16 replies to this topic

[Recon777]

Quick question before I start buying mechs and equipment.

If I buy a stock mech, and swap out its euipment for other stuff, do I still get to keep the original equipment or do I have to sell it? Do I essentially get a "warehouse" of parts that I can pick and choose from, which I own, when configuring a mech? Or do I always need to buy (at full price) and sell (at half price) every time I want to change something?

Also, if I want two variants that are mostly similar, does this mean I need to actually buy two mechs and duplicates of all those parts, or can I save variants based on the parts and chassis that I own, and just swap between one and the other at will?

For me, most of the fun of Mechwarrior 4 back in the day (I bought all three expansions) was in all the tinkering and variant building. I must have made 60+ variants that I enjoyed. I'm hoping this game lets me do something similar. The F2P model is fairly restrictive of this, of course, because each and every part must be earned. I'm hoping though, that I can earn the part, and once I earn it, I own it and can use it wherever I want without buying it again.

[Lord Baldric]

You own the parts from each mech you buy. If you go to sell a mech there is a check box to sell its current equipped parts as well.

Each mech comes with its own equipment. You can sell the parts off one variant and then swap parts between the various mechs as you see fit.

You cant sell ammo. Once you own it that's it. You also cannot sell back upgrades. Endo-steel, ferro armor, Dual Heat sinks, artemis are all money sinks and cannot be traded between mechs or sold.

Not sure if they add to the resale value as i never bothered to check.

Modules can be moved between mechs and can be sold.

Edited by Lord Baldric, 17 September 2013 - 06:58 PM.

[Watchit]

It's a little confusing because of the u.i. but pretty much the list of items you can buy on your right has a little number in the top right indicating how many of those items you own and not currently in use. You only sell items by selecting them and pressing the sell button. Dragging them off your mech doesn't sell them.

[Recon777]

Ok so you own all the equipment and chassis. That's good. Now what about variants? Like lets say that I have a chassis which I sometimes configure one way and sometimes another. Can I configure a variant based on chassis and equipment and save it as a setting? Then, if I want to configure the same chassis a different way, can I just load up that different setting and go play with it? Or do I need to buy TWO chassis and all the equipment for both, in order to make variants? That would get really expensive, really fast. I might have 6 different ways that I want to configure a particular chassis, but I certainly don't want to buy six mech bays and six chassis, and lots of duplicate equipment just to be able to do this.

[Krivvan]

Your question was slightly confusing at first since variants are what different versions of a mech (in terms of innate hardpoints) are called. The different variants not only have different stock loadouts, but have different hardpoints and other attributes such as torso twist angles.

Unfortunately no, there is no way to save a loadout for a mech, although most tend to find a build that works and stick with it for a while only making small modifications. Some third party services exist for saving mech loadouts, but you'll have to rebuild the mechs manually: http://mwo.smurfy-net.de/mechlab

Edited by Krivvan, 17 September 2013 - 09:51 PM.

[Johnny Reb]

Krivvan, on 17 September 2013 - 09:50 PM, said:

Your question was slightly confusing at first since variants are what different versions of a mech (in terms of innate hardpoints) are called. The different variants not only have different stock loadouts, but have different hardpoints and other attributes such as torso twist angles.

Unfortunately no, there is no way to save a loadout for a mech, although most tend to find a build that works and stick with it for a while only making small modifications. Some third party services exist for saving mech loadouts, but you'll have to rebuild the mechs manually: http://mwo.smurfy-net.de/mechlab

This!

[Recon777]

Ahh. yes I did notice that there are "variants" of a mech chassis in this game, where my experience comes from Mechwarrior 4, where we designed "variants" but which would be more what you would call "loadouts". I very much enjoyed the tinkering in that game, and I tried pretty hard just a day ago to get the game working again on my computer without much success.

In this game, I was hoping to do the same kind of tinkering, but a concern I have with the F2P model, is that making small changes is going to be extremely costly in terms of cbills. For example, if I wanted to take a Catapult K2 and fit it with Gauss cannons, I could stick 2 Medium Lasers on it with the XL 300 engine. However if I wanted to upgrade to Medium Pulse Lasers, I could do this by sacrificing a bit of speed and putting in a slightly smaller engine. Doing something like this in MWO would require the purchase of a whole other engine which is a fairly expensive "tweak" if you get my meaning. I did see the smurfy site, which is where I figured out that this modification would work, however it would be impossible to "try out" the modification without grinding for ages. That seems to be the nature of this F2P model.

Its too bad there's no way to save a loadout. That would be a very good feature for them to add.

Edited by Recon777, 18 September 2013 - 02:22 AM.

