139 replies to this topic

[Skadi]

Luke Garrad, on 14 June 2012 - 04:15 PM, said:

Hear me out here guys. Why not a mech that can turn into a apache helicopter, think I have solved it. And maybe they could make a good classic tv show but make sure its not ruined in future

Sounds legit

[Bandaids]

Skadi, on 14 June 2012 - 04:22 PM, said:

Sounds legit

HAHAHA this made my evening

Edited by Bandaids, 14 June 2012 - 04:24 PM.

[Torcip]

It's kind of like what happened to the Battleships, these massive ships armed to the teeth with gigantic guns were impressive and all, but just could not do much against aircraft or smaller and faster boats that didn't have the same kind of firepower but had enough to bring down the much more heavily armored battleship. SO taking that into account with how much it cost to maintain these behemoths it just wasn't practical.

[Tterrag]

Why a helicopter and not a jet...cough or maybe one with large anti aircraft guns for arms...cough

[Gnatter]

How about this:



There is even a video here:
http://blog.machinef...walking-tractor

[EyeOne]

There is also the point that mechs in BT work because it's built into the culture and everyone follows a certain set of war rules. If anything is game then mechs would lose.

[Skadi]

Gnatter, on 14 June 2012 - 04:28 PM, said:

How about this:



There is even a video here:
http://blog.machinef...walking-tractor

[BenEEeees VAT GROWN BACON]

Man, if humanity ever developed galaxy wide space empires war would be dictated by interstellar navies with orbital bombardment capability.

It'll be like today, first side that achieves air superiority gets to move freely while the other side has to hunker down. If Mechs can be made cost-efficiently they might serve as mechanised infantry, but they'll likely be small Elementals rather than lumbering assault-class targets.

[Tterrag]

EyeOne, on 14 June 2012 - 04:29 PM, said:

There is also the point that mechs in BT work because it's built into the culture and everyone follows a certain set of war rules. If anything is game then mechs would lose.

Hmmm I suppose at one point in history most "civilized" armies felt the need to get on neat little lines and shoot each other

[Tterrag]

I'd see to the fact that mobility is god when your trying to get in dominate and get out since no one in there right mind want is to be in a trench. I would imagine that if and when mass space travel is used the first one to destroy the opposing fleet will be the victor. that is assuming that orbital bombardment would be the natural way to pacify ground forces.

[BenEEeees VAT GROWN BACON]

Tterrag, on 14 June 2012 - 04:32 PM, said:

Hmmm I suppose at one point in history most "civilized" armies felt the need to get on neat little lines and shoot each other

That was the best way to bear a large volume of fire down onto an enemy with the given technology back then. It was effective and it won battles.

The best point in time to exemplify when culture did not keep up with technology was probably during World War 1. Artillery was ineffectively used, troops marched to their deaths en-mass against machine-gun fire and a stalemate soon developed because defences could hardly be penetrated.

The point here is that when technology is ineffectively used, warfare becomes more wasteful, attrition-centric and generally inconclusive.

You can even argue now with asymmetrical warfare employed by poorer nations that war-culture has not outpaced technology when a $15 IED can rival the effective damage of a $2 million missile.

Edited by BenEEeees VAT GROWN BACON, 14 June 2012 - 04:40 PM.

[Ramien]

I'm thinking 'Mech sports. 'Mechs could replace football (both/all versions) players, race car drivers - NASCAR would be a lot more interesting if the "Cars" could reach out and yank the leader back to try and move ahead.

We could even start the Solaris VII games right here on Earth!

[frankyes]

I believe everyone is thinking too small and underrating omnimechs. Sure there's airsupport, sure they are tall. But remember omnimech fantasy was being thought about in the late 80's and slowly progressed through a story to now and not being updated to today technological standards and more intriguingly 1000 years from now. I don't want to overthrow everyone here but you can't think of these things as walking tanks that you saw in MW2, 3, and 4. You have to see them as almost transformers like.

Let's get perspective in place. We now talk about regenerative armor, stealth technology, gyroscopic movement, heavy lasers and PPCs; technology we know of now. What about the robots that can maneuver over rocks, carry heavy loads, and navigate to a destination without a pilot. Next let's think about a cheetah or a professional Olympic runner. Think about how they maneuver between and over obstacles, leaning and gripping on the ground to get around trees, rocks, and debris. Also equip that runner with some autocannons, med lasers, and SSRMs. Next dropship a bushwacker, centurion, raven, and uziel at night behind enemy lines undetected. They rush through and reap havoc taking on an entire base or city with no effort. Auto tracking/targeting, thermal vision, regenerative armor, auto sensing movement so they the pilot has no problem running at full throttle through a city. Fluid movement on the guns to take on targets as the gyroscope keeps it stable. Tanks are being destroyed, infantry killed by MG fire. Undetected with raven ECM and ECCM. City conquered, base destroyed.

