that you agree with my point.

[DaZur]

[OpCentar]

Just be happy they don't charge you for ever engine and other equipment, including weapons, install and removal.

[Kekrebos]

NoiseCrime, on 09 September 2013 - 06:32 AM, said:

If they are relying on grinding to make them money they are doing it wrong. I can't think of anything more likely to put me off playing a game. Sure a little grind, is fine, building up xp for incremental bonuses is a good reward structure and helps longevity of a game, but even here MWO seems to be doing it wrong. I've almost mastered 3 mechs of the same type, but in terms of c-bills i'm way off being able to afford anything new. This wouldn't be so bad if I could see some future in the game as I could then justifiably (to myself) purchase mc to cover the difference.

Honestly the grind in this game is not fun and the overall experience ends up getting repetitive. I can't help but feel they have focused completely on the wrong aspects to monetise and the grind simply devalues the experience.

Are you new to Free to play games? Because thats literally the business model for f2p. Grind or pay. The most popular f2p games, from LoL to WoT and most everything between is grind or pay. The point I was trying to get across is that they need to have a large enough grind to encourage people to pay.

Agree with it or not, they are making money. Its a very successful, proven, model now. They may tweak things from time to time, but I highly doubt if they're making a good amount of money that they are going to change something that cuts the grind in half. It makes absolutely zero business sense.

If you want to look at it from a lore standpoint, then Sug's car comparison above makes great sense.

The only place it makes sense is from a "I want it now, and don't want to work or pay for it" perspective. Seriously the grind in this game isn't bad. There is far far far worse out there.

EDIT: Just wanted to add that I do agree with you about there needing to be more to do at the end of the grind that would encourage people to complete the grind and make it less repetitive. Thats the hope behind Faction warfare.

Edited by Rallog, 10 September 2013 - 04:35 AM.

[DeadlyNerd]

Sug, on 08 September 2013 - 10:28 PM, said:

*walks to Ford dealership*

Sug: Hi I'd like to buy a 2014 mustang with no engine or wheels please. I'm just going to use the parts off my 2004.

Salesman: Uhm......


But yeah, the economy needs a bit of adjusting.

Actually, if I was going to change every bit of that mustang, I'd be buying only the chassis, and probably not off a dealer either, but directly from ford.

[Sug]

DeadlyNerd, on 10 September 2013 - 05:59 AM, said:

Actually, if I was going to change every bit of that mustang, I'd be buying only the chassis, and probably not off a dealer either, but directly from ford.

I don't know anything about cars.

[Name140704]

Pjwned, on 08 September 2013 - 10:13 PM, said:

Aside from the obvious shekel sniffing tactics to get people to use MC instead, why am I forced to buy an engine (in addition to weapons that I likely already have) to buy a new mech? Especially with the way mech effiencies work in this game, it is in fact a huge benefit to have at least 3 variants of a given mech, but when c-bills are such a pain in the *** to grind out (which is another topic that I know has been covered extensively) it's really irritating that I have to dump such a large amount of in-game money into something I don't need at all and would only end up selling to partially recover my loss.

The obvious solution is to just let people buy the chassis without the engine, and ideally without the weapons too

Just as a little extra note, making it so the game is a pain in the *** unless I pay money makes me LESS likely to pay and a lot MORE likely to just quit and say screw this game, which is coming closer and closer with the more annoyed I get about how much I need to grind out c-bills in order to play around with new mechs.

It's about selling MCs to buy mechs. That's why.

[Pjwned]

NARCoMAN, on 10 September 2013 - 08:08 AM, said:

It's about selling MCs to buy mechs. That's why.

I guess if you have a legion of people already throwing money at the game then it doesn't matter if new players get pissed off and quit before buying a single thing with MC.

>PGI logic

OpCentar, on 09 September 2013 - 11:05 PM, said:

J-Just be h-happy that th-they use l-lube while pillaging your ***.

http://en.wikipedia....rationalization