[Aym]

Yes, it's expensive, but you keep the engine so you can swap that engine into any other mech. The only changes that get expensive are Endo-Steel and Ferro Fibrous armor, sometims Artemis, if you swap back and forth in configurations, otherwise you'll quickly find yourself using a few standard engine sizes and swapping them back and forth between mechs. For instance the XL 300 is easily the most commonly used engine in Jenners, Catapults, Highlanders, Cataphracts, and some other builds like Quickdraws and Dragons, although I prefer a faster Dragon.

[Redshift2k5]

engines are pricy, but that's true to the source material.

the longer you play, the more spare parts you'll have at your disposal. mechs and engines can be expensive, but once you get them they're yours forever. Once you get a stable of mechs you enjoy, saving will be a breeze- just play and enjoy and you'll make millions!

[Recon777]

Hmm, ok I can see how that would slowly build you up to a point where you work toward having "all the things" and a fully stocked workshop of tinker-fun. Too bad about the endo steel and ferro fibrous being non-swappable. Oh well. I have much to learn, clearly. Like why is the same size engine able to power an assault or light mech? I'll be studying the equipment next I suppose, in anticipating what to buy for my first mech. I was thinking K2 but the loadout I'm interested in costs 7m more than I have. On the other hand, I could straight-up purchase the stock version right now I suppose.

Thanks for the info.

[Krivvan]

Recon777, on 18 September 2013 - 03:35 AM, said:

Like why is the same size engine able to power an assault or light mech?

It's the same engine, but the effects will be different depending on what mech you put it in. Put an XL 300 in a light Jenner and it can go 138 kph - 153 kph. Put that same engine in an assault Atlas and it goes 50 kph.

Edited by Krivvan, 18 September 2013 - 04:07 AM.

[Bront]

Basically any equipment you buy, either via buying a mech, or equiping it, means you will own that piece of equipment. These include modules, weapons, equipment like heat sinks, EMC, and Beagle, as well as engines. This even applies to armor, as once you buy armor, if you later strip some of it off, you don't have to rebuy it. Also keep in mind that though the mechs, you'll build up a surplus of some weapons (*cough* medium lasers *cough*), and while it's nice to have a stockpile, you can occasionally sell them if you need to. I think I sold 15 MLs one day because that left me with 10 spares.

What you DO have to re-pay for is some structural changes. These are 4 items: Internal Structure (Standard or Endo-Steel), Heat Sink Type (Single or Double), Armor Type (Standard or FF), and Guidence (Standard or Artemis IV). Internal Structure is just that, and makes sense. Heat Sink Type is a little odd, but think of it as converting the entire cooling system core, so it's like replumbing a mech (And yes, Single and Double Heat Sinks that you place in a mech are purchased separately). Ferro-Fiberous (FF) is mounting a new type of armor. If you don't have any actual FF armor laying around, you have to pay for that too, otherwise you just pay for changing the mounts. It's I think the cheapest thing to change, but I'd avoid it if you can. Finally, adding or removing the Artemis IV is fairly expensive. I generally avoid mounting it unless I'm 100% sure I want it, as it's not always useful on a build. You'll also have to buy special Artemis ammo for your missiles.

[Sadistic Savior]

Recon777, on 17 September 2013 - 06:43 PM, said:

Quick question before I start buying mechs and equipment.

If I buy a stock mech, and swap out its euipment for other stuff, do I still get to keep the original equipment or do I have to sell it?

It is generally not a good idea to sell equipment, as you will get only a small fraction of the original cost back. But yes, you can liquidate any equipment you own, including pre-installed equipment.

You cannot "sell" structural enhancements however. So Artemis, Double heat Sinks, Endo, Ferro, ect...that stuff is 100% loss, and in fact you will even have to pay additional to go back to stock.

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Do I essentially get a "warehouse" of parts that I can pick and choose from

Yes, but it is not an actual warehouse. It will just show up in the normal list. If you have 3 AC/20s, you would just equip them as if they were new, but if you already own some, you will not be charged. The list will have numbers on it...if the number is greater than zero, it means you have some of that item in stock.

There is no separate warehouse screen though. All the tracking is done through the normal list where you purchase items.

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Also, if I want two variants that are mostly similar, does this mean I need to actually buy two mechs and duplicates of all those parts

Yes. You cannot buy naked mechs. All mechs have stock parts installed by default. This is true whether you buy with cash (MC) or CBILLs.

You can strip parts off one mech and put them on another at will. Just drag them back to your purchase list and they will go into your inventory and you can put them on whatever mech you want.