Sure it's not gonna be a walk in the park, limbs will be lost on the omnimechs, ammo will run dry, maybe a mech won't come back. But to act alone as a single strike unit with only four weapons platforms? You can't put a price on that.

[Tterrag]

BenEEeees VAT GROWN BACON, on 14 June 2012 - 04:39 PM, said:

That was the best way to bear a large volume of fire down onto an enemy with the given technology back then. It was effective and it won battles.

The best point in time to exemplify when culture did not keep up with technology was probably during World War 1. Artillery was ineffectively used, troops marched to their deaths en-mass against machine-gun fire and a stalemate soon developed because defences could hardly be penetrated.

The point here is that when technology is ineffectively used, warfare becomes more wasteful, attrition-centric and generally inconclusive.

You can even argue now with asymmetrical warfare employed by poorer nations that war-culture has not outpaced technology when a $15 IED can rival the effective damage of a $2 million missile.

A fair valid and unpleasant point

[Frostiken]

BenEEeees VAT GROWN BACON, on 14 June 2012 - 04:39 PM, said:

You can even argue now with asymmetrical warfare employed by poorer nations that war-culture has not outpaced technology when a $15 IED can rival the effective damage of a $2 million missile.

Well, there's a lot there you're not considering.

A rock can do as much damage as a bullet, it's just a matter of hitting someone in the head with it hard enough.

Regarding the missile, yeah, against a tank sure. But most of our weapons technology is leveraged towards precision so we aren't blowing up everyone and everything around what we shoot at, whereas the people with IEDs are animals who don't care about civilian life. Look at Libya, and what a masterwork of precision-guided munitions that was.

[Axelian]

Mining, pretty sure they already have entirely robotic tyre change stations for 50T dump trucks. How about underwater construction.

As for how the thread turned into the value of a mech in 'real' combat. Well none of you know your history very well at all. What are big and solid and cross rivers and are vitally important to mechanised armies quick advances? What joints found in the legs enable pop up attacks? Also in actual primitive robot fighting the value of the ability to self right is massive.

Here is an even more critical question. What substance found in a Battlemech's skeleton enables battlemech technology? Sad that on a forum dedicated to the game nobody mentions MYOMER MUSCLE.

[Tterrag]

Arthas Latstrong, on 14 June 2012 - 04:41 PM, said:

I believe everyone is thinking too small and underrating omnimechs. Sure there's airsupport, sure they are tall. But remember omnimech fantasy was being thought about in the late 80's and slowly progressed through a story to now and not being updated to today technological standards and more intriguingly 1000 years from now. I don't want to overthrow everyone here but you can't think of these things as walking tanks that you saw in MW2, 3, and 4. You have to see them as almost transformers like.

Let's get perspective in place. We now talk about regenerative armor, stealth technology, gyroscopic movement, heavy lasers and PPCs; technology we know of now. What about the robots that can maneuver over rocks, carry heavy loads, and navigate to a destination without a pilot. Next let's think about a cheetah or a professional Olympic runner. Think about how they maneuver between and over obstacles, leaning and gripping on the ground to get around trees, rocks, and debris. Also equip that runner with some autocannons, med lasers, and SSRMs. Next dropship a bushwacker, centurion, raven, and uziel at night behind enemy lines undetected. They rush through and reap havoc taking on an entire base or city with no effort. Auto tracking/targeting, thermal vision, regenerative armor, auto sensing movement so they the pilot has no problem running at full throttle through a city. Fluid movement on the guns to take on targets as the gyroscope keeps it stable. Tanks are being destroyed, infantry killed by MG fire. Undetected with raven ECM and ECCM. City conquered, base destroyed.

Sure it's not gonna be a walk in the park, limbs will be lost on the omnimechs, ammo will run dry, maybe a mech won't come back. But to act alone as a single strike unit with only four weapons platforms? You can't put a price on that.

a fair point of view

[0siris]

They'd make cool statues for out in front of shops

[Skadi]

Ramien, on 14 June 2012 - 04:40 PM, said:

I'm thinking 'Mech sports. 'Mechs could replace football (both/all versions) players, race car drivers - NASCAR would be a lot more interesting if the "Cars" could reach out and yank the leader back to try and move ahead.

We could even start the Solaris VII games right here on Earth!

Atlas boxing WOOT

[Frostiken]

It'd make those stupid Robot Wars shows more fun.