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For me, most of the fun of Mechwarrior 4 back in the day (I bought all three expansions) was in all the tinkering and variant building.

You can do that here too, within reason. You will be limited by hardpoints, and some mechs cannot mount certain items (very few mechs can mount ECM for example, and I think only one can mount more than one AMS).

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I must have made 60+ variants that I enjoyed. I'm hoping this game lets me do something similar.

It does, but mechs are expensive. And you will need a bay for all of them. Getting 60 will take a while and cost some money.

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The F2P model is fairly restrictive of this

Deliberately so. The F2P model really has nothing to do with it. This game is intended to be close to the original table top version. MW4 was a stripped down version of the table top game. Mechs are expensive and hard to get in the MW universe...they are not pokemon you can collect and mount like trophies. The idea is that you can find a few you can customize to your specific playstyle.

Unlike MW4 though, every mech in this game is equally useful. They all have strengths and weaknesses. It is not a race to the Assault mechs...I have seen assault mechs have their @sses handed to them by a light. There is no hierarchy of mechs here as there is in most other mech games.

Edited by Sadistic Savior, 18 September 2013 - 06:50 AM.

[chevy42083]

I too had hoped to "save" a load out, as it would be VERY nice. Especially if I start tweaking, but want to go back to what worked. It gets even harder when trying to track armor points to get to a required weight to fit what you want.

In the end, I understand that it could be very hard to implement since many of the parts would be on other mechs. That would be easy to remedy when dealing with 4 mech bays... not so much to those that have invested lots of money/time and have a whole drop-ship full of mechs. For them "Sorry, you don't have xxxx part"... would mean searching through an installed inventory... which only gets harder when it's multiple parts.

Personally, I bought the stock mech and started using it (with a few borrowed weapons)... to start collecting the xp, learn as I went, and upgraded as needed. Then again, yes, you won't be in the strongest mech. But it gave me something to switch around to. It helped that both were missile mechs, so I had ammo and weapons to transfer over while earning the armor/heatsinks/endostructure.


Also, one mechs stock weapons may be an upgrade for a smaller mech (lasers, engines, etc). OR... you may want to put in that lighter part to make room for something else (say you want more ammo/armor/or dual heavy weapons)... so be cautious with selling. I've often swapped back to the smaller stock engine in my LRM catapult, just to add ammo and have the option of raining LRMs the whole match... the goal being to run out of ammo while running at the final enemy mech.

Edited by chevy42083, 18 September 2013 - 07:11 AM.

[Aym]

There MAY be a "save loadout" option in UI 2.0 coming in a few months (give or take, depending on development). Not sure if you'll have to have the equipment in your inventory to make us of it, which seems likely so it'll be marginally useful unless it auto-strips it off of other mechs... Who knows, PGI definitely wants you to buy mechs with MC and premium time though so I don't think they'll make it TOO easy and convenient to swap stuff around, there has to be some incentive to spend real money after all, and not just on camo and mechbays sadly.

[DEMAX51]

Aym, on 18 September 2013 - 08:01 AM, said:

There MAY be a "save loadout" option in UI 2.0 coming in a few months (give or take, depending on development). Not sure if you'll have to have the equipment in your inventory to make us of it, which seems likely so it'll be marginally useful unless it auto-strips it off of other mechs... Who knows, PGI definitely wants you to buy mechs with MC and premium time though so I don't think they'll make it TOO easy and convenient to swap stuff around, there has to be some incentive to spend real money after all, and not just on camo and mechbays sadly.

Unfortunately, I do not think this will happen. I think they would rather have people buy multiples of the same variant (which also encourages people to purchase more mechbays). I believe this point was raised during an interview Creative Director Bryan Ekman gave with the No Guts No Galaxy podcast, and he made it sound as though this sort of "easy button" would not be happening. It would be very nice, though.

[AlmightyAeng]

Recon777, on 18 September 2013 - 03:35 AM, said:

Hmm, ok I can see how that would slowly build you up to a point where you work toward having "all the things" and a fully stocked workshop of tinker-fun. Too bad about the endo steel and ferro fibrous being non-swappable. Oh well. I have much to learn, clearly. Like why is the same size engine able to power an assault or light mech? I'll be studying the equipment next I suppose, in anticipating what to buy for my first mech. I was thinking K2 but the loadout I'm interested in costs 7m more than I have. On the other hand, I could straight-up purchase the stock version right now I suppose.

Thanks for the info.

Recon, I feel your pain! Before you have 'all the things' if you just want to experiment with what you can make go here:

You can tinker around and create builds on Smurfy's...LOTS of us mechwarriors go there to play around with ideas, and sometimes to post links to the builds we